Did Ken Shamrock make the most out of his potential?

HHJ said:
oh nah man

How can you say that? LOOK at the fight w Don Frye
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The one where he just held him an an ankle-lock forever? There were some good fireworks early on in that match, with shades of Frye's fight with Takayama, but I think that terminally long time spent on the mat kind of hurt it a bit.

What I mean about not having a fighter's mentality is Ken was easily flustered, especially in his second run. He got finished early way more than he should have, and had more corner stoppages than he should have as well. I know this sounds like I'm being negative, but I'm not. I think Ken had a great career despite these things, which is why I don't think he underachieved at all. I think he really did maximize his potential and then some.
 
Starman said:
The one where he just held him an an ankle-lock forever? There were some good fireworks early on in that match, with shades of Frye's fight with Takayama, but I think that terminally long time spent on the mat kind of hurt it a bit.

What I mean about not having a fighter's mentality is Ken was easily flustered, especially in his second run. He got finished early way more than he should have, and had more corner stoppages than he should have as well. I know this sounds like I'm being negative, but I'm not. I think Ken had a great career despite these things, which is why I don't think he underachieved at all. I think he really did maximize his potential and then some.
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They always quit sooner in their second run. The same hunger isnt there. He wasnt even healthy against Tito Ortiz,
 
Starman said:
The one where he just held him an an ankle-lock forever? There were some good fireworks early on in that match, with shades of Frye's fight with Takayama, but I think that terminally long time spent on the mat kind of hurt it a bit.

What I mean about not having a fighter's mentality is Ken was easily flustered, especially in his second run. He got finished early way more than he should have, and had more corner stoppages than he should have as well. I know this sounds like I'm being negative, but I'm not. I think Ken had a great career despite these things, which is why I don't think he underachieved at all. I think he really did maximize his potential and then some.
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What I mean it was a very gritty fight, the kind you think he couldnt have.

I think physically he started to fall apart after this, but I do think the guy def had some grit to him. As far as being flustered, he was always flustered easily, in and out of the ring, thats just how he was, but i def think he had the fighter's mentality, he just fought w emotion.
 
HHJ said:
What I mean it was a very gritty fight, the kind you think he couldnt have.

I think physically he started to fall apart after this, but I do think the guy def had some grit to him. As far as being flustered, he was always flustered easily, in and out of the ring, thats just how he was, but i def think he had the fighter's mentality, he just fought w emotion.
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I get where you're coming from, but getting flustered is precisely why I don't think he had a fighter's mentality. When I say grit, I'm talking about guys sitting on a hot stove and sweating ice cubes. Guys that get in firefights and keep their wits about them. Fedor, Sakuraba, Shogun, Henderson, Frank Shamrock, etc...

I think we're mostly arguing over semantics at this point. Other than disagreeing about what it means to have a fighter's mentality, I think we probably actually agree on the larger points concerning Ken Shamrock.
 
Starman said:
I get where you're coming from, but getting flustered is precisely why I don't think he had a fighter's mentality. When I say grit, I'm talking about guys sitting on a hot stove and sweating ice cubes. Guys that get in firefights and keep their wits about them. Fedor, Sakuraba, Shogun, Henderson, Frank Shamrock, etc...

I think we're mostly arguing over semantics at this point. Other than disagreeing about what it means to have a fighter's mentality, I think we probably actually agree on the larger points concerning Ken Shamrock.
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Fair enough.

I just think overly emotional guys have their place in this game. Mark Coleman could be like that too.

They arent always like that, but they can blow their top in a hurry.
 
ChrisBenoit said:
I think beating The Rock to become King of the Ring was a bigger achievement then Severn
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He chocked out a guy who in wrestling terms is so much more credentialed than him its hard to categorize, the gap in skill.
 
He's one of the most complete fighters in the early days of mma.
 
sonofjay817 said:
Just judging from the way the trained, or attempted to train, the guys in the TUF house, I'd venture to say that he probably didn't capitalize on his potential.
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Being dumb held back his potential
 
Of course he did, by working for a real company called the WWF
 
6udpn.gif
This is what ruined his mma return


Honestly, for how strong people would say he was, each fight, Tito did throw him around like a child. The last one especially

​

 
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He was never gonna be Fedor or anything close. The guy just wasnt that kind of athlete. He was by all accounts very strong but he wasnt very smooth and fluid in his movement and his striking was poor. Gotta keep in mind he was already pushing 30 when he started his MMA career too. Much like Coleman, Randy and Severn, we never actually saw him in his prime in MMA.

One thing he definitely did fulfil is his potential as a star. He was a pretty big deal in the WWF and was one of the biggest names in the first half of MMAs history, bordering on being an actual mainstream star that the average Joe knows of.
 
He made millions (and spent it all) on a career in a sport most people never even heard of back then. I’d say he did okay
 
Intermission said:
If I think of the scariest fighter back in the day it would be Ken. His reign didnt last long and thats the main thing that is held against him.

Biggest feat probably his win over Dan Severn. If Im not missing anyone...

Could Ken have trained differently or smarter and made it to Fedor status or did he make the most of what he got?

How good of a submission wrestler was he at his best?
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Without proof based on life experience and knowing few things about human nature, I say it loud and clear, "RIGGED "
 
HHJ said:
Fair enough.

I just think overly emotional guys have their place in this game. Mark Coleman could be like that too.

They arent always like that, but they can blow their top in a hurry.
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They definitely have their place, and I tend to really like those guys. I liked Coleman a lot too. I just don't view that as a positive trait for a fighter to have. As the great Yogi Berra once said, 90% of the game is half mental.
 
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