Combating PEDs

You really have to pinpoint the metrics, it's incredibly important in this discussion. Last I checked, testing is far from cheap, and testing to prevent any one of your fighters from flagging to prevent a meaningful fine from befalling a camp is even more expensive. Understand, when most sports approach testing, they don't even approach the blood, they usually do piss tests, which is a joke for anyone in the know. So now camps have to be responsible for blood testing? Which camps can even afford that? And for the camps that can afford it, will the fine be meaningful enough in comparison to the funds they generate from their pro athletes, the attention they get from producing champions and top fighters, which draw revenue from other fighters and even casuals to sign up? It's hard for me to take this approach seriously, because it's not like every top fighter is even locked down to a camp these days, the best, especially in boxing, jump from camp to camp depending on what they are looking for heading into a fight. Hell, some fighters pull trainers to them, which you could imagine would create a nightmare scenario for holding anyone accountable besides the fighter. That makes the idea of holding camps responsible even worse to manage at that level.

We could get a bit more serious about your specific approach if you want, because there are a lot of glaring holes to cover, I see the point of what you are going for, it's understandable, but I think you are falling for the delusion of a clean sport, and your proposal really only leads to throwing more money down the drain to further that delusion. I say USADA is enough if you want to uphold that delusion, that money could go elsewhere and we would likely be provided a greater spectacle for doing so, but I know people love the idea of holding cheaters accountable. lol It's nothing that concerns me at all, I welcome the aspect, it's interesting. What is "fair" is an irrelevancy in sporting to anyone reasonable individual, how can "fair" be applied to a Jon Jones, Usian Bolt, Michael Phelps, or Kipchoge? Of course we have rules within our sports, which I definitely welcome, but the idea of fairness outside of that is silly, imo. Although I take a very deterministic approach to life so I'm familiar with how off-putting that can be to most.


Your post is a little bit confusing cuz you said fairness should be based off of the rules of the sport but is isn't performance enhancing drugs against the rules so wouldn't it be in fairness that they're not allowed...

You say you want the sport to be fair within the rules will the rules state that you shouldn't be using performance enhancing drugs so that right there it kind of defeats the purpose of your earlier part of the argument
 
Idealistic but whose going to step up and lead this?

No One - The Dynamic is set and not changing (well imo anyhow).

Well that's just it right like somebody or somewhere or something has to make the change start right and hopefully having conversations about it as a fan base and as you know Fighters maybe even in the future it could lead to some kind of provoking moment of change you know it's an important subject to be talked about it shouldn't just be chalked up to well it is what it is this is how it's always been and we just you know put our heads down it should be talked about
 
then the gym will also receive a fine against them just like the fighter will and this will put the onus on the gyms
Yeah they should go for it, I think the UFC should use all of its deterring power deep in the onus.

Damn someone take me off the internet, please
 
Your post is a little bit confusing cuz you said fairness should be based off of the rules of the sport but is isn't performance enhancing drugs against the rules so wouldn't it be in fairness that they're not allowed...

You say you want the sport to be fair within the rules will the rules state that you shouldn't be using performance enhancing drugs so that right there it kind of defeats the purpose of your earlier part of the argument

The bolded, I never said, it's not even in line with how I think but I can clarify. I think a sport should have rules, for example, you shouldn't be able to pull a bat from the crowd and KO your opponent with it, unless everyone is allowed to do that. I'm only speaking to general rules, some form of order being maintained. I don't personally don't believe in merit or fairness being achieved (to an extent), philosophically speaking, and this approach is what I apply to sports.
 
Because it's out of the realm of what's humanly possible the sport is supposed to be about humans competing against each other supposed to be what is who is the better fighter not who can take the better drugs and change their bodies to unhuman like levels and then be the winner it's about humans competing against humans on a physical and mental and skill level base not who can get the best stuff and win with it

You literally ignore the fact that guys are dehydrating themselves temporarily to obtain a size advantage yet any notion of guys taking drugs to help them recover and gain advantages that way you want retarded levels of punishment.
 
Well that's just it right like somebody or somewhere or something has to make the change start right and hopefully having conversations about it as a fan base and as you know Fighters maybe even in the future it could lead to some kind of provoking moment of change you know it's an important subject to be talked about it shouldn't just be chalked up to well it is what it is this is how it's always been and we just you know put our heads down it should be talked about

Believe me I know. My license was flagged as an activist back in the day...

Guess I've jus seen time ebb too slowly to bother myself with tangents when 99% of folk only talk and talk. Regurgitating the same dialogue...but doing nothing impactful.
 
I never understood this kind of thinking it's very like anarchy based we also used to rape and pillage people and can murder a huge groups of people and that was like the norm should we also do that because that's just what everybody does or did..

A clean sport is fair....theres nothing fair about performance enchancers as it often comes down to money ans connections things that arent available to everyone or not what everyone wants to do

I gave up on the PED game after reading and watching a bit bout steroids in sports. Well that plus guys in HS were already juicing.

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This guy gets it. Steroids in sports where it will help win is rampant. Ever since theyve existed

Anyone that believes otherwise is extremely naive.
 
In these discussions, always, the emotionally inclined butt heads with the logically inclined. Geez, can you even fathom what it would take to achieve a clean sport? Can you? If you can, you will realize how stupid is it to further add to the spending of money on charades.

