Do you have to deal with gaslighting in your life?

People's memories aren't very accurate, especially over time and people's feelings towards people can change their memory of past events, it's pretty well researched.......

As for people that actually gaslight, it's usually to cover up for something their up too......

This. I think many people understand the concept of gaslighting, and recognize patterns that it describes in their own lives. So, it's a real phenomenon, but it's also a very tricky one to concretely define. The concept of gaslighting seems to suggest there is a shared, objective reality that the gaslighter misrepresents to the gaslightee, or that they somehow indirectly cause the gaslightee to doubt this shared objective reality.

The truth is probably often more subtle than that, where there are a few different ways of seeing/understanding a situation. People can obviously act like dickheads if they aren't seeing the situation the same way, without anyone scheming on plans to systematically misrepresent what's happened, or to manipulate someone. It's just people being shitty to each other, thinking they are in the right. In this sort of a context, "gaslighting" sort of misses the mark, and suggests something worse/more calculating than what is going on.

It's like the term "narcissist." so many people are throwing this word around, it seems. It was a much more clinical word even a decade ago, but now everyone is describing everybody as a narcissist because they were rude or inconsiderate or something.
 
Yes, gaslighting and toxic both became real trendy phrases post covid.

I don't mind toxic as a general negative descriptor. It's better than saying something like "bitchy", or "shitty" or " a downer" or however you'd say it before "toxic" became so popular.
 
The biggest issue is people using terms that they don't understand. For an example, the day i broke up with an ex, she accused me of gaslighting her on multiple occasions. Whereas, the truth is that I simply had vastly different views than she did on a number of issues, which resulted from having very different lived experiences.

The truth is, she lived in a giant lefty bubble. She did a psych degree at university, which is obviously highly liberal. Her job is full of people who think like her, her friendship group and family as well. She also spent her time on social media platforms that were owned and run by the left, so she literally saw nothing but one side of the argument on EVERY issue. This led her to believing that everyone thought like her and believed the same things that she did, as that's all she had ever experienced.

Every time I attempted to show her evidence that these positions may be incorrect, she flatly refused to even look at it. I personally found it fascinating that people would be so completely convinced that they are correct, that they will literally fight to maintain their ignorance and only ever consume media or look at evidence that supports their existing beliefs.

Gaslighting is INTENTIONALLY deceiving or taking other actions against someone to make them question their sanity - a reference to a play and more famously a Hitchcock movie adaption.

Disagreeing with someone and having different experience, or in the case of OP - having a different take on a situation or the capability of a co-worker is NOT gaslighting.
 
The gaslighting is specifically related to her wanting to make me believe things happened that didn't happen or me saying things I didn't say.

She was literally making me question my own reality.

The boss situation is similar in that sense.
...at the same time, a lot of people have absolutely terrible memories and these can also be heavily influenced by their emotions.

Gaslighting is a conscious act to make you question your sanity. Based on what you have said previously, the former seems like the most likely explanation rather than gaslighting.
 
...at the same time, a lot of people have absolutely terrible memories and these can also be heavily influenced by their emotions.

Gaslighting is a conscious act to make you question your sanity. Based on what you have said previously, the former seems like the most likely explanation rather than gaslighting.
Two things

I did state in my original post that this kind of thing happened within the same conversation we'd be having. Memory is not the issue there, as she'd twist my words and try to make me believe I really meant something else.

Second thing- we have to also consider that people do this kind of thing to absolve themselves of responsibility of some terrible things done or said to the victim. They either want to make the victim believe that the terrible action was justified and/or it was the victim's fault.

Others here have had similar experiences.

In my case, there were in fact some terrible things done towards me but I will not get into it here.
 
The biggest issue is people using terms that they don't understand. For an example, the day i broke up with an ex, she accused me of gaslighting her on multiple occasions. Whereas, the truth is that I simply had vastly different views than she did on a number of issues, which resulted from having very different lived experiences.

