Will Ngnannou vs fury be a Rocky 1 fight but flipped?

[rstