Do you have to deal with gaslighting in your life?

[Versez]

This thread is heavy …. I will pray for all of you sherbros. Really. It’s the carême I think, so there will be prayers tonight

 

[Versez]

It's one of those gen z psychology terms that's been hijacked by people who use these terms to avoid taking responsibility and dodge any criticism. I preferred it when it was called being a manipulative cunt.

That generation z put too much terms nowadays, it’s starting to get on my nerves …

 

[William Huggins]

It’s from an old film called Gaslight.

I can’t remember much of it. But basically this man moves into a woman’s home (back when they had gas lines pipes throughout all homes for lighting) under some pretext (marriage maybe).

But he’s really looking for some fortune he knows she has. He believes she has it in the attic. So he sneaks up there whenever he can to look for it, and I’m doing so causes the gaslights in the home to flicker and dim. I guess because he’s somehow stepping on the gas lines when he’s up there.

When she asks him about it, he tells her that it’s her imagination. He keeps doing that to the point where she believes she’s going insane.

Yes, basically, along with stuff moving around and things going missing.

Funny thing is, sometimes the people that are making accusations of gaslighting do so because they're getting up to no good, plenty of cheaters lose track of stuff when they're poor brains have to constantly maintain and juggle the deception.........

 

[mozfonky]

yes, in fact, I've been reflecting on it lately and realizing that at least for me, it's been more common than not from everyone I ever got close to.

 

[shunyata]

I don’t know why but this is one of those fucking terms that just bothers me.

I can’t put my finger on why but just the term gaslight bugs the shit out of me.

It's taken off culturally and is now frequently used outside of its definition.

Women and kids seem to enjoy accusing people of gaslighting when they really just mean the other person is lying or just incorrect.

 

[Kiniun]

My brother is a rich man who pretends to give a shit about the less fortunate. It's absolutely insufferable

 

[jeff7b9]

Every day.

On my stove. Thermador.

 

[wolffanghameha]

My parents did this shit (so I knew the term years before it got popular and misused), so yeh. Look up NPD and that checklist is 80-90% my dad. Hundreds, if not thousands of times. Very tiring to deal with (particularly when it's one vs two), plus if it's all you know you will doubt your own life story, even if you're known for having great memory. I guess it makes you good at catching people out on shit though, and makes you more diligent about collecting concrete evidence to back yourself up. But also makes me unnecessarily annoyed if anyone seems to be trying this shit with me and definitely can erode your trust in people in general, if they were able to get a lot of people onside with their gaslighting (if they're hardcore, they'll start getting your potential allies on side before you even think of it, so by the time you get to them they're already against your side of the story).

 

[Phlog]

I don't think the term is useful, it's too messy. I can't get my finger on it or arrange it on my head. It's like I'm being gaslit to believe in gaslighting.

As far as I can understand, at it's essence, it is a person convincing you of their narrative.

Reality is subjectively appreciated and people are self serving in their interpretations and thus the narrative can differ from your own. Hence the need to convince.

Is that it? We don't say someone is convincing anymore?

 

[Berserker13]

most pop music

 

[mixmastermo]

I don't think the term is useful, it's too messy. I can't get my finger on it or arrange it on my head. It's like I'm being gaslit to believe in gaslighting.

As far as I can understand, at it's essence, it is a person convincing you of their narrative.

Reality is subjectively appreciated and people are self serving in their interpretations and thus the narrative can differ from your own. Hence the need to convince.

Is that it? We don't say someone is convincing anymore?

You're on the right track but it goes beyond convincing and gets into the realm of manipulation.

I associate the word convince more with trying to get someone to understand your point of view or other perspectives. This isn't necessarily harmful and it can actually strengthen relationships in some cases. You can still validate someone's perception and feelings while you are convincing them.

Gaslighting is more about getting someone to not just reject their own point of view, but accept that they didn't see what they saw, didn't hear what they heard, didnt say what they said, and didn't feel what they felt. The victim is expected to reject their own perceptions so the manipulator can get them to align with their alternate reality.

Like in the case with my ex, she'd try to tell me I didn't say the thing that she agrees with, I said something else that means something else entirely and that's why she doesn't feel the need to put any effort into the relationship anymore. She was trying to manipulate me but I saw right through it.