Think about it like this, can you imagine a world that prevents all crime from occurring? Imagine what it would take to achieve that, maybe you think of 24/7 surveillance both in public and private. Not even that is enough because just seeing the crime as its occurring isn't enough to prevent it. You would essentially need to reach minority report-esque standards, where we would have to arrest for thought crimes, arresting people before they ever committed the crime. That is nearing the absurdity in which I view maintaining a clean sport, there are so many fucking variables required to achieve this that any logically inclined person would simply laugh at the idea. I only wish I had the patience and intelligence to quantify this in hopes that you would see just how silly you are being but even that would be a waste as you wouldn't be in your current position if that info would do anything to persuade you otherwise. lol
 
It seems fans arent aware of just how pervasive peds are and think taking them is a binary thing.

Foremost, NO ONE actually wants to see totally "natty" fighters. Wed be watching a bunch of CM punks.

Athletes coming from collegiate sports or other organizations simply wont stop taking. Plus it's almost impossible to draw the line. A pro athlete will do anything to maximize their bodies.

An athlete starts simple creatine, whey protein, dhea, bcaas . Where does it stop?
 
There needs to be a ped sub division in the UFC for ppl 35+, let the juicers fight other juicers. Fair trade? Allow them to use TRT.
 
You literally ignore the fact that guys are dehydrating themselves temporarily to obtain a size advantage yet any notion of guys taking drugs to help them recover and gain advantages that way you want retarded levels of punishment.


Im not for big weight cuts either...and have made several posts about it for years here ..and made a thread similar to this to combat weight cutting as well check my history bro before u speak


Everyone acts like its so impossible to actually enforce rules?? Like what the hell?? ..

All it takes is commitment and discipline but in a world where everyone wants easy quick money im not surprised it appears hard
 
In these discussions, always, the emotionally inclined butt heads with the logically inclined. Geez, can you even fathom what it would take to achieve a clean sport? Can you? If you can, you will realize how stupid is it to further add to the spending of money on charades.

Think about it like this, can you imagine a world that prevents all crime from occurring? Imagine what it would take to achieve that, maybe you think of 24/7 surveillance both in public and private. Not even that is enough because just seeing the crime as its occurring isn't enough to prevent it. You would essentially need to reach minority report-esque standards, where we would have to arrest for thought crimes, arresting people before they ever committed the crime. That is nearing the absurdity in which I view maintaining a clean sport, there are so many fucking variables required to achieve this that any logically inclined person would simply laugh at the idea. I only wish I had the patience and intelligence to quantify this in hopes that you would see just how silly you are being but even that would be a waste as you wouldn't be in your current position if that info would do anything to persuade you otherwise. lol


Its all about the level of commitment you want to do ..

Yea does that mean the UFC may not make as much 100s of millions each year ...yes...but it also means the sport is safer and fairer for everyone...and Taking PEDs isnt seen as a necessary choice for those who want to compete .. cuz not every athlete wants to use whatever they can for an advantage what disparaging remarks..im a martial artist and someone who wanted to do my first MMA fight before covid blew up the world and i can tell u I have never and will never use PEDs...not all athletes cheat

This whole mandate that what is has to remain and nothing can change that is why the world is as messed as it is. ..
 
There needs to be a ped sub division in the UFC for ppl 35+, let the juicers fight other juicers. Fair trade? Allow them to use TRT.
Ironically we have the inverse in bodybuilding. In the Pro IFBB level, it is already assumed that they cheat and we just don't talk about it because it's illegal and then the bodybuilders wouldn't be able to sell shit supplements to people, but there are natural bodybuilding competitions and all it does is attract the bold cheats who win over guys that could very easily pass as being natural in comparison. I don't care for PEDs but seeing natural powerlifting and natural bodybuilding is only thing that irks me, you get the watch the most narcistic and delusional people boast about their ability to cheat the system right to everyone's face. lol And you still have to deal with idiots that believe those guys are natural.
 
I used to be real naive and 'no ped' purist. I think the best thing would be to let them openly juice, just give them a list of sanctioned (and safer, if such a thing exists) juices.I just don't know the value of oral vs subcutaneous vs intravenous vs however else a person can juice. Could be a mitigating factor honestly. Then if they still go outside the line they can have a life ban.

I think a lot of supplements that are already legal are likely very good too.

I definitely don't want one fighter for sure juicing and one fighter not. Does need to be equal in that regard.
 
Im not for big weight cuts either...and have made several posts about it for years here ..and made a thread similar to this to combat weight cutting as well check my history bro before u speak


Everyone acts like its so impossible to actually enforce rules?? Like what the hell?? ..

All it takes is commitment and discipline but in a world where everyone wants easy quick money im not surprised it appears hard


I apologize for not researching your 4 year Sherdog history bro. I will do this now.
 

What does that mean?
Stop with all injections?

So no hydrocortisone, no triamcinolone, methylprednisolone, stem cells, b12, Matrix metalloproteinase??

This is what I'm talking about. People are shockingly naive about peds in sports!
 
I apologize for not researching your 4 year Sherdog history bro. I will do this now.


I may have misspoken O.G 2005 account..didnt realize i was in the presence of an Elder ... But yes its all there ive been against PEDs and huge weight cuts all along
 
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