Favorite War Room poster

Jack V Savage said:
Mir was wildly overrated when people were trying to suggest he was one of the best HWs in the world (after his first win over Nog). That goes back to the MMA media's frustration with the state of the HW division (with most of the best HWs not in the UFC, which had almost all of the top fighters in every other division) as well as promotional propaganda. But I don't think that lasted too long. Mir opened at even odds against Nelson and closed as a slight favorite, which suggests that he was properly rated at that time. And obviously, after we saw the results of Mir vs. some of the guys I thought he'd lose to (Overeem, Barnett, and Cormier) and the success of guys like Werdum and AA, it's pretty clear in retrospect that Mir was a decent fighter but not one of the best HWs in the world. There are still some people who think that he's like a top-10 all-time HW, but I don't think that's a majority view or anything.

I did bet on Hunt, but not much. On the one hand, I didn't think Mir matched up well there, but on the other, I have very little confidence in Hunt against any decent fighter. Hunt was a slight favorite (-150 or something), which was appropriate.
Click to expand...

I question whether you've watched a UFC event in the last 10 years. This may or may not be your fault (if you are blind, are a bot, or have some cognitive disability) but anyone who's followed your HW posting (I can attest since Jan 2007 and reading thousands of your posts there) will whole-heartedly agree that there is something very strange about your onion-paper-thin perception of the sport and its history. I can't help but call you out because you insist on wading in with your usual illusion of understanding about said topic.

Sorry, but what I said is true.
 
dontsnitch said:
I don't like looking at wins and losses in a vacuum. I like looking at percentages and not results. Mir may have won both fights, but what would you set the line at in a 2012 rematch?
Click to expand...

TKO'd him the first time, broke his arm in a zombie state the second time.

Probably not very close.
 
KONE said:
TKO'd him the first time, broke his arm in a zombie state the second time.

Probably not very close.
Click to expand...

See, I disagree. I don't think that's a good way to look at it. Mir was close to TKOd in the second fight. If they fight 100 times, I don't think he wins 90 of them as you're implying. He doesn't rip Nog's arm off every time. He get's KOd a bunch of times, he loses to decision a bunch of times.
 
dontsnitch said:
See, I disagree. I don't think that's a good way to look at it. Mir was close to TKOd in the second fight. If they fight 100 times, I don't think he wins 90 of them as you're implying. He doesn't rip Nog's off arm every time. He get's KOd a bunch of times, he loses to decision a bunch of times.
Click to expand...

I know what you're saying. Still don't agree though. Mir's standup is better. Mir has more power. Mir doesn't have as much mileage as Nog (though he's starting to get surprisingly close), and Mir's ground game is good enough to nullify Nogueira's if not moreso. Nogueira also looked fucking awful in almost every fight he had after Mir too (since you mentioned the rematch being in 2012)

It just depends on if he comes out and inexplicably looks like shit like he did in the 2nd fight. That being said though, Nog came out as inspired as you can possibly be while Mir looked more passive than anyone had seen from him in a long time and Nogueira still couldn't get the job done.
 
dontsnitch said:
I don't like looking at wins and losses in a vacuum. I like looking at percentages and not results. Mir may have won both fights, but what would you set the line at in a 2012 rematch?
Click to expand...

Mir would win easily, would be the favourite (not sure about a line).

Regardless, I've been around the block with Jack so many times regarding Mir and a slew of other mma topics I can't stomach it anymore. Things like calling Mir heartless right after he gets his face smashed in for the better part of a round before knee-barring Lesnar - literally like he hadn't seen the fight.

No joke, it was like some never saw Mir after Marcio Cruz or something. There was this lasting image of gassing Mir that people could never shake. SO not right.
 
Last edited:
KONE said:
I know what you're saying. Still don't agree though. Mir's standup is better. Mir has more power. Mir doesn't have as much mileage as Nog (though he's starting to get surprisingly close), and Mir's ground game is good enough to nullify Nogueira's if not moreso. Nogueira also looked fucking awful in almost every fight he had after Mir too (since you mentioned the rematch being in 2012)

It just depends on if he comes out and inexplicably looks like shit like he did in the 2nd fight. That being said though, Nog came out as inspired as you can possibly be while Mir looked more passive than anyone had seen from him in a long time and Nogueira still couldn't get the job done.
Click to expand...

I say 2012, but what I really want to say is if we travel back in time and make them fight again in 2011. I would personally make Nog a small favourite, and I think Nog KOs him more times than he gets KOd.

I'm not saying Mir sucks, I'm just saying that looking at wins and losses is not the end-all of a person's talent, and I think because of that perspective, people rate him higher than they should. Keep in mind that some people were saying he was top 5.
 
In The Name Of said:
Mir would win easily, would be the favourite (not sure about a line).

Regardless, I've been around the block with Jack so many times regarding Mir and a slew of other mma topics I can't stomach it anymore. Things like calling Mir heartless right after he gets his face smashed in for the better part of a round before heal-hooking - literally like he hadn't seen the fight.

