Locked AVENGERS: END GAME v.2 (Super Bowl Spot)

[method115]

Even if we go by your example and have a similar situation where Captain Marvel single-handedly ends the threat like Tony did, it won't go over well. It was fine with Tony because the MCU started with him and he's the face. The audience had an emotional connection built up with Tony and it was a big deal that his character grew into someone who would sacrifice himself for everyone.

If a new hero, who the audience has nothing invested in, just showed up and did what Iron Man did, it would have been a WTF?


You don't know what "face of something" means? When people think of the MCU, they think of RDJ as Iron Man. That's what "face of the MCU" means. He's the most popular. He gets the biggest pops when he's on screen. If there are any WWF fans, think Stone Cold back in the Attitude Era.

And OF COURSE Tony being the face affects the quality of the movies he's in. Just imagine all the Avengers movies but take out Iron Man and ask yourself if it would be as good not having his charisma, character development and the action he brings as part of the movie.

I wouldn't have any issue if Captain Marvel got the final blow it wouldn't bother me as long as it's a team effort because that's what it's all about. If people watch End Game and all they care about is who finishes Thanos off then I don't know what to say that doesn't mean much to me.

As far as the face of the MCU that's the thing is to me I don't think of Tony when I think of the MCU. There are so many characters that are part of the MCU and Iron Man hasn't had a movie in 6 years. He's just not what I think of when I think of the MCU. I guess most people do I wouldn't really know I don't ask people who they think about when they think MCU. When I think of the MCU I think of everyone who is part of it. I don't just picture one character.

 

[Horse Style]

I wouldn't have any issue if Captain Marvel got the final blow it wouldn't bother me as long as it's a team effort because that's what it's all about. If people watch End Game and all they care about is who finishes Thanos off then I don't know what to say that doesn't mean much to me.

As far as the face of the MCU that's the thing is to me I don't think of Tony when I think of the MCU. There are so many characters that are part of the MCU and Iron Man hasn't had a movie in 6 years. He's just not what I think of when I think of the MCU. I guess most people do I wouldn't really know I don't ask people who they think about when they think MCU. When I think of the MCU I think of everyone who is part of it. I don't just picture one character.

It's fine if you have no problem and you don't think of Tony as the face because most of the fanbase does.

That's why most people were satisfied Tony was the one to stop the Chituari. That's why most people were satisfied when Tony was the one, along with Thor, to stop Ultron's meteor from destroying the planet. That's why Civil War was such an emotional movie for the fan because of Tony and Cap having a falling out. See the common factor?

The success of Iron Man gave them the confidence to use Iron Man 2 as a vehicle to expand into a connected universe by incorporating Nick Fury, Black Widow and the rest of Shield.

Why do you think RDJ is the highest paid, by far, out of all the cast? He's just THAT popular and the fans love him. His image is a major selling point for the MCU and it didn't happen overnight.

Bro, all the evidence is there and if still can't see it, I can't help ya

 

[method115]

It's fine if you have no problem and you don't think of Tony as the face because most of the fanbase does.

That's why most people were satisfied Tony was the one to stop the Chituari. That's why most people were satisfied when Tony was the one, along with Thor, to stop Ultron's meteor from destroying the planet. That's why Civil War was such an emotional movie for the fan because of Tony and Cap having a falling out. See the common factor?

The success of Iron Man gave them the confidence to use Iron Man 2 as a vehicle to expand into a connected universe by incorporating Nick Fury, Black Widow and the rest of Shield.

Why do you think RDJ is the highest paid, by far, out of all the cast? He's just THAT popular and the fans love him. His image is a major selling point for the MCU and it didn't happen overnight.

Bro, all the evidence is there and if still can't see it, I can't help ya

I can't see it because it's just not how I see the MCU. If the fan base does that's fine I have no issue with that or argument against it, it makes sense he's a very likable character. At the end of the day we just need to sit back and see what happens. They created this universe that everyone loves and now everyone wants to doubt their vision for the future simply because it's a female who will be taking the lead. If it was another white male taking the lead I doubt anyone would be bringing up the same arguments about "forcing" anything. It's only because she's a girl that this doubt is even happening.

 

[MikeMcMann]

I think it breaks down into 4 type of groups:

30%- "I thought Black Panther was the best Marvel movie ever and one of the best films of all time", type of group

30%- "I thought BP was a very good movie and one of the better Marvel movies to date", type of group

30%- "I thought BP was good to just okay", type of group

10%- "I thought the movie was overrated SJW garbage being pushed on us for the sake of diversity", type of group

I think the people you are talking about are the last group but as you can see they are a smaller group by far than the first 3. There's a saying that the most ignorant voice in the room tends to be the loudest voice in the room. Those other folks have some influence but not as much as we think. BP grossed over a billion dollars because of the first 3 groups of people and not the last one. Numbers always tell the 'real' story.

