Classic Doom 1 & 2 chat

[Clippy]

I'm looking at an editor and figured out the goggles secret hahah

But screwed in map some more after first vid

 

[JBSchroeds]

@Clippy
I didn't want to spoil the concept, it's sort of meant to be like a Hexen hub level where you keep coming back to the central area and the keys act sort of as a checkpoint for the loot-rooms. Based on your feedback I'm going to change the textures on the one-way versus two-way teleports.

@8:30 - "It's a much bigger map than I was expect." Oh, you have no idea...
@21:36 "I can revisit that" Haha...nope. The level collapses behind you as you progress.
@29:30 - That wall was an editing error. There is a teleporting enemy trap there and I forgot to unpeg that section.
@33:30 - One of those little quality-of-life things so you don't have to climb all. the. way. back. up. if you miss the jump for the switch. Same idea with the shortcuts in the marble-textured maze at the beginning.

@5:12 - When you enter the plaza with the buildings the door to the box maze opens up and the boxes lower to the secret. You have to notice that the door has opened and re-explore the area.
@12:15 - That's a trap that I set to only trigger if you jump off from the very top of the steps (between the pillars) as a shortcut when running back down. You turned clipping back on RIGHT before you ran off so you didn't see it, and you ran off the edges of stairs the first time around.
@15:14 - It makes the deep stairs easier if you happen to find it. It's not strictly necessary, just a bonus if you happen to stumble on it. It's basically only marked by the odd arrangement of power-ups in front of it. I should probably change the wall texture, but I really like the atmosphere of descending into the progressively darker stairwell. That small side room is usually open but closes as the level collapses as you progress (why you couldn't get back into it).

The secret you missed is at the very end: the one pillar that didn't open with a baron (the one directly in front of you as you enter the arena) can be activated and reveals...a BFG! You're meant to think "huh, the other four did something but this one didn't, wonder if I can do something with it", but it's so hectic in there it's tough to notice.

 

[JBSchroeds]

Quick update, I'm rejiggering some things so backtracking to certain sections is easier. But I'm still going to leave it so the east/west wings close off when you access the loot rooms. I'll post a v1.1 tomorrow when I get time.

 

[Law Talkin’ Guy]

Might give it a whirl tonight then haha

Ppl have been complaining my outdated zdoom makes their levels look bad

Bring able to play them properly will be good among other things.

“Properly”... pfft, the only proper way to play Doom is on the original renderer, not the fancy new shit like gzdoom etc.

 

[Clippy]

“Properly”... pfft, the only proper way to play Doom is on the original renderer, not the fancy new shit like gzdoom etc.

I agree I'm very old school and traditional

But truthfully nobody makes levels quite right anymore

Gzdoom fixes all them little things and makes the maps look good in nice

honestly I did a lot of times I play people's maps it just doesn't look like they expect. it looks quite bad and I call out what i think are errors and then they call me out for playing the wrong doom and then it just becomes a whole thing

It's just easier to conform

 

[Clippy]

For example if you have see through bars that are certain height to have to be a certain height

If you try to cram them into smaller than area they stick out and look weird

This used to be considered a mistake on the mappers part

Now gzdoom correct so mistakes such as these automatically

It's actually made mapping so much lazier

But broke it for a lot of platforms besides gzdoom

Good luck finding a map today that can run on the original excludable

 

[JBSchroeds]

Good luck finding a map today that can run on the original excludable

I think a lot of modern players really don't understand how limited the original game is. For example, the exterior area in my level would crash the original game without me reworking it due to the visplane limit. Here's a screenshot of the visplane explorer mode, where red and pink areas will fuck things up.

Spoiler

So if I wanted to make this run in the OG game I'd need to go back in and greatly simplify the vertex structure. Complex exteriors are OG Dooms bane. There's a reason the D2 MAP13 - Downtown map is so sparse. They could easily have added more architectural detail to the buildings, but they went with basic flat rectangles so the engine wouldn't choke.

 

[JBSchroeds]

@Clippy I update the level. I changed a couple things so it should flow a little better as well as tweaking some of the textures.

 

[Law Talkin’ Guy]

Ok, so I downloaded Steam on to my work laptop (it’s my computer, not the firm’s) and installed Ultimate Doom, Doom II and Final Doom. I then downloaded GZDoom so I’ve got that up and running now.

How do i get custom wads running? I want to try Romero’s E1M8b “Tech Gone Bad” map. Afterwards I want to try some of your maps @Clippy @JBSchroeds

 

[JBSchroeds]

Ok, so I downloaded Steam on to my work laptop (it’s my computer, not the firm’s) and installed Ultimate Doom, Doom II and Final Doom. I then downloaded GZDoom so I’ve got that up and running now.

How do i get custom wads running? I want to try Romero’s E1M8b “Tech Gone Bad” map. Afterwards I want to try some of your maps @Clippy @JBSchroeds

You'll want ZDoom Launcher (ZDL). There's a few different versions, with this one being the most recently updated. ZDL lets you choose which IWAD you want (Ultimate, D2, etc), which source port you're using, and then any other WADs you want to run on top of those. It makes using multiple wads a lot easier when you've got stuff like upgraded soundtracks, multiple texture enhancements, and gameplay mods that you all want to run together. You can add everything to the list and then activate or deactivate them as you wish. So if you've got a bunch of levels you want to try you can add all of them to a list and only activate the one you want to play at that time.

Now, if all you want to do is play a specific level without any other addons you can just click-and-drag the WAD onto the icon for the GZDoom executable and it will run with just that WAD, no additional software required.

For mod's you might want to consider:
IDKFA Soundtrack - Doom 1's soundtrack remastered on full instrumentation. Sounds great and is true to the original.
Doom Neural Upscale 2x - This project used an AI upscaler to upscale everything (textures, sprites, text, etc) by 8x, it was then hand cleaned of graphical artifacts, and then scaled back down to 2x. So everything in the game is double the resolution, which helps a lot on modern high-res screens. Honestly, you can get very similar results by using GZDoom's texture scaling options, but doing it dynamically in-engine like that takes up a lot of resources so having it "pre-baked" will make the game run more smoothly.
DHTP Alterations - This is an alternative texture pack that redoes all the game's textures (but not sprites) basically from scratch. There are three different versions of this pack with Alterations being the closest to the look of the originals. If you've played a lot of Doom then this will make the game look noticeably different, but I like it: it makes playing at 1440p feel like an HD experience.

Oh, and one last thing: make sure texture filtering is turned off (Display Options>Texture Options>Texture Filtering mode>none), it can look terrible in a lot of cases. You'll also want to play with the lighting and find one that works for you (Display Options>Hardware Rendering Options>Sector Light Mode). IIRC it defaults to "Dark" but I found that to be unplayable on some maps and nothing like how I remembered playing ~25 years ago. "Software" is the one that matches my memory of the game the closest.

 

[Clippy]

Glad to see ya playing @TheWorm

I think @JBSchroeds answer your questions

I'm making a new map right now actually

 

[Law Talkin’ Guy]

Glad to see ya playing @TheWorm

I think @JBSchroeds answer your questions

I'm making a new map right now actually

Ive been playing lots of classic Doom on my PS4 since ports of them were released in July last year. But I wanted to try some more custom maps. In January they released custom wad support for the PS4 version but its limited to maps “currated” by Bethesda (id’s parent company) and so far that’s only been TNT, Plutonia and Sigil. So if I want to play more than just that it was time to go back to the PC version.

There’s also some mods I want to try like this AI upscale one that JB mentioned above. Looks great.

 

[JBSchroeds]

Ive been playing lots of classic Doom on my PS4 since ports of them were released in July last year. But I wanted to try some more custom maps. In January they released custom wad support for the PS4 version but its limited to maps “currated” by Bethesda (id’s parent company) and so far that’s only been TNT, Plutonia and Sigil. So if I want to play more than just that it was time to go back to the PC version.