No joke, it was like some never saw Mir after Marcio Cruz or something. There was like
Click to expand...

Let me ask you an unrelated question just to see what you think.

If we travel back in time and set the line for the McGregor/Aldo fight, what would you set it at. This is pretending that they never fought, but knowing how the fight went down, if that makes sense.

I also never cared for people talking trash about every fighter after they lost, it's one of the reasons I can't stomach the Heavies.
 
Thurisaz said:
Yeah, that fight was Nog's to lose and he managed to pull it off. That was sad after the shellacking he gave.
Click to expand...

I'd have to rewatch it since I never had the heart to go back a second time, but while watching it live I remember thinking the ref, Big John(?) did him a disservice by telling him to not hit the back of the head when Mir was almost out, and forced Nog to shift positions where he ended up getting caught.
 
Thames said:
Auch.. He called your argument bizzare? Don't leave me hanging, did he get dubs or what? Must have been an awful experience for you.
Click to expand...

Are you speaking to it being a subtle jab or no jab at all? Sounds like you're saying one should suck it up, which indicates you agree with me it's what some folks call a "slight". Please tell me more ESL-boy. :p
 
Ps. I've always liked and defend Mir. Dude will fight anybody and has always had a decent chance of beating anybody.
 
dontsnitch said:
I say 2012, but what I really want to say is if we travel back in time and make them fight again in 2011. I would personally make Nog a small favourite, and I think Nog KOs him more times than he gets KOd.

I'm not saying Mir sucks, I'm just saying that looking at wins and losses is not the end-all of a person's talent, and I think because of that perspective, people rate him higher than they should. Keep in mind that some people were saying he was top 5.
Click to expand...

No I get it. A decent amount of his fights post-accident aren't "dominant" wins. It's not like a JDS win where he beats you up and drops you multiple times. It's sudden and violent, and he might've been losing beforehand. But he gets the win. Either that or nothing of note happens and then he pulls off a finish, like vs Kongo and Bigfoot.

I really wonder how good he would've been if he didn't get into his motorcycle wreck. A HW with explosiveness, KO power and bone breaking subs. Damn. Losing out a couple years of your prime has to really fucking suck too.

dontsnitch said:
I'd have to rewatch it since I never had the heart to go back a second time, but while watching it live I remember thinking the ref, Big John(?) did him a disservice by telling him to not hit the back of the head when Mir was almost out, and forced Nog to shift positions where he ended up getting caught.
Click to expand...

It was Herb
 
Funny thing is, I'm not even much of a Mir "fan" (or didn't used to be), but there is absolutely no way (as in zero) to deny his greatness in the sport's HW division. EASILY, EASILY a top 5 HW all time. EASILY. It could be argued top 3 and even #2 after Fedor. I mean it is that stark a reality.
 
In The Name Of said:
No he didn't. Ask Natman (if he'll respond to a pm lol), and others who know the scoop on JVS.
Click to expand...
Natman was an idiot. I still remember arguing with him that Brock would take Mir down. He said it was suicide to take down a black belt of Brock's calibre and that Brock would outstrike Mir. I knew Brock couldnt strike for shit even back then.

JVS handed out justice to those HW posters.
 
KONE said:
No I get it. A decent amount of his fights post-accident aren't "dominant" wins. It's not like a JDS win where he beats you up and drops you multiple times. It's sudden and violent, and he might've been losing beforehand. But he gets the win. Either that or nothing of note happens and then he pulls off a finish, like vs Kongo and Bigfoot.

I really wonder how good he would've been if he didn't get into his motorcycle wreck. A HW with explosiveness, KO power and bone breaking subs. Damn. Losing out a couple years of your prime has to really fucking suck too.



It was Herb
Click to expand...

Yeah, a lot of people resist that thought process. It's why I think MMA is the only real sport left that you can make money on.

That's the problem with only having one chance to do things. We can't know what could have happened. Perhaps if he never gets in that accident he dominates.
 
In The Name Of said:
Funny thing is, I'm not even much of a Mir "fan" (or didn't used to be), but there is absolutely no way (as in zero) to deny his greatness in the sport's HW division. EASILY, EASILY a top 5 HW all time. EASILY. It could be argued top 3 and even #2 after Fedor. I mean it is that stark a reality.
Click to expand...

Alright, lemme see your top 5 list.
 
Cubo de Sangre said:
Are you speaking to it being a subtle jab or no jab at all? Sounds like you're saying one should suck it up, which indicates you agree with me it's what some folks call a "slight". Please tell me more ESL-boy. :p
Click to expand...

I would call it an ear flick.
 
Thames said:
I would call it an ear flick.
Click to expand...

Better or worse?

chin_flick.jpg
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Latest posts

Forum statistics

Threads
1,280,530
Messages
58,293,959
Members
175,997
Latest member
WingedC

Share this page

Back
Top