The truth is, she lived in a giant lefty bubble. She did a psych degree at university, which is obviously highly liberal. Her job is full of people who think like her, her friendship group and family as well. She also spent her time on social media platforms that were owned and run by the left, so she literally saw nothing but one side of the argument on EVERY issue. This led her to believing that everyone thought like her and believed the same things that she did, as that's all she had ever experienced.

Every time I attempted to show her evidence that these positions may be incorrect, she flatly refused to even look at it. I personally found it fascinating that people would be so completely convinced that they are correct, that they will literally fight to maintain their ignorance and only ever consume media or look at evidence that supports their existing beliefs.

Gaslighting is INTENTIONALLY deceiving or taking other actions against someone to make them question their sanity - a reference to a play and more famously a Hitchcock movie adaption.

Disagreeing with someone and having different experience, or in the case of OP - having a different take on a situation or the capability of a co-worker is NOT gaslighting.
Sorry but I don't think you really grasp the situations I described. Maybe it's my fault.

Perhaps I ought to provide some more context to the work situation: my boss has been trying (and failing) to grow the business. He has added a marketing team and a sales team who cannot leverage any kind of data, contracted work with agencies who were supposed to help with our advertising, cancelled a project related to a system upgrade that ended up costing the company hundreds of thousands of dollars...

All while he's had someone on his team with untapped potential who he had boxed in due to his own personal beliefs.

He has people he has to answer to, so for him to all of a sudden share with that group that instead of leveraging his talent he has been recklessly spending money without generating results...

He ends up looking like an asshole. So when someone casually shares they know something on a subject that he's not aware of.. he puts his defenses up immediately and says "that can't be, that person didn't do that, they are dishonest and misrepresenting themselves. I have to now confront them about that and make them understand they actually don't have the experience they say they have".

Which is exactly how the conversation played out. It wasn't "hey, can you tell me more about your work with AI?" It was "you did NOT study AI and you do NOT have experience on it. I use chat GPT and went to a 3 hour seminar on it, I know what is, you do not".

Call it whatever you want to call it, but that shit is NOT cool, cuz he wasn't curious about my credentials, he was outright telling me I did not experience what I experience, I did not study what I studied, I did not live what I lived through.
 
I've done a lot of mentoring in my day, and one of the funniest I remember is when one of my mentees joined a new group. They replaced a problem employee who was leading a team of about 20 people. My mentee completely turned things around, and when they got their team employee satisfaction scores back tehy were all massive green arrows up, just massive improvement in employee morale, experience, feeling heard, etc and completely outperforming peer groups. Like not even close, I'm talking right in the upper top right corner of the graph for being awesome.

Fast forward a bit, and my mentee gets a new boss, and absolute soul crushing brutal lunatic. Needless to say, the new boss is putting the most ridiculous demands on everyone, stressing everybody out, everybody working crazy long hours with no incentive, reward, or satisfaction, and needless to say, one year later the employee satisfaction scores come and they are down.

So, what do you think happens? The new boss of course blames my mentee. The crazy person isn't going to blame themself, they are just going to create a narrative that scapegoats others. That's why psychos do a lot of, and it's what normal people do a little of.
 
I've done a lot of mentoring in my day, and one of the funniest I remember is when one of my mentees joined a new group. They replaced a problem employee who was leading a team of about 20 people. My mentee completely turned things around, and when they got their team employee satisfaction scores back tehy were all massive green arrows up, just massive improvement in employee morale, experience, feeling heard, etc and completely outperforming peer groups. Like not even close, I'm talking right in the upper top right corner of the graph for being awesome.

Fast forward a bit, and my mentee gets a new boss, and absolute soul crushing brutal lunatic. Needless to say, the new boss is putting the most ridiculous demands on everyone, stressing everybody out, everybody working crazy long hours with no incentive, reward, or satisfaction, and needless to say, one year later the employee satisfaction scores come and they are down.

So, what do you think happens? The new boss of course blames my mentee. The crazy person isn't going to blame themself, they are just going to create a narrative that scapegoats others. That's why psychos do a lot of, and it's what normal people do a little of.
Brutal, but not totally surprising.

