Opinion Beyond the Myth of Rural America

Used to be common, especially in the south to kill a pig, and eat nothing but it and corn, with no flavoring but maybe some molasses poured over all of it for a month or more. One thing that's kind of separate but related to this thread that a lot of people don't realize is how recently a lot of "traditional" food was invented--and this applies to other countries too. Even simple fried chicken was new in America in the mid-1800s.

Most of the time it was salt cured so even with removing the outer salt layer its still has a very salt taste.

Poor ate this basically 3 times a day in some form. That is along with wild game and chicken. Chicken was the Sunday dinner.

Corn bread, flat bread and biscuits were the normal addition.

Coffee with canned milk were a staple.

Breakfast for kids could be leftover biscuits with coffee heavy dose of canned milk pored over them was also normal for kids along with fried ham.

Old saying was you ate everything but the oink and the ass hole.

Source: growing up much of the time with my grandmother that was poor share cropers wife with 16 children.
 
The 1920 census marked the first time that urbanites made up a majority of the nation’s population, and city dwellers weren’t humble about their ascendance. New magazines like H. L. Mencken’s The American Mercury (founded in 1924) and, indeed, this one (founded in 1925) touted metropolitan virtues with more than a touch of snobbery. “Main Street,” Sinclair Lewis’s best-selling novel from 1920, captured the tone. “There was no dignity” in small-town life, its protagonist reflects, only “a savorless people, gulping tasteless food, and sitting afterward, coatless and thoughtless, in rocking-chairs prickly with inane decorations.”



“. . . historian Steven Conn. . . argues that the rural United States is, in fact, highly artificial. Its inhabitants are as much creatures of state power and industrial capitalism as their city-dwelling counterparts. But we rarely acknowledge this, Conn writes, because many of us—urban and rural, on the left and the right—‘don’t quite want it to be true.’”



Settlers styled themselves as pioneers who had won their land with their bare hands. This is how it went in “Little House on the Prairie,” with the frontier family racing ahead of the law to seize Indian property. (“Little Squatter on the Osage Diminished Reserve” would have been a more accurate title, the literary scholar Frances W. Kaye has archly suggested.) Yet in the end land ownership came, directly or indirectly, from the state. The Homestead Act of 1862, along with its successors, gridded up and gave away an area the size of Pakistan. And although homesteading sounds like a relic from the sepia-toned past, its most active period came, the historian Sara Gregg has pointed out, in the twentieth century. The final homesteader got his land in 1988.”





“In truth, the ostensible norm, household farming, was a transitional phase—surprisingly brief, in many places—between Indigenous and industrial.

If small, rugged farms have not filled the countryside, what has? . . . For the past century, rural spaces have been preferred destinations for military bases, discount retail chains, extractive industries, manufacturing plants, and real-estate developments.”



“Rural people are a fifth of the population yet punch well above their weight in elections. The constitutional allocation of two senators for every state gives low-density states outsized representation.”

New Yorker


Did a lot of driving this summer, mostly for pleasure, and the countryside is full of Dollar Generals — from plains to sea — all across the country. I have a place near farmland too, and, yes, I prefer the quiet to that of city life, but financial life is bleak for its mostly non-farm working people, with four or five dollar stores to support everyone in the area. Yet, as the article quoted above indicates, we still see rural life through rose colored glasses, harkening back to a time that was short in years: 1930’s rural life. Time for us and them to wake up — we are in this together,
and our differences in ideology boils down to a couple of questions.

I grew up in a city in a very large urban area. Later when I had kids I moved out to the country five hours from the nearest city to raise them. It was everything I could have hoped for from small town America safe, beautiful natural environment, wonderful public schools, awesome farmers markets and a close knit community with a ton of activities for children. Both my kids went on to graduate from great colleges.

My personal experience is the opposite of what you delineate and I definitely believe the small town dream still exists.

This being said, life is getting harder and harder. It seems very difficult right now for a lot of people to just tread water and that makes folks desperate and angry.
 
Most of the time it was salt cured so even with removing the outer salt layer its still has a very salt taste.

Poor ate this basically 3 times a day in some form. That is along with wild game and chicken. Chicken was the Sunday dinner.

Corn bread, flat bread and biscuits were the normal addition.

