Economy BOOOOM! *** 4.1% GDP!!! *** US Economy Explodes

[The Diplomat]

I feel bad for Obama, he just never could get the handle on economics. And that was with massive quantitative easing

Obama had to deal with Bush's economy/war and a recession that rocked the entire planet. Out of all the nations, America ended up the strongest. You can't say that Obama didn't leave Trump a growing economy.

 

[Ranzou**]

Now cut spending and we'll be good.

Until spending is significantly cut Trump's economic policy is simply not good, all in on the short term with no concern for the future.

I agree with you here. I am not above criticizing the guy i voted for. Spending was the one campaign promise he is so far not delivering.

That being said, unfortunately for you it's going to be social welfare programs that get the axe.

 

[SBJJ]

right.

because a lot of people reasonably see this as BS by kim. gets his picture taken with moon and trump. uses those pictures in his domestic propaganda. promises a bunch of shit that he never actually does. like giving away his ONLY bargaining chip.

people arent unreasonable, or hating america, for question whether this is legit or not. youre confused. too much fox maybe.

SK & Japan seem to disagree with you

The families of the 55 servicemen whose remains are on their way probably disagree with u

The families of the 3 hostages now home probably disagree with u

I understand you think this is like ordering a coffee at Starbucks and you want to see max results or you will start to bitch. But it’s not the way these things happen. Peace doesn’t just happen overnight after decades of hate & distrust

I understand why Jack thinks the way he does. Any good news helps his tribe. You notice he can never say anything good about the other side. You can be better than that. Hate Trump all you want but don’t let it make u blind

 

[Jack V Savage]

I agree with you on this, but to be fair @Jack V Savage was very reasonable and understanding when I discussed this with him.

Yeah, SBJJ has a grudge.

My general view is that the process of developing a position is more important than the position, and too many people here just have a position that they try to rationalize rather than a process that they believe in.

 

[JonnyRingo84]

SK & Japan seem to disagree with you

The families of the 55 servicemen whose remains are on their way probably disagree with u

The families of the 3 hostages now home probably disagree with u

I understand you think this is like ordering a coffee at Starbucks and you want to see max results or you will start to bitch. But it’s not the way these things happen. Peace doesn’t just happen overnight after decades of hate & distrust

I understand why Jack thinks the way he does. Any good news helps his tribe. You notice he can never say anything good about the other side. You can be better than that. Hate Trump all you want but don’t let it make u blind

maybe its a change in NK policy. that would be great.

maybe trump and kim BOTH used the event as a photo op for their domestic audience?

only time will tell. we're not bad people, or america haters, for suspecting that the latter might be true.

 

[JonnyRingo84]

Why would you think I watch Fox news? I'm not a republican if that's what you're implying as I think they are equally as full of it as the lefties depending on the subject. I have different opinions on different topics. Sometimes I side with your guys, sometimes the other guys.

youre part of the solution then.

With that being said, I don't disagree that Kim didn't use the exposure. Of course he did, who wouldn't right? I'm not convinced that it was fluff and he'll do nothing though. If he actually does do absolutely nothing and stockpiles even more nukes it would be an incredible fail by Trump and his administration. Until that happens however I'll monitor and see if they hold true and make more steps towards denuke. You seem convinced that it won't happen, but that's an assumption that ultimately can easily end up wrong.

im monitoring too. what im arguing against are the people already assuming its a done deal. give trump the nobel prize. criticize the iran deal lol. blow kim. hes giving away his only bargaining chip for seemingly no reason. Ok? why? maybe he is.....i just dont understand why yet. it seems more likely to me that hes just using us for propaganda, and daddy trump is probably doing the same. when it all falls through, theyll both point at the other guy, but still benefit from the propaganda.

What I think crosses the line of unreasonable, is hating things before the full context is even received. Hating the mere mention of a peace summit before details are even given is irrational. That's as black and white as it gets.

well a lot of people reasonably see meeting with kim as a bad move. hes done nothing to deserve such a meeting. 60 years of R and D presidents agree with that statement. they must earn such opportunities for propaganda. no?

 

[SBJJ]

Agreed that it can't even be argued. On what basis would anyone say that there's been progress? And you realize that every other world leader knows how Trump operates and that he can be manipulated with flattery, right?

I agree with you on this, but to be fair @Jack V Savage was very reasonable and understanding when I discussed this with him.

MmaGod. Please see above post. If you agree with my post that SOME progress has been made then you must think saying NO progress has been made is being partisan. But yes he has been understanding with you

Refusing to admit ANY progress has been made is the definition of partisan. It would be just like a poster coming in and saying ALL needs to be done is done.

 

[Jack V Savage]

MmaGod. Please see above post.

Refusing to admit ANY progress has been made is the definition of partisan. It would be just like a poster coming in and saying ALL needs to be done is done.

I don't think you know what "partisan" means. It doesn't mean "anything SBJJ disagrees with." What is your basis for thinking there has been progress?

 

[SBJJ]

maybe its a change in NK policy. that would be great.

maybe trump and kim BOTH used the event as a photo op for their domestic audience?

only time will tell. we're not bad people, or america haters, for suspecting that the latter might be true.

Of course not. But saying NO progress has been made is 100% wrong and partisan

 

[SBJJ]

I don't think you know what "partisan" means. It doesn't mean "anything SBJJ disagrees with." What is your basis for thinking there has been progress?

I listed them. You just do not actually read people’s post.

Partisan is not giving a president any credit ONLY because he’s not on your side. You WOULD give credit if Obama was president. As would I, because I’m not partisan.

