16 days until Obama leaves office

[Jack V Savage]

You'd call any tax cut on the rich deficit financed tax cuts.

I'd call any tax cut on the rich that was financed by deficits, deficit-financed tax cuts.

Hypothetically, let's say someone offered to cut the military budget by $100B annually and cut taxes on the lowest bracket by $100B. That would be a tax cut on everyone--including the rich--and wouldn't be deficit-financed.

And no I don't belive he will be writing checks to rich people. You mean to say the government won't be able to pry as much money from them which will hurt the deficit. How you portrayed it is incredibly doshonest

How I portrayed it is indisputably true. Just because you don't like a fact doesn't make it dishonest of someone to mention it.

 

[oleDirtyBast4rd]

Do you really think that simply because he has black skin, getting elected would turn him into Dr Martin Luther King?

I didn't say that did i?

 

[oleDirtyBast4rd]

I'd call any tax cut on the rich that was financed by deficits, deficit-financed tax cuts.



How I portrayed it is indisputably true. Just because you don't like a fact doesn't make it dishonest of someone to mention it.

Perhaps I'm more ignorant on the topic then I thought. A Google read left me feeling I had at least a basic grasp. From what I read, they talked about the deficit being hurt by tax cuts which seems obvious. I thought tax cut meant you paid less, not somebody else pays you. Are people being given money, or are they paying less?

 

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

I didn't say that did i?

You're asking why a black President isn't automatically the same kind of leader... because he's black.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Perhaps I'm more ignorant on the topic then I thought. A Google read left me feeling I had at least a basic grasp. From what I read, they talked about the deficit being hurt by tax cuts which seems obvious. I thought tax cut meant you paid less, not somebody else pays you. Are people being given money, or are they paying less?

Think it through. Let's say there's a proposal that people making $1M a year or more get a welfare check of $100K to, say, "incentivize job creators." The cost of the proposal to the public is the number of people making $1M-plus times $100K, and the benefit to the recipients is $100K per year. Now let's say someone else says, "let's structure it as a tax cut." So now, people making $1M a year or more get $100K back from taxes. The cost of the new proposal to the public is the number of people making $1M-plus times $100K, and the benefit to the recipients is $100K a year.

When it's financed with deficit, the proposal is "the public as a whole borrows money to give more to rich people." What's the benefit of that to everyone else?

 

[oleDirtyBast4rd]

You're asking why a black President isn't automatically the same kind of leader... because he's black.

I asked why Obama wasn't the same kind of leader as MLK? Please quote where I said such a thing. You aren't going to strawman me

 

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

I asked why Obama wasn't the same kind of leader as MLK? Please quote where I said such a thing. You aren't going to strawman me

Why wasn't George Bush the same kind of leader as JFK? They both were white after all.

Maybe I've missed the substance of your post but it sounds like your reasoning is flawed.

 

[oleDirtyBast4rd]

Think it through. Let's say there's a proposal that people making $1M a year or more get a welfare check of $100K to, say, "incentivize job creators." The cost of the proposal to the public is the number of people making $1M-plus times $100K, and the benefit to the recipients is $100K per year. Now let's say someone else says, "let's structure it as a tax cut." So now, people making $1M a year or more get $100K back from taxes. The cost of the new proposal to the public is the number of people making $1M-plus times $100K, and the benefit to the recipients is $100K a year.

When it's financed with deficit, the proposal is "the public as a whole borrows money to give more to rich people." What's the benefit of that to everyone else?

Now I feel I understood it just fine and there is no issue. The government makes less money off the rich, which hurts the deficit. You don't seem to like that.

If the rich went from paying 90% of income towards taxes to 85% couldn't you call that a "deficit financed tax cut"? This is why I think it sounds dishonest. Maybe if the govnment didn't overspend what they were bringing in, it wouldn't seem so bad?

 

[oleDirtyBast4rd]

Why wasn't George Bush the same kind of leader as JFK? They both were white after all.

Maybe I've missed the substance of your post but it sounds like your reasoning is flawed.

It's bad reasoning to think the POTUS who is black should be a good leader and example to black people? It sounds like your purposefully trying to disagree with me

 

[Jack V Savage]

Now I feel I understood it just fine and there is no issue. The government makes less money off the rich, which hurts the deficit. You don't seem to like that.

The gov't doesn't "make money off" anyone. The gov't sets up the system that allows some people to be very rich in the first place. That comes with obligations.

If the rich went from paying 90% of income towards taxes to 85% couldn't you call that a "deficit financed tax cut"?