I've been in a lot of situations in my career where the boss HAS to be the alpha and no one else can shine. If there are problems, there are a number of places to put the blame.
 
Brutal, but not totally surprising.

I've been in a lot of situations in my career where the boss HAS to be the alpha and no one else can shine. If there are problems, there are a number of places to put the blame.

Yep, and to your point, the data points are right there clear as day for all to see. Anyone interested in figuring out what's going on could do so in like two minutes. Yet the psychopaths are just shameless liars who will create their alternate universe to suit their narrative without thinking twice.

BTW, what I told my mentee was they were being gaslit and should get the fuck out of there ASAP. Which they eventually did.
 
I'm In a meeting about a month ago


"YOU CAN'T TRACK THIS DATA?"

"No, sir, in order for me and others to have access to this system and see it's data, you will have to grant access to myself and the other managers" (Already told him this personally, A week proir)

"HOW IS THAT SO, WHO TOLD YOU THAT"

"The people who own the system sir, I called them last week to confirm" (already told him that proir)

"REALLY? AND WHY WOULDN'T THEY HAVE NOTIFIED ME?"

"They might just have your old email, I noticed they cc'd the older one last week" (the fucking organization email upgrade happened 3 years ago)

"HA, OKAY I BELIEVE THAT"

*2 Yes men laugh with him


He just needs to update his email with them and click a few times and we would be able to track it for him. (It's designed that way because he's supposed to be the one to to keep track of it, technically)

Is this gaslighting? Idk, he's a lunatic and it's just nice to vent
 
My company is trying to gaslight us about how return to office has made our company so successful.



We implemented it last year. They try to say we are on our way to big profits but they fail to mention a big part of that was people quitting because they didn't want to relocate, layoffs we did and one of our departments got outsourced to some other country. This saved on Cost and that's what our numbers look ok.



What's hilarious is they like filmed these vignettes with people in office acting like the love it.



Problem is nobody has ever seen any of these workers so we are convinced they're paid actors lol.
 
Sorry but I don't think you really grasp the situations I described. Maybe it's my fault.

Perhaps I ought to provide some more context to the work situation: my boss has been trying (and failing) to grow the business. He has added a marketing team and a sales team who cannot leverage any kind of data, contracted work with agencies who were supposed to help with our advertising, cancelled a project related to a system upgrade that ended up costing the company hundreds of thousands of dollars...

All while he's had someone on his team with untapped potential who he had boxed in due to his own personal beliefs.

He has people he has to answer to, so for him to all of a sudden share with that group that instead of leveraging his talent he has been recklessly spending money without generating results...

He ends up looking like an asshole. So when someone casually shares they know something on a subject that he's not aware of.. he puts his defenses up immediately and says "that can't be, that person didn't do that, they are dishonest and misrepresenting themselves. I have to now confront them about that and make them understand they actually don't have the experience they say they have".

Which is exactly how the conversation played out. It wasn't "hey, can you tell me more about your work with AI?" It was "you did NOT study AI and you do NOT have experience on it. I use chat GPT and went to a 3 hour seminar on it, I know what is, you do not".

Call it whatever you want to call it, but that shit is NOT cool, cuz he wasn't curious about my credentials, he was outright telling me I did not experience what I experience, I did not study what I studied, I did not live what I lived through.
Don't get me wrong, he sounds like a dick that was trying to big note himself and state that he was the only one that knew about AI, just doesn't seem like it fits the definition of gaslighting to me /shrugs
 
in real life they try to gaslit constantly when i pass by them but i ignore them here on sherdog they gas lit me with black athetes
 
Yes, I've experienced it twice.

The first was over an extensive period during my childhood. It left me with symptoms of C-PTSD, which, like gaslighting itself, I had no idea about and had no way to define or describe it for the longest time. It was only when I discovered Carl Jung and shadow work that I was able to see I'd been deliberately deceived and see how that affected my concept of self.

The second was in my 20s, right out of college. I had a buddy and former classmate who, while we had some similar interests that drew us together, had a toxic side to him. We would have discussions about various topics, and he would literally say something then say he didn't say it right after. He'd argue conflicting points, change definitions, and do other deceptive stuff, then deny any of it ever happened. Needless to say, we don't talk anymore.
 
