Don't you appreciate Mike Tyson so much more?

[LEWIS540]

VERY different era but yeah, Marciano came in around 185 for his biggest fights.

Marciano would likely have to fight at LHW (175) or super MW (167) in today's boxing world... and he would still have consistent reach disadvantage at those weight classes.

View attachment 972628 View attachment 972629

Sure, still 2 of the top 3 HWs today in Usyk and Wilder tend to fight at a similar weight to Mike Tyson.

 

[jeff7b9]

Sure, still 2 of the top 3 HWs today in Usyk and Wilder tend to fight at a similar weight to Mike Tyson.

Usyk at 222 would absolutely dwarf Marciano at 185.

6'7 deontay Wilder would make Rocky literally look like a midget.

 

[LEWIS540]

Marciano wasn't fighting guys the size of Frank Bruno tbf sir.

Probably the most overrated HWs, sure.

Point is, whilst Tyson was a relatively small HW ATG, he wasn’t the only one. And plenty of them had to fight giants, too.

 

[LEWIS540]

Usyk at 222 would absolutely dwarf Marciano at 185.

6'7 deontay Wilder would make Rocky literally look like a midget.

Yes.

What’s your point?

Comparing them to Tyson.

 

[jeff7b9]

Yes.

What’s your point?

Initial post was discussing the vast change since Marciano era.


As to your secondary point, I think there is a significant diminishing return past around 225 pounds and a highly technical and athletic smaller HW may always be able to have success, but it is going to be the exception rather than the rule from the last 30 years and moving forward.

-----

Tyson was a hell of a fighter, and took out many guys that had 5 inches in height and 20+ pounds on him. Absolutle specimen in his prime but I don't think the peek a boo style was sustainable physically.
No coincidence imo that both of Cus's fighters that won HW titles with that style did it young.

Wilder probably has the best ko punch in HW history. Criminally underrated

 

[kenetics]

Looking how Jones had to beef up 50 pounds over 3 years to fight in the HW division and very few people dare to do this in the UFC,, I appreciate Tyson so much more as small HW who basically weighed in at around 220 on fight night, which is what the LHWs now coming in at. And he fought these guys who were monsters compared to him and KOed most of them.

I personally have a much deeper appreciation for him and still can't think of anyone who is more exciting in combat sports.

Somewhat. Problem with Tyson is that he lost all the time to the top guys when they fought.

 

[StonedLemur]

Probably the most overrated HWs, sure.

Point is, whilst Tyson was a relatively small HW ATG, he wasn’t the only one. And plenty of them had to fight giants, too.

Jack Dempsey is the ultimate small heavyweight.
Harry Greb was a middleweight knocking out heavyweights, and he had one eye.

 

[LEWIS540]

Initial post was discussing the vast change since Marciano era.


As to your secondary point, I think there is a significant diminishing return past around 225 pounds and a highly technical and athletic smaller HW may always be able to have success, but it is going to be the exception rather than the rule from the last 30 years and moving forward.

-----

Tyson was a hell of a fighter, and took out many guys that had 5 inches in height and 20+ pounds on him. Absolutle specimen in his prime but I don't think the peek a boo style was sustainable physically.
No coincidence imo that both of Cus's fighters that won HW titles with that style did it young.

Wilder probably has the best ko punch in HW history.

Basically agree, yeah.

Tyson was very good, no doubt, but at the same time he developed something of a cult of personality as well.

Wilder is a difficult one to judge. Great punch, obviously, but who’re his best wins? Ruiz?

 

[rstringer]

Mike Tyson had the easiest strength of schedule of any elite combat sports fighter in history, tbh.

He was the ultimate can crusher, but his style and the timing of his run was the perfect storm for making him an icon.

If he was fighting right now, he’d have a bunch of haters all over social media complaining about his can crushing.

can crusher? wtf you talking about?

 

[LEWIS540]

Jack Dempsey is the ultimate small heavyweight.
Harry Greb was a middleweight knocking out heavyweights, and he had one eye.

Now that really was a different time! Wasn’t even allowed to fight black fellahs.

Don’t think anyone would seriously think Dempsey would stand a chance against the likes of Louis, Ali and Foreman let alone giants like Klitchko, Lennox or Fury.

 

[kenetics]

can crusher? wtf you talking about?

Tyson lost to all the top hw he faced. Spinks was the only one he beat who had a name . Spinks also was a small hw that moved up from smaller weight class.

 

[LEWIS540]

Tyson lost to all the top hw he faced. Spinks was the only one he beat who had a name . Spinks also was a small hw that moved up from smaller weight class.

Larry Holmes, who?

Inb4 he was 54 years old.

 

[StonedLemur]

Now that really was a different time! Wasn’t even allowed to fight black fellahs.

Don’t think anyone would seriously think Dempsey would stand a chance against the likes of Louis, Ali and Foreman let alone giants like Klitchko, Lennox or Fury.

Jack Johnson wasn't all that big either, and Joe Louis is the best heavyweight champ in history as far as I'm concerned.

Sugar Ray Robinson is the best overall boxer ever.

 

[Dr. Rose]

I don't give a fuck who wins in a fight, obviously Jones has more weapons, but a prime Tyson would frighten me much more

Also a street fight isn't like a an MMA/boxing fight and it really is in the heat of the moment. I guarantee Mike has had WAY more street fights than Jon

Unless you count drinking encounters with women and car accidents. You know, the Gracie method for counting fights and victories by using sparring.

(I am not saying that the Gracie's beat women, but that they pad their record just like everyone else did back in the day).

 

[LEWIS540]

Jack Johnson wasn't all that big either, and Joe Louis is the best heavyweight champ in history as far as I'm concerned.

Sugar Ray Robinson is the best overall boxer ever.

Depends on how you judge it.

Truth be told any top athlete today is going to be bigger, stronger, faster and better prepared than the guys of 50+ years ago.

Can only really judge people by how they did in their own eras.

 

[rstringer]

i thought he fought at 210?

even more impressive if true, but I thought that he weight around 220 on fight night.

 

[StonedLemur]

Depends on how you judge it.

Truth be told any top athlete today is going to be bigger, stronger, faster and better prepared than the guys of 50+ years ago.

Can only really judge people by how they did in their own eras.

Joe Louis held the title for 12 years in an era there was only 1 title.
That says a lot tbh sir.

 

[rstringer]

Somewhat. Problem with Tyson is that he lost all the time to the top guys when they fought.

which top guys?

 

[dipstickjimmy]

Looking how Jones had to beef up 50 pounds over 3 years to fight in the HW division and very few people dare to do this in the UFC,, I appreciate Tyson so much more as small HW who basically weighed in at around 220 on fight night, which is what the LHWs now coming in at. And he fought these guys who were monsters compared to him and KOed most of them.

I personally have a much deeper appreciation for him and still can't think of anyone who is more exciting in combat sports.

What does Jon adding weight to fight at HW have to do with Mike Tyson and his boxing career? FYI your MMAth doesn't add up. Jon according to you weighed 220lbs as a LHW and weighed in at 248 lbs but Jon added 50 lbs? 220 + 50 =/= 248.
t
I appreciate Michael Jordan so much more after seeing how Conor McDavid has to wear skates and a helmet. That's about as relevant as your Jon and Tyson comparison.

 

[Chalky White]

can crusher? wtf you talking about?

Sorry to break this to you, but go take a look at Tyson’s resume. It’s extremely thin and unimpressive.