If that tax cut were financed by higher deficits, I would call it a "deficit-financed tax cut." I don't get why you're having so much trouble with this.

This is why I think it sounds dishonest. Maybe if the govnment didn't overspend what they were bringing in, it wouldn't seem so bad?

Gov't spending (and revenue) is extremely low in the U.S., though. I think someone is being dishonest when they are knowingly saying something that isn't true. It's not "dishonest" when someone tells a truth that you'd rather be hidden.

 

[oleDirtyBast4rd]

The gov't doesn't "make money off" anyone. The gov't sets up the system that allows some people to be very rich in the first place. That comes with obligations.



If that tax cut were financed by higher deficits, I would call it a "deficit-financed tax cut." I don't get why you're having so much trouble with this.



Gov't spending (and revenue) is extremely low in the U.S., though. I think someone is being dishonest when they are knowingly saying something that isn't true. It's not "dishonest" when someone tells a truth that you'd rather be hidden.

I think you know what I meant when I said the government makes less. If not I meant they'd take in less. Bad choice of words perhaps.

As to the whole issue, it's a perspective thing. If we weren't spending more then we make in taxes, the deficit wouldn't exist to begin with. Just because the deficit does exist, that doesn't mean the wealthy should NEVER get a tax break does it?

Can you give an example of a tax cut for the wealthy that wouldn't effect the deficit?

 

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

It's bad reasoning to think the POTUS who is black should be a good leader and example to black people? It sounds like your purposefully trying to disagree with me

And have you established that black Americans don't think he's a good leader and example?

 

[Jack V Savage]

I think you know what I meant when I said the government makes less. If not I meant they'd take in less. Bad choice of words perhaps.

I'm not objecting to your choice of words; I'm objecting to your theoretical construct. It's not like people make their money in some kind of libertarian utopia and then pay to the gov't. It's a fully integrated system. Gov't policy, including taxation, affects pre-tax income.

As to the whole issue, it's a perspective thing. If we weren't spending more then we make in taxes, the deficit wouldn't exist to begin with. Just because the deficit does exist, that doesn't mean the wealthy should NEVER get a tax break does it?

It's true by definition that if spending and taxation were equal, there would be no deficit. We haven't been discussing "shoulds" here (I mean, I did in my first post state one reason that Trump's presidency would likely be disastrous, but you and I have been discussing what is rather than what should be). If you want to, I'd say I'm open to the idea that there might be a time or reason why we'd want to all borrow money so rich people can be richer. I don't see the case for it in today's America, though.

Can you give an example of a tax cut for the wealthy that wouldn't effect the deficit?

I did in my first response to you. Generally, a tax cut can be financed by spending cuts. And note that it is easy to cut taxes in a way that doesn't give disproportionately to the wealthy, as someone who pays taxes in the highest bracket also pays taxes in all the other brackets.

 

[oleDirtyBast4rd]

And have you established that black Americans don't think he's a good leader and example?

It's not only black American opinions that matter. I've established through talking to people that race relations are declining. I've also established through discussion that Obama has been divisive on the issue (feel free to disagree).

Maybe black Americans consider him a good leader, and that may compound the issue. If they look up to him, and he's been divisive, how are they going to act?

 

[Anung Un Rama]

He legitimatized the BLM horseshit by playing them lipservice on a national stage yet fails to call them out on their hypocrisy. Obama is a huge pussy.

Agreed. But BLM wasn't born out of Obama, it was born out of pre-existing racist policies and zero accountability of the police and justice system.

 

[DevilsLettuce]

Agreed. But BLM wasn't born out of Obama, it was born out of pre-existing racist policies and zero accountability of the police and justice system.

And a bunch of racist black people.

 

[Possum Jenkins]

206 days of Cultural Marxisms

Unfortunately, Hillary and her globalist Marxists are just around the corner. The social engineers got us at every turn.

 

[Anung Un Rama]

And a bunch of racist black people.

So only racist blacks care about racism and injustice? Don't get me wrong they're a poorly organized group with a mixed message, but that doesn't mean their formation wasn't justified.

 

[DevilsLettuce]

So only racist blacks care about racism and injustice? Don't get me wrong they're a poorly organized group with a mixed message, but that doesn't mean their formation wasn't justified.

No, but at this point BLM is on its face a racist movement - imo.

 

[oleDirtyBast4rd]

How exactly did Obama make America more racist?

I agree he handled race issues poorly, but those types of issues existed before and will exist after his presidency.

Personally, I think people have used Obama as an excuse to show their true colors.

You answered your own question. Nobody is saying Obama created racism lol