And China can now drive box office such that a movie considered a failure in N.American box office can become a success in International numbers.

Why should that rustle anyone?

WHy should Hollywood chasing a formula that panders to the Chinese audience in a percent of movies matter even if they stumble and stutter as they figure out this emerging audience?

I just don't understand the complaint??

The audience is changing. And as such Hollywood is trying to figure out how to pander to the emerging audience like they have done for a hundred years to the prior one, so much so that most of us cannot even recognize it when it happens.

 

[Horse Style]

They created this universe that everyone loves and now everyone wants to doubt their vision for the future simply because it's a female who will be taking the lead. If it was another white male taking the lead I doubt anyone would be bringing up the same arguments about "forcing" anything. It's only because she's a girl that this doubt is even happening.

And this is the number one reason why a lot of people have a problem with the female empowerment agenda. Any time someone brings up legitimate gripes for specific situations, you just marginalize the complaints by saying "oh, it's just because you have a problem with women and white males blah blah blah"

And that mentality doesn't make sense because Wonder Woman worked (and it didn't have this much apprehension to it before the movie came out) and the horror movie industry is still popular. 90% of horror movies ends with a woman surviving to the end and besting the killer, but you think people suddenly have a problem with female leads?

 

[method115]

And this is the number one reason why a lot of people have a problem with the female empowerment agenda. Any time someone brings up legitimate gripes for specific situations, you just marginalize the complaints by saying "oh, it's just because you have a problem with women and white males blah blah blah"

And that mentality doesn't make sense because Wonder Woman worked (and it didn't have this much apprehension to it before the movie came out) and the horror movie industry is still popular. 90% of horror movies ends with a woman surviving to the end and besting the killer, but you think people suddenly have a problem with female leads?

I never said you have a problem with women. I said these complaints wouldn't be happening if it wasn't for the fact that she's a women. Now everyone is thinking it's going to be some forced agenda crap instead of them just moving in that direction because they want to. Suddenly the people who create what is without a doubt the greatest movie universe that has ever been done can't be trusted to pass the torch properly. I don't think people have a problem with female leads. I think people have a tendency to quickly assume something is "pandering" or "forced" instead of giving it a chance before making these assumptions.

Also Wonder Women did have a lot of apprehension and was called "pandering" as well. It didn't have as much because DC just isn't as big and at that point DC was at an all time low with all the shitty DC movies they put out so one really cared.

 

[Horse Style]

I never said you have a problem with women. I said these complaints wouldn't be happening if it wasn't for the fact that she's a women. Now everyone is thinking it's going to be some forced agenda crap instead of them just moving in that direction because they want to. Suddenly the people who create what is without a doubt the greatest movie universe that has ever been done can't be trusted to pass the torch properly. I don't think people have a problem with female leads. I think people have a tendency to quickly assume something is "pandering" or "forced" instead of giving it a chance before making these assumptions.

They say she's going to come in, be the deciding factor against Thanos and be the new face. Fans have a problem and those fans are immediately branded as sexist when they bring up the complaint of this new hero coming out of nowhere and subverting the goodwill established by the OG Avengers.

Now why would they brand people as sexist for that if the fact that she's a woman wasn't a huge influence in this push?

Also Wonder Women did have a lot of apprehension and was called "pandering" as well. It didn't have as much because DC just isn't as big and at that point DC was at an all time low with all the shitty DC movies they put out so one really cared.

It didn't have this much apprehension. There were many, many people who said she was the best part of Batman vs Superman. That cameo made her popular and made a lot of people look forward to her solo movie.

There may have been a few people here and there that said Wonder Woman was "pandering" but it was nowhere near as much as Captain Marvel's intro into the MCU.

 

[GrandNewb]

The reason why adding Captain Marvel at this stage of the MCU is not good in terms of story is

Spoiler

her ability to time travel is nothing but a deus ex machina thrown in at the last minute. People who like good stories do not like deus ex machinas because it is simply lazy writing. We have seen the various characters throughout the past ten years go through struggles together and separately so that they can build their character to resolve the greatest threat they have ever faced. By throwing in a brand new character (to, let's face it, appeal to SJW "girl power" and profit off of them) and giving her this magic ability that is not present in her character in the comics is crappy, lazy writing. The whole Thanos plot might as well have been a dream dreamt by Dr. Strange. He wakes up one morning, realizes he had a terrible nightmare. Uses the time stone to go back and in time and kill Thanos when he is a baby. The end.