 

[mixmastermo]

My parents did this shit (so I knew the term years before it got popular and misused), so yeh. Look up NPD and that checklist is 80-90% my dad. Hundreds, if not thousands of times. Very tiring to deal with (particularly when it's one vs two), plus if it's all you know you will doubt your own life story, even if you're known for having great memory. I guess it makes you good at catching people out on shit though, and makes you more diligent about collecting concrete evidence to back yourself up. But also makes me unnecessarily annoyed if anyone seems to be trying this shit with me and definitely can erode your trust in people in general, if they were able to get a lot of people onside with their gaslighting (if they're hardcore, they'll start getting your potential allies on side before you even think of it, so by the time you get to them they're already against your side of the story).

Wow that is intense.. especially the last bit about turning people against you.

I bet you are hyper vigilant right? You are super careful about showing any vulnerability?

 

[Phlog]

You're on the right track but it goes beyond convincing and gets into the realm of manipulation.

I associate the word convince more with trying to get someone to understand your point of view or other perspectives. This isn't necessarily harmful and it can actually strengthen relationships in some cases. You can still validate someone's perception and feelings while you are convincing them.

Gaslighting is more about getting someone to not just reject their own point of view, but accept that they didn't see what they saw, didn't hear what they heard, didnt say what they said, and didn't feel what they felt. The victim is expected to reject their own perceptions so the manipulator can get them to align with their alternate reality.

Like in the case with my ex, she'd try to tell me I didn't say the thing that she agrees with, I said something else that means something else entirely and that's why she doesn't feel the need to put any effort into the relationship anymore. She was trying to manipulate me but I saw right through it.

Isn't that just an attempt to convince that you didn't like?

And wouldn't the relationship be over more because what they're trying to convince you of, probably because they give less of a fuck about you, isn't as convincing anymore?

 

[560ti]

In both cases, like with my ex and with my boss, I feel like it's some form of insecurity manifesting. I suppose I should be glad I recognize this behavior and know it's not appropriate. It is justification for me to make a decision to move on. It just sucks to know I've wasted time and energy investing into a relationship and my career to have to look to start over again, because some people wanted to make me doubt reality.

Yes it's happened to me and I've known people where it's happened. It's basically just a form of emotional manipulation.

It's really common for people that are psychopaths to do this. One of the biggest attributes of a psychopath is inability to admit guilt and defensive to criticism. The way to get out of guilt and criticism is the just distort the narrative.

It can be really subtle too. Something as minor as "I'm sorry you feel that way". Essentially translates to "I did nothing wrong but I'm sorry your having a fuss about it for no reason at all".

 

[Other]

Does still lighting your farts on fire in your 40's count as gaslighting?

Because if so...

 

[mixmastermo]

Isn't that just an attempt to convince that you didn't like?

And wouldn't the relationship be over more because what they're trying to convince you of, probably because they give less of a fuck about you, isn't as convincing anymore?

No.

There's a very clear difference between trying to convince someone of something they don't like, and attempting to get them to not trust their own senses and memory.

The first part isn't necessarily a bad thing. The second thing is a crystal clear form of a power play through psychological manipulation.

That's the difference between convincing and gaslighting.

See @560ti post above. Gaslighting can be subtle.. it's not about disagreeing or convincing as much as changing the narrative and the victim often ends up feeling like they are crazy. It's an attempt to get the victim to accept the perpetrators narrative as absolute truth.

 

[chrisdiaz]

Gaslighting is such a reddit word. Cant stand the misuse and overuse of it in the last 5 years.

 

[Phlog]

No.

There's a very clear difference between trying to convince someone of something they don't like, and attempting to get them to not trust their own senses and memory.

The first part isn't necessarily a bad thing. The second thing is a crystal clear form of a power play through psychological manipulation.

That's the difference between convincing and gaslighting.

See @560ti post above. Gaslighting can be subtle.. it's not about disagreeing or convincing as much as changing the narrative and the victim often ends up feeling like they are crazy. It's an attempt to get the victim to accept the perpetrators narrative as absolute truth.

I think you're gaslighting me about gaslighting.

 

[560ti]

Gaslighting is such a reddit word. Cant stand the misuse and overuse of it in the last 5 years.

Yes, gaslighting and toxic both became real trendy phrases post covid.

 

[Berserker13]

Yes, gaslighting and toxic both became real trendy phrases post covid.