Does know one realize this? Kamaru Usman is shaping up to be the GOAT

I'm a big fan of the 90s fighters, but let's be real--Igor's opponents were nothing like Ngannou, Gane, etc. He beat some big freak shows (Varelens, Fred Floyd, etc.) with very little skill, and he should've lost to Nick Nutter in his first fight. He never fought a technical striker during those 38 fights. I was watching NHB/MMA back then and wanted to see Igor fight a taller striker who knew how to use their reach/length and had good leg kicks. Bas Rutten, Mo Smith, Marco Ruas, etc. Even a prime Don Frye (circa 1997) would've been fun as Frye could fight standing, in the clinch or on the ground--and went wherever he had an advantage. But Igor beat guys no one ever heard of in small orgs and tournaments. He was a great fighter, but didn't get tested until later when he fought guys like Coleman, Kerr, etc.
I dont mean that he beat fighters as skilled a the modern day new breed like Gane, I mean he became the number one heavyweight in the world for his time and beat the best available at that time in history. It's all about relativity. Kerr was the #1 guy in the world and he beat him, and he did it as a guy that is a modern middleweight at best - you just dont see guys do what he did anymore, anywhere in this sport.
 
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If anyone on your shitty list is a can crusher it’s Usman …..rematching journey men lol
so journeymen and cans are the same thing now?
 
I don't think he's on GSP level yet, but he's definitely doing all the right things to get there.
 
I dont mean that he beat fighters as skilled a the modern day new breed like Gane, I mean he became the number one heavyweight in the world for his time and beat the best available at that time in history. It's all about relativity. Kerr was the #1 guy in the world and he beat him, and he did it as a guy that is a modern middleweight at best - you just dont see guys do what he did anymore, anywhere in this sport.
Like I said, I have plenty of respect for him and other pioneers. To be fair, none of the early UFC guys had records like that because they always had 8-man tournaments and only one fighter could win. If you were lucky, you'd start with an easier opponent but the next two fights were usually tough. Contrast that to today where you start in a small org, then move somewhere like UFC or Bellator and fight in the prelims for a while. You can easily have 15-20 wins without fighting anyone in the Top 10.

It was a different world. No one handpicked opponents or cared about weight classes. Frye was another guy who'd be a modern MW, but fought true HWs like Tank, Goodridge, Coleman, etc.
 
Depends how you look at it.
Two wins over a very good fighter is worth the same as two wins over two separate less talented fighters in my eyes.
except he is fighting former lw's as well. Even wwanted to fight CHiesa at one point just cause it was an easy fight.
 
so journeymen and cans are the same thing now?
Under normal circumstances no… But if Ts is calling Jon Jones a can crusher and praising Usmans competition…..That doesn’t add up imo
 
This just means your favourite fighter was fortunate enough to beat the test ….congratulations ……Again you don’t make the criteria …….I’ve watched recent interview were majority of the fighters call Jon the goat ….but damn Royce G thinks his wins don’t count ….that changes everything

I have no favorite fighters and yes, i make the criteria regarding this.
 
- Losses: Lost against unranked fighter, now amazing winstreak
- Steroid violations: not yet, but colby got evidence of use of epo
- Weak strength of schedule / fighting cans: take away the two title defences against masvidal
- Not enough title defenses: see point about masvidal
- Point fighting: see al matches before colby 1, acte colby 1 true
- Squeaking by with wins / close victories: besides colby 2 true
- Rapid decline in career in older age: true
- Retired too early: true
 
All I'm saying is that he is currently free of most of the complaints people use to tear down GOAT candidates. If he gets past Khamzat and gets a few more title defenses, he will be the GOAT undeniably.

At that point he will have:

- Unbeaten for a decade
- Enough title defenses
- Challenging opponents / tough division
- No PED violations
- Not a point fighter
etc. etc.

That's enough for GOAT status, almost undeniably.

Where is all of this rewritten history? GSP does all of this and does it better than Usman, also while dethroning the previous WW GOAT in Hughes.

Usman: 21 wins, 10 by decision

GSP: 26 wins, 12 by decision

So what's this about point fighting?

Plus GSP had NINE title defenses and also won the MW crown. Usman has quite a ways to go...
 