I was glad Obama talked to Iran & Cuba

 

[JonnyRingo84]

Of course not. But saying NO progress has been made is 100% wrong and partisan

yea.

theyve given some remains back. thats great.

they seem to have dismantled a lot of a key nuke site. however, theyre also increasing nuke fuel being produced at another. so....its difficult to discern what kim's real intention was with meeting with trump and moon...............................................................for some of us.

 

[Ultra O’Dia]

yea.

theyve given some remains back. thats great.

they seem to have dismantled a lot of a key nuke site. however, theyre also increasing nuke fuel being produced at another. so....its difficult to discern what kim's real intention was with meeting with trump and moon...............................................................for some of us.

Is it more than you expected?

 

[JonnyRingo84]

Is it more than you expected?

no. imo, kim hasnt really done that much yet.

that isnt an attack on trump. he very well COULD do more. but as of yet, hes done very little that actually costs him.

 

[SBJJ]

yea.

theyve given some remains back. thats great.

they seem to have dismantled a lot of a key nuke site. however, theyre also increasing nuke fuel being produced at another. so....its difficult to discern what kim's real intention was with meeting with trump and moon...............................................................for some of us.

You have to look at it from Kim’s perspective. Would u in his place just do everything without reassurances? Please look at Libya

 

[Ultra O’Dia]

no. imo, kim hasnt really done that much yet.

that isnt an attack on trump. he very well COULD do more. but as of yet, hes done very little that actually costs him.

See, if two years ago when we were mocking Trump, someone predicted that he would even be negotiating denuclearization with Un, I would have laughed.
My money says nothing great will happen, but I am still a bit impressed.

 

[JonnyRingo84]

When spelled out I can understand what you're saying better now. Yea I think it has potential to fallout. A lot of people forget when Bush tried and we had supposed progress but then the bottom fell out. Though I'm optimistic this time Kim might hold up. Obviously it would be a "deal" in the sense of it being a trade off, and if all goes well over time we're looking at a solid decision. I'd rather take the stance of great move until the move isn't great. A part of me believes it almost has to be a success at this stage. Would be too massive of a failure if it fell through.

I dunno if you saw my convo with Jack before, but I was all on board for this meeting when Obama was around and he was getting massively criticized for pushing the issue as well. My stance is communication first, so I support the most attempts to diffuse tension through more and more communication. The main part I disagreed with was antagonizing Kim, incredibly dumb move, but I'm all for face to face meetings and negotiations. I don't mind "recognizing" him so to say, if the path of communication leads to deescalation.

fair enough.

i do like the idea of trying to isolate and undermine him. that seems like a reasonable plan to me. however, that hasnt worked as of yet. so...i dont think trump crazy for doing what he did. i do question the true motives of all involved, though. moon, kim, and trump will benefit politically with their base regardless of what happens lol. domestically, that makes great sense even if you have no true intentions of solving a damn thing.

im also not convinced that SK wants a free NK. good god. theyd be on the hook for BILLIONS to rehab those people. the syrian refugee "crisis" would look like a holiday. its a complicated situation that id like to see work out for the NK people. im just not ready to blow trump and say everything is wrapped up and done, all thanks to daddy.

 

[Jack V Savage]

I listed them. You just do not actually read people’s post.

Partisan is not giving a president any credit ONLY because he’s not on your side. You WOULD give credit if Obama was president. As would I, because I’m not partisan.

I was glad Obama talked to Iran & Cuba

Partisan is putting party before process.

My general view on foreign policy is that I know more than most people who spout off here, but not enough to have strong opinions. I was open to the idea of meeting without preconditions but also to the criticisms of it. The problem I see here is that Trump used it to try to just get things back to where they were before he started saber-rattling, and also conceded on exercises without getting anything. Seems that we're worse off than we were before he started mouthing off.

 

[JonnyRingo84]

You have to look at it from Kim’s perspective. Would u in his place just do everything without reassurances? Please look at Libya

kim has nukes. the usa will not attack him with nukes. why would he give them up?

 

[JonnyRingo84]

See, if two years ago when we were mocking Trump, someone predicted that he would even be negotiating denuclearization with Un, I would have laughed.
My money says nothing great will happen, but I am still a bit impressed.

thats one way of looking at it.

others see it as kim playing him. the kims have tried for decades to be given photo ops with an american pres. every republican and democrat before trump said that there were conditions. trump met and slapped him on the back and smiled. will it be worth it? maybe. but its reasonable to argue either side of it at this point.

 

[SBJJ]

When spelled out I can understand what you're saying better now. Yea I think it has potential to fallout. A lot of people forget when Bush tried and we had supposed progress but then the bottom fell out. Though I'm optimistic this time Kim might hold up. Obviously it would be a "deal" in the sense of it being a trade off, and if all goes well over time we're looking at a solid decision. I'd rather take the stance of great move until the move isn't great. A part of me believes it almost has to be a success at this stage. Would be too massive of a failure if it fell through.

I dunno if you saw my convo with Jack before, but I was all on board for this meeting when Obama was around and he was getting massively criticized for pushing the issue as well. My stance is communication first, so I support the most attempts to diffuse tension through more and more communication. The main part I disagreed with was antagonizing Kim, incredibly dumb move, but I'm all for face to face meetings and negotiations. I don't mind "recognizing" him so to say, if the path of communication leads to deescalation.

Oh yea. The GOP was horrible during Obama.

Sadly the NeoCons didn’t just die off. It seems they’ve switched sides