There’s also some mods I want to try like this AI upscale one that JB mentioned above. Looks great.

I grabbed a couple screenshots to show you what I'm running. I've got Alterations for the textures and Neural for all the sprites. I have dynamic lighting, ambient occlusion, and FXAA turned on (and smoothing turned OFF).

 

[Law Talkin’ Guy]

I grabbed a couple screenshots to show you what I'm running. I've got Alterations for the textures and Neural for all the sprites. I have dynamic lighting, ambient occlusion, and FXAA turned on (and smoothing turned OFF).
View attachment 770491 View attachment 770492

Very nice. Not sure how my work laptop would handle all those bells and whistles. It’s a relatively new computer, has an 8th gen I5, BUT it has no GPU. I specifically bought a laptop without one in an attempt to avoid the temptation to use the computer for anything other than just my work. Obviously that plan has failed, because here we are.

 

[Clippy]

Download it here -- http://www.levelgame.net/doom/elevator.wad


Well guys I put a lot of work into this the last few days

All difficulty levels supported + deathmatch and multiplayer. In multiplayer you have to free your buddies from cells at the beginning haha

Recommended Zdoom / Gzdoom - but is vanilla style may - no jumping/crouching - freelook is fine

Screenshots:

Spoiler

Video:




Story:

Many years ago an old mine-shaft was built on an Indian burial ground. Some force of evil pushed it above the ground making it no longer functional for mining so it was converted into a jail. Following your successful mission of saving Earth in Doom 2, a few surviving monsters were left around. Some misguided activists put them in this makeshift mine-shaft jail and they are starting to break out! It's up to you to save the Earth ... AGAIN!! Only this time you have to be sure to destroy all monsters and I meal all of them, if you miss even one the Earth is doomed and nobody shall ever lay with you. Good luck!


Download it here -- http://www.levelgame.net/doom/elevator.wad

 

[JBSchroeds]

Download it here -- http://www.levelgame.net/doom/elevator.wad


Well guys I put a lot of work into this the last few days

All difficulty levels supported + deathmatch and multiplayer. In multiplayer you have to free your buddies from cells at the beginning haha

Recommended Zdoom / Gzdoom - but is vanilla style may - no jumping/crouching - freelook is fine

Screenshots:

Spoiler

Video:




Story:

Many years ago an old mine-shaft was built on an Indian burial ground. Some force of evil pushed it above the ground making it no longer functional for mining so it was converted into a jail. Following your successful mission of saving Earth in Doom 2, a few surviving monsters were left around. Some misguided activists put them in this makeshift mine-shaft jail and they are starting to break out! It's up to you to save the Earth ... AGAIN!! Only this time you have to be sure to destroy all monsters and I meal all of them, if you miss even one the Earth is doomed and nobody shall ever lay with you. Good luck!


Download it here -- http://www.levelgame.net/doom/elevator.wad

I don't have time to play the whole thing tonight but I just started it and got the blue key. One comment so far: I really like how you did that raising lift that starts low and then gets higher (at first I was scratching my head thinking, why the hell is there this dinky little lift to nowhere).

 

[Clippy]

I don't have time to play the whole thing tonight but I just started it and got the blue key. One comment so far: I really like how you did that raising lift that starts low and then gets higher (at first I was scratching my head at first thinking, why the hell is there this dinky little lift to nowhere).

Thanks friend

I just replaced the original link with hopefully the final update. I just play tested it and think I fix the last minor little thing I wasn't happy with

Say I think it's all ready to go for sure

It's definitely a little bit puzzle like. And there's certain ways to approach things that will be beneficial

I had a lot of fun making it

 

[JBSchroeds]

Thanks friend

I just replaced the original link with hopefully the final update. I just play tested it and think I fix the last minor little thing I wasn't happy with

Say I think it's all ready to go for sure

It's definitely a little bit puzzle like. And there's certain ways to approach things that will be beneficial

I had a lot of fun making it

Alright, got all the keys and made it to the big exterior area and died a dozen times before deciding I just was NOT having any fun anymore and gave up. I was playing on UV and the difference in difficulty between the entire level up to that point and then the big monster mash at the end is like night-and-day. Part of the problem might be that I have basically zero experience with that kind of level, and I also only found ~6 of the secrets so I was probably under-geared. I assume the Archvile protecting the BFG is a secret somewhere since that tan door on the exterior doesn't open when you press it?