Coffee with canned milk were a staple.

Breakfast for kids could be leftover biscuits with coffee heavy dose of canned milk pored over them was also normal for kids along with fried ham.

Old saying was you ate everything but the oink and the ass hole.

Source: growing up much of the time with my grandmother that was poor share cropers wife with 16 children.

Awesome to get a first-hand account of that stuff.

One source for me (and then I followed up on some stuff) was Robert Gordon's The Rise and Fall of American Growth. The thesis is kind of that the amazing economic growth we saw from 1870 to 1970 was unprecedented in human history and not something we should expect to continue. Work of economic history, mostly, but in the process of describing it, there are a lot of interesting stats and stories about life in earlier periods. Gordon actually stays away from the South in the earlier periods because it was still devastated by the war so it's a bit misleading if you're trying to look at progress. Impossible to imagine life in 1870, really. A lot of stuff is obvious, but other stuff might be less so (for example, no microphones, so singing styles had to be more projected).
 
This being said, life is getting harder and harder. It seems very difficult right now for a lot of people to just tread water and that makes folks desperate and angry.

See, I really disagree with this. Life today is just incredibly easy. People have no idea how hard life used to be. Just wearing clean clothes every day and having a toilet is an incredible privilege that most humans in history would dream of. Same with being able to hear whatever song you want whenever you want. If you told people 100 years ago that we had that option, they would imagine we're living in paradise. Wasn't that long ago that one in five kids died before they turned five.
 
I think the comparisons being drawn are between really big cities like NYC and LA and the unincorporated areas between all the cities and towns. It is easy to paint a bleak picture of rural life when you are looking at the tail end of the bell curve. The majority of America is in between. I came from a small "city" in Ohio, <50,000 when I was growing up. It was the county seat, hosted the county fair, and housed 3 or 4 (maybe a few smaller ones too) factories. Our house was on the city limits with fields and farms in sight. People from the numerous smaller towns would come in to work in the factories, shop, eat at restaurants, or catch a movie. The farmland was dotted with not only outright farmhouses, but houses on small plots in amongst the farms. My uncles and cousins would operate smaller farms while working shifts at the factory. And Ohio was/is littered with mid-size places like that (as are most of the 46 states I've visited) that anchor the rural area and give them the things this article contends they lack.
Yes, those bleak places exist. But no one believes that economic depression only occurs outside city limits, do they?
 
I think variety is the proverbial spice of life and doing both for some time is the best way to do it and seeing what works for you.

Big world class cities are great, but often your enjoyment is a disproportionate direct function of how much money you make versus other places. And also they're so busy they get interpersonally cold with the fake it til you make it crowd. Rural areas are good for the soul a lot of the time, but simply put, life can get boring.

Me personally, I find southern food rather disappointing. As a travel bug, I use to watch Anthony Bourdain's Parts Unknown all the time, was sad when he died, and he said Japan is the number 1 food place. I really disagree to be honest, though I will commend you can great food for a super reasonable price. Going up the price curve in Japan often gives marginal improvements, unlike western restaurants. But they make too much stuff that is just gross to me.

I think all things considered, Peru/Bolivia is the best food in the world all things considered. The variety, freshness, the seasoning etc, they just make great food with all sorts of finesse at basic prices. Places like Sri Lanka, India, Turkey etc have some great dishes but variety lacks tremendously. Mexican wins for me though in terms of food that the Americanized version is way worse than the local version. I seldom like ever going to Mexican restaurants, but the one's in Mexico, even just cheap-ass taco places, are bloody delicious.

I was a fan of Bourdain’s shows, too. No Reservations being the best, especially the early seasons; although when he moved to CNN the production quality dramatically improved, and they could do themed shows. He went to Japan a lot, but I wonder if he traveled to France more often (for the show). (Also, it’s clear in the later seasons that Anthony was out of it, because those shows weren’t very good.)

I probably have an opinion you’ll hate though: I prefer American style Mexican food to the real thing.

As far as food, I prefer French. It’s a myth that you need to spend a lot in order to find quality, especially in the countryside. Lebanese, Polish, and then Danish, in that order.
 
Lol, I don't think I could last two months in NYC. Tampa was enough congestion for me :)

Only "the bridge and tunnel crowd" and cabs deal with congestion. New Yorkers don't have cars. However, everyone in Queens and Brooklyn has a brother or cousin who has a car they can borrow (which always falls through).

the-more-you-know.gif
 
I was a fan of Bourdain’s shows, too. No Reservations being the best, especially the early seasons; although when he moved to CNN the production quality dramatically improved, and they could do themed shows. He went to Japan a lot, but I wonder if he traveled to France more often (for the show). (Also, it’s clear in the later seasons that Anthony was out of it, because those shows weren’t very good.)

I probably have an opinion you’ll hate though: I prefer American style Mexican food to the real thing.

As far as food, I prefer French. It’s a myth that you need to spend a lot in order to find quality, especially in the countryside. Lebanese, Polish, and then Danish, in that order.

I think japan and france have the most michelin starred restaurants, so wouldn't be surprised if those were two of his most popular destinations. French is amazing technically but it doesn't seem to have the same heart to me. And yes, I hate your opinion lol.
 
The 1920 census marked the first time that urbanites made up a majority of the nation’s population, and city dwellers weren’t humble about their ascendance. New magazines like H. L. Mencken’s The American Mercury (founded in 1924) and, indeed, this one (founded in 1925) touted metropolitan virtues with more than a touch of snobbery. “Main Street,” Sinclair Lewis’s best-selling novel from 1920, captured the tone. “There was no dignity” in small-town life, its protagonist reflects, only “a savorless people, gulping tasteless food, and sitting afterward, coatless and thoughtless, in rocking-chairs prickly with inane decorations.”



“. . . historian Steven Conn. . . argues that the rural United States is, in fact, highly artificial. Its inhabitants are as much creatures of state power and industrial capitalism as their city-dwelling counterparts. But we rarely acknowledge this, Conn writes, because many of us—urban and rural, on the left and the right—‘don’t quite want it to be true.’”



Settlers styled themselves as pioneers who had won their land with their bare hands. This is how it went in “Little House on the Prairie,” with the frontier family racing ahead of the law to seize Indian property. (“Little Squatter on the Osage Diminished Reserve” would have been a more accurate title, the literary scholar Frances W. Kaye has archly suggested.) Yet in the end land ownership came, directly or indirectly, from the state. The Homestead Act of 1862, along with its successors, gridded up and gave away an area the size of Pakistan. And although homesteading sounds like a relic from the sepia-toned past, its most active period came, the historian Sara Gregg has pointed out, in the twentieth century. The final homesteader got his land in 1988.”





“In truth, the ostensible norm, household farming, was a transitional phase—surprisingly brief, in many places—between Indigenous and industrial.

If small, rugged farms have not filled the countryside, what has? . . . For the past century, rural spaces have been preferred destinations for military bases, discount retail chains, extractive industries, manufacturing plants, and real-estate developments.”



“Rural people are a fifth of the population yet punch well above their weight in elections. The constitutional allocation of two senators for every state gives low-density states outsized representation.”

New Yorker


Did a lot of driving this summer, mostly for pleasure, and the countryside is full of Dollar Generals — from plains to sea — all across the country. I have a place near farmland too, and, yes, I prefer the quiet to that of city life, but financial life is bleak for its mostly non-farm working people, with four or five dollar stores to support everyone in the area. Yet, as the article quoted above indicates, we still see rural life through rose colored glasses, harkening back to a time that was short in years: 1930’s rural life. Time for us and them to wake up — we are in this together,
and our differences in ideology boils down to a couple of questions.


So people who don’t live in cities are dumb and shouldn’t vote. Got it. Very original.
 
I think nothing compares to living in a real city (like NYC or SF), but rural living somewhere with nice weather is probably better than a second-rate city.
life in a “real city” is fucked. They are great places to visit sometimes, but cities are full of people and most people suck. Since i moved to the mountains I dont miss having neighbors, thats for sure. plenty of space on my property to do whatever the fuck I want, and nobody around to complain. Also very little crime , i literally leave my front door open all day and night in the summer. Never lock my car.

My surroundings are natural and beautiful and on a clear night i can go lie down on my roof and see the milky-way galaxy and all the constellations, and dozens of shooting stars. I can drive 20 miles to find giant sequoias and massive waterfalls..

I thought covid / lockdowns would wake people up to the shitty reality of life in a big city but they are still clinging to their cities like drowning rats. Most of them arent even taking advantage of their city’s museums, fine dining, sophisticated culture…. They work all day , sit in traffic, then go home to watch TV and make a frozen pizza. If they want entertainment they go to a movie theater for the latest transformers garbage. If they feel like socializing they go to dive bars. They splurge on grubhub or uber eats.
 
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Grew up in rural Canada. There's definitely some upsides to having less people around, but generally I hate small towns like the one I grew up in.

I live in Montreal now and I love it, the only thing I would trade it for would be someplace isolated in the woods surrounded by no one but my best friends.
 
I think a lot of people don't really internalize the difference between small town America and rural America. Small town America is still very different from rural America, even though the population is small and they're not near major urban areas.
 
Deep fried everything is more of a Southern thing than a rural thing.

For a certain demo as well...

Its fucking delicious though. I try to limit my Cajun cuisine to a few times per year.

But not unlike Bubba from Forrest Gump, I've tried all of these at least once, several many times

- Fried Chicken
- Chicken Fried Steak
- Fried Catfish
- Fried Gator
- Fried Boudin Balls
- Fried Pickles
- Fried Tomatoes
- Fried Oysters
- Fried Oreos
- Fried Ice Cream
- Fried Shrimp
- Fried any vegetable - Potatos, Onions, squash, sweet potato
- Fried twinkies
- Funnel Cake

That's all I got off the top of my head
 
For a certain demo as well...

Its fucking delicious though. I try to limit my Cajun cuisine to a few times per year.

But not unlike Bubba from Forrest Gump, I've tried all of these at least once, several many times

- Fried Chicken
- Chicken Fried Steak
- Fried Catfish
- Fried Gator
- Fried Boudin Balls
- Fried Pickles
- Fried Tomatoes
- Fried Oysters
- Fried Oreos
- Fried Ice Cream
- Fried Shrimp
- Fried any vegetable - Potatos, Onions, squash, sweet potato
- Fried twinkies
- Funnel Cake

That's all I got off the top of my head

Fried gator seems like a one try deal
 
Peter Santello did a whole video series talking with Appalachian miners. They talk life and struggles they deal with.



Shit. As a frenchman living in one of the most beautiful part of its country I have to say that americans are really blessed by all the pristine nature they have there.
 
See, I really disagree with this. Life today is just incredibly easy. People have no idea how hard life used to be. Just wearing clean clothes every day and having a toilet is an incredible privilege that most humans in history would dream of. Same with being able to hear whatever song you want whenever you want. If you told people 100 years ago that we had that option, they would imagine we're living in paradise. Wasn't that long ago that one in five kids died before they turned five.


Who is comparing life today to life in the 1600's? I'm talking about today compared to 30 years ago. Where borderline boomers like yourself were able to get landed and established in the careers, raise a family, build wealth.

I can't be the only one that thinks it's much harder today than it was 30 years ago.
 
I find it funny that the citizens of New York City keep voting for policies that make their lives harder, then are proud of the fact they can survive the self inflicted suffering...it's like shooting yourself in the foot then wanting credit for toughing it out and walking a mile...
 
Who is comparing life today to life in the 1600's?

I'm thinking all of history. Life is incredibly easy now compared to any other time.

I'm talking about today compared to 30 years ago. Where borderline boomers like yourself were able to get landed and established in the careers, raise a family, build wealth.

:) How old do you think I am, man? Never been a better time to enter the workforce than now, really. Millennials (and I'm a borderline Millennial rather than a borderline Boomer) are better off than any previous generation at the same age.
 
I find it funny that the citizens of New York City keep voting for policies that make their lives harder, then are proud of the fact they can survive the self inflicted suffering...it's like shooting yourself in the foot then wanting credit for toughing it out and walking a mile...

What policies are you referring to?
 
What policies are you referring to?

Sorry should have said voting people who create stupid policies, or never fix infrastructure.

The taxes are insane yet these are the worst roads I've ever driven on, despite constant construction.

Gun laws are shit

Gas prices are high, even though hundreds of miles away from the ocean it's cheaper...
 
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