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Agreed Usman not close ….Usman clearly beat Colby twice ….not a single media member thought Colby won …..not one
Not targetting this post particularly, but I find it weird that media scores are brought up everytime a close fight happens
What makes the media judges a better scorer than someone who has say been watching the sport for the last 10-20 years?
At the end of the day they are a fan and have their own biases
How do we make sure they were completely objective?
I think how a % of surveyed fan base sees it as more reflective of how the fight went (preferably on fight night so we can exclude the rewatchers)
 
Where is all of this rewritten history? GSP does all of this and does it better than Usman, also while dethroning the previous WW GOAT in Hughes.

Usman: 21 wins, 10 by decision

GSP: 26 wins, 12 by decision

So what's this about point fighting?

Plus GSP had NINE title defenses and also won the MW crown. Usman has quite a ways to go...

Hey I'm just parroting common criticisms, not my fault people say that.

My point has always been that Kamaru is within striking distance of being a GOAT, not that he is already one.
 
Most GOAT candidates have problems with their case:

- Losses
- Steroid violations (Jones)
- Weak strength of schedule / fighting cans (Fedor, Jones)
- Not enough title defenses (DC. Khabib)
- Point fighting (GSP)
- Squeaking by with wins / close victories (GSP)
- Rapid decline in career in older age (Silva, Fedor)
- Retired too early (Khabib)

Kamarudeen so far has none of these issues.

If he gets past Khamzat, the division is pretty clear. He could easily string together 4 more defenses.

At that point he's the GOAT, undisputed.

Israel Adesanya was shaping up to be a GOAT, but then he kinda got son'd by a subpar LHW champ, which kind of sullies his case.

Kinda nuts, huh? Kamaru can be the GOAT if he plays his cards right. Weird to think about.

** GOAT fighter, Conor is undisputed GOAT prize fighter in the UFC.
Goat? Are you insane? Get your brain checked.
iu

Aside from that, how can you watch over all time? Answer.....you can't.....
 
Usman will never be considered a GOAT, because butthurt republican Colby fans (which are the target demographic) will always bring a different excuse to diminish his accomplishments.

First it was the boring style of fighting (fixed), then it was the footstomps (not seen since), the idea of him using EPO (rumour, not proven guilty), and now their on their last card which they will defend for as long as possible: his opponents weren’t that good

{<jordan}

iu
 
Most GOAT candidates have problems with their case:

- Losses
- Steroid violations (Jones)
- Weak strength of schedule / fighting cans (Fedor, Jones)
- Not enough title defenses (DC. Khabib)
- Point fighting (GSP)
- Squeaking by with wins / close victories (GSP)
- Rapid decline in career in older age (Silva, Fedor)
- Retired too early (Khabib)

Kamarudeen so far has none of these issues.

If he gets past Khamzat, the division is pretty clear. He could easily string together 4 more defenses.

At that point he's the GOAT, undisputed.

Israel Adesanya was shaping up to be a GOAT, but then he kinda got son'd by a subpar LHW champ, which kind of sullies his case.

Kinda nuts, huh? Kamaru can be the GOAT if he plays his cards right. Weird to think about.

** GOAT fighter, Conor is undisputed GOAT prize fighter in the UFC.
The most accomplished doesn’t mean the best at fighting
Kamaru isn't the best at fighting
 
Not targetting this post particularly, but I find it weird that media scores are brought up everytime a close fight happens
What makes the media judges a better scorer than someone who has say been watching the sport for the last 10-20 years?
At the end of the day they are a fan and have their own biases
How do we make sure they were completely objective?
I think how a % of surveyed fan base sees it as more reflective of how the fight went (preferably on fight night so we can exclude the rewatchers)
If not a single member of the media scores the fight for Colby ….20-0 …..that says something imo ……I think fans likely more biased then media …..but overall I agree ….I can score a fight as well as anyone …been watching since 90’s
 
His greatest challenge was DC, and he roided for those, so those wins don't count.

Otherwise he beat a bunch of blown up middleweights on the downtrend of their careers.
Because all of Jones’s opponents are clean, right? Cormier also had the testosterone of a woman for his fight with Jones, I wonder why…
 
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