I liked it up until then, but the finale soured the experience something fierce. Probably will just go back on god-mode to finish it and hunt for secrets, but the fun is dead.

EDIT: Finished it on god mode and did a clipping hunt for all the secrets. I had to go into the editor and I still could figure out how you're supposed to get to a couple of them. Might have to replay it on easy to try and figure it out; there's so many moving parts it can be hard to read in the editor.

 

[Law Talkin’ Guy]

but the fun is dead.

Yikes, that’s quite the criticism.

@TheWorm

So I played this on Thursday night. I was a little disappointed. I didn’t really like it as much as Knee Deep in the Dead or Sigil. It was also stupidly hard. I wanted to finish it before going to bed so I actually ended up relying on cheats to get through it. I’d like to try maybe an honest run through of episode 1 start to finish but with it in place of the original M8 and see how it goes, but a pistol start for me just wasn’t going well on ultraviolence.

You'll want ZDoom Launcher (ZDL). There's a few different versions, with this one being the most recently updated. ZDL lets you choose which IWAD you want (Ultimate, D2, etc), which source port you're using, and then any other WADs you want to run on top of those. It makes using multiple wads a lot easier when you've got stuff like upgraded soundtracks, multiple texture enhancements, and gameplay mods that you all want to run together. You can add everything to the list and then activate or deactivate them as you wish. So if you've got a bunch of levels you want to try you can add all of them to a list and only activate the one you want to play at that time.

Now, if all you want to do is play a specific level without any other addons you can just click-and-drag the WAD onto the icon for the GZDoom executable and it will run with just that WAD, no additional software required.

For mod's you might want to consider:
IDKFA Soundtrack - Doom 1's soundtrack remastered on full instrumentation. Sounds great and is true to the original.
Doom Neural Upscale 2x - This project used an AI upscaler to upscale everything (textures, sprites, text, etc) by 8x, it was then hand cleaned of graphical artifacts, and then scaled back down to 2x. So everything in the game is double the resolution, which helps a lot on modern high-res screens. Honestly, you can get very similar results by using GZDoom's texture scaling options, but doing it dynamically in-engine like that takes up a lot of resources so having it "pre-baked" will make the game run more smoothly.
DHTP Alterations - This is an alternative texture pack that redoes all the game's textures (but not sprites) basically from scratch. There are three different versions of this pack with Alterations being the closest to the look of the originals. If you've played a lot of Doom then this will make the game look noticeably different, but I like it: it makes playing at 1440p feel like an HD experience.

Oh, and one last thing: make sure texture filtering is turned off (Display Options>Texture Options>Texture Filtering mode>none), it can look terrible in a lot of cases. You'll also want to play with the lighting and find one that works for you (Display Options>Hardware Rendering Options>Sector Light Mode). IIRC it defaults to "Dark" but I found that to be unplayable on some maps and nothing like how I remembered playing ~25 years ago. "Software" is the one that matches my memory of the game the closest.

I couldn’t get zdoom launcher running for me. Got some kind of error about a .dll file missing on my system or something.

 

[JBSchroeds]

Yikes, that’s quite the criticism.

Disappointing too because I really enjoyed the layout with the raising elevator up until then. If it weren't for the monster-mash and how convoluted some of those secrets are I would have thought it was a really solid experience.

I couldn’t get zdoom launcher running for me. Got some kind of error about a .dll file missing on my system or something.

You're probably missing the redist you need to run it: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=8328