Yea, some asshole recently tried to make me feel bad for wearing scrubs every day
 
I've had two very strong examples of being gaslit in recent years. here's the official definition:



First example- my marriage and divorce. Ex wife did this repeatedly in the last year we were together, essentially distorting events that happened between us and by trying to make me doubt everything I said. It got to the point where we'd have a discussion about an observation, she'd share her thoughts on the subject, I'd share mine, saying something like "X and Y, so Z" but she'd immediately respond with "oh it's not that, it's Z because Y and X".

We were literally saying the same thing, but she'd want me to believe I was wrong somehow. She initiated the separation but I didn't push back, as I had accepted the relationship wasn't working anymore.

Second, most recent example- my boss.

A few months back he had asked in a group meeting if we had any experts in AI. I raised my hand, and shared that I'd never call myself an expert but I did study it in school and I know the fundamentals of how it works and what it does. He cut the convo short and said we'd discuss later. In a few days in a one on one meeting, he didn't merely challenge me on what I was saying, he flat out told me that I didn't know anything about AI and he didn't appreciate that I shared that I had knowledge of the subject in a group setting. He wasn't just questioning my credentials, he was telling me what I knew and what I didn't know.

I walked out of the room. I wasn't going to tolerate that. What I ended up doing was sharing some links in some specific coursework I took and the very specific projects I worked on and the applications I used it for in the real world. He eventually had an "oh shit" moment and realized he messed up and apologized for the way he confronted me on the matter.

Another issue I have been having is with my team. When I share my thoughts about two specific people on my team, he seems to think his opinion on the subject is somehow more valid.

One guy, A, came to the team with minimal experience, but he is responsible and he has learned quite a bit. He's a good employee and I am glad to have him on my team, but I also recognize he lacks confidence due to his inexperience. I've been slowly teaching him more and giving him responsibilities because I do not want to overload him. He has already gotten promoted and given very good raises over the past 2 years, he just needs to be given space to develop over time.

The other guy, L is much older and is a bit of a space cadet. He technically has more experience, but he's very disorganized, impulsive, and forgetful. I think L needs more training and support- and it isn't something he's going to learn and adapt to by going to a 3 day seminar. I shared my concerns with L with my boss, and my boss is somehow convinced that I could solve the problem by giving some of L's responsibilities to A.

This is where the gaslighting comes in: Instead of taking me at my word on L's deficiencies, he started to pick apart some of the very basic examples I brought up of L making mistakes or forgetting to complete his tasks. Instead of listening to my concerns about overloading A, and even after giving some very specific examples as to how A is a great guy but lacks confidence, boss says "well that's just something you need to manage"

After some time he ultimately realized that L may not in fact be a good fit and he may need some additional support and training. I then think to myself, then why'd you have to make me doubt my own reality? Why were you so convinced that you had the answer when I'm the one who has to deal with L's incompetence and A's lack of confidence on a daily basis?


In both cases, like with my ex and with my boss, I feel like it's some form of insecurity manifesting. I suppose I should be glad I recognize this behavior and know it's not appropriate. It is justification for me to make a decision to move on. It just sucks to know I've wasted time and energy investing into a relationship and my career to have to look to start over again, because some people wanted to make me doubt reality.

Some people gaslight just for fun now. It's become so normalized in social media and on line platforms, it's seeping into everyday interactions more and more. People will sometimes even cite the first amendment to justify their gaslighting. But the First Amendment does not give anyone the right to your company, attention, or even acknowledgment.
 
This is one of those words that some people seem to use all the time now. I cringe everytime i hear it.
 
term is new but manipulation has gone on since before we were even monkeys probably.

You want to know an extreme form? Dr. Eugene Landy diagnosed Brian Wilson (Beach Boy) schizophrenic to gain power over him and his money back in the 80's and 90's. People are pretty shitty to each other, I have a million stories of my own, from the harmless to the devestating, it's why I try to stay away from people as much as possible.
 
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