Therefore, I hope that what Samuel L. Jackson revealed was a bit of misdirection. If not, it will be disappointing for many.

 

[method115]

They say she's going to come in, be the deciding factor against Thanos and be the new face.

I don't know man just feels like people are making to much of these statements. They are so vague in what they mean that it just doesn't mean much to me. The deciding factor could be something as simple as she hits Thanos with a really powerful blow that stuns him and lets Thor get the final blow. The deciding factor could be giving the avengers an idea on how to stop Thanos. You do realize that would still be the deciding factor right?

As far as the face of the MCU. Strange, Ant Man, Spiderman, BP, all of these movies were still great and that's when Tony was the face of the MCU. Remove him as the face of the company and these movies are still great. I just don't think those statements are as big of a deal as your making them out to be. They'll still be able to make great Avenger movies without Tony hell even with Tony Ultron was still shit so they are 2/3 so far.

The reason why adding Captain Marvel at this stage of the MCU is not good in terms of story is

Spoiler

her ability to time travel is nothing but a deus ex machina thrown in at the last minute. People who like good stories do not like deus ex machinas because it is simply lazy writing. We have seen the various characters throughout the past ten years go through struggles together and separately so that they can build their character to resolve the greatest threat they have ever faced. By throwing in a brand new character (to, let's face it, appeal to SJW "girl power" and profit off of them) and giving her this magic ability that is not present in her character in the comics is crappy, lazy writing. The whole Thanos plot might as well have been a dream dreamt by Dr. Strange. He wakes up one morning, realizes he had a terrible nightmare. Uses the time stone to go back and in time and kill Thanos when he is a baby. The end.

Therefore, I hope that what Samuel L. Jackson revealed was a bit of misdirection. If not, it will be disappointing for many.

Are we sure this is what's going to happen though? Because in Ant Man they mentioned how you could get loss in time there.

 

[Horse Style]

I don't know man just feels like people are making to much of these statements. They are so vague in what they mean that it just doesn't mean much to me. The deciding factor could be something as simple as she hits Thanos with a really powerful blow that stuns him and lets Thor get the final blow. The deciding factor could be giving the avengers an idea on how to stop Thanos. You do realize that would still be the deciding factor right?

That's like saying the heads of Shield that operated in the shadows were the deciding factor in the first Avengers movie because they were the ones who launched the nuke.

As far as the face of the MCU. Strange, Ant Man, Spiderman, BP, all of these movies were still great and that's when Tony was the face of the MCU. Remove him as the face of the company and these movies are still great. I just don't think those statements are as big of a deal as your making them out to be. They'll still be able to make great Avenger movies without Tony hell even with Tony Ultron was still shit so they are 2/3 so far.

Just because he's the face doesn't mean he has to be in every MCU movie. No one can deny Stone Cold Steve Austin was the face of the WWF during the Attitude Era but that doesn't mean he was in every match, every storyline or that no one else mattered.

It means he's the most popular, his character brought in people to watch the WWF and his presence made the drama better. When his character was on its way out, interest in the WWF waned until they either built up another wrestler or pushed an already established popular wrestler as the new face of the company.

 

[method115]

That's like saying the heads of Shield that operated in the shadows were the deciding factor in the first Avengers movie because they were the ones who launched the nuke.


Just because he's the face doesn't mean he has to be in every MCU movie. No one can deny Stone Cold Steve Austin was the face of the WWF during the Attitude Era but that doesn't mean he was in every match, every storyline or that no one else mattered.

It means he's the most popular, his character brought in people to watch the WWF and his presence made the drama better. When his character was on its way out, interest in the WWF waned until they either built up another wrestler or pushed an already established popular wrestler as the new face of the company.

What I'm saying is that "deciding factor" has a very broad meaning. Just google the definition it can mean a lot.

Exactly that's my point they can still pump out great MCU movies without having a face as great as Tony. If some people lose interest because Tony's gone will that's more of a Disney\MCU problem I've enjoyed movies with and without Tony. IMO they should make someone else other than Marvel the face for reasons I've stated earlier (she'll be in space a bunch not on earth) but whatever. Not to mention they have X-men, and fantastic Four coming up. The future of the MCU is only looking better every day.

Now that I think about it once. X-men and Fantastic Four our introduced good luck being the face of anything in that universe. There will be so many heroes at that point.

 

[Magooglie]

The only way people will be happy is if Thanos wins again.

 

[heavyarms21]

The only way people will be happy is if Thanos wins again.

Or Lives

 

[minute bull]

 

[Horse Style]

What I'm saying is that "deciding factor" has a very broad meaning. Just google the definition it can mean a lot.

They wouldn't say she's a deciding factor unless it was something big.

Exactly that's my point they can still pump out great MCU movies without having a face as great as Tony. If some people lose interest because Tony's gone will that's more of a Disney\MCU problem I've enjoyed movies with and without Tony. IMO they should make someone else other than Marvel the face for reasons I've stated earlier (she'll be in space a bunch not on earth) but whatever. Not to mention they have X-men, and fantastic Four coming up. The future of the MCU is only looking better every day.

Now that I think about it once. X-men and Fantastic Four our introduced good luck being the face of anything in that universe. There will be so many heroes at that point.

No one ever said they couldn't make a good movie without Tony. You're misunderstand what "face of MCU" means. When they say she's going to be the face of the MCU going forward, they don't mean she's going to be in every movie.

It means out of everyone, she'll be getting the most exposure and she'll get the spotlight more than the others. They're deciding this even before her popularity has been established and that's risky because if she's not as popular as they hope, they'll have to change their plan or risk interest in the MCU plummeting.

Now why would they decide to push someone so hard before they know if the public likes her or not?

 

[method115]

They wouldn't say she's a deciding factor unless it was something big.


No one ever said they couldn't make a good movie without Tony. You're misunderstand what "face of MCU" means. When they say she's going to be the face of the MCU going forward, they don't mean she's going to be in every movie.

It means out of everyone, she'll be getting the most exposure and she'll get the spotlight more than the others. They're deciding this even before her popularity has been established and that's risky because if she's not as popular as they hope, they'll have to change their plan or risk interest in the MCU plummeting.

Now why would they decide to push someone so hard before they know if the public likes her or not?

Your assuming this could have been said to hype up her movie that's coming out soon.

I'll have to see how much "spotlight" she's actually getting. Like I said with Fantastic Four and X-men coming in plus all these other characters it's going to be hard for anyone to really stand out and it'll be easy enough to reverse course if the public doesn't approve. As far as why they would decide to push someone like this before they know if the public likes her or not? I don't know maybe they are that confident in her. They did create her movie and have interacted with her more than anyone on here so they would be the best to make that judgement. This is one of those things that you just have to trust that Marvel\Disney know what they are doing. They've shown me enough to have my trust.

 

[KnightTemplar]

It's fine if you have no problem and you don't think of Tony as the face because most of the fanbase does.

That's why most people were satisfied Tony was the one to stop the Chituari. That's why most people were satisfied when Tony was the one, along with Thor, to stop Ultron's meteor from destroying the planet. That's why Civil War was such an emotional movie for the fan because of Tony and Cap having a falling out. See the common factor?

The success of Iron Man gave them the confidence to use Iron Man 2 as a vehicle to expand into a connected universe by incorporating Nick Fury, Black Widow and the rest of Shield.

Why do you think RDJ is the highest paid, by far, out of all the cast? He's just THAT popular and the fans love him. His image is a major selling point for the MCU and it didn't happen overnight.

Bro, all the evidence is there and if still can't see it, I can't help ya

RDJ is the Godfather of Our Thing

 

[KnightTemplar]

The only way people will be happy is if Thanos wins again.

See my Av: they've got the Deadliest Avenger back on the team for the Endgame. Thanos is going to take an arrow to the knee.

Healthy, Motivated, Full Training Camp Hawkeye with That Ronin Look in his eyes>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>The Mad Titan

 

[Horse Style]

Your assuming this could have been said to hype up her movie that's coming out soon.

When actors and producers are interviewed about an upcoming movie, it's specifically to hype up the movie / star of the movie.

I'll have to see how much "spotlight" she's actually getting. Like I said with Fantastic Four and X-men coming in plus all these other characters it's going to be hard for anyone to really stand out and it'll be easy enough to reverse course if the public doesn't approve. As far as why they would decide to push someone like this before they know if the public likes her or not? I don't know maybe they are that confident in her. They did create her movie and have interacted with her more than anyone on here so they would be the best to make that judgement. This is one of those things that you just have to trust that Marvel\Disney know what they are doing. They've shown me enough to have my trust.

Confidence in a person isn't what dictates that. How much bank she brings in does.

 

[method115]

When actors and producers are interviewed about an upcoming movie, it's specifically to hype up the movie / star of the movie.

I worded that wrong. I meant to say that you're assuming that the deciding factor is big. Your saying they wouldn't say that unless it's big and I'm saying it could have been said because it's true and to hype up her movie. It doesn't automatically mean that's it's big.

Confidence in a person isn't what dictates that. How much bank she brings in does.

Yet they are making her the face of the MCU without knowing how much bank she brings in so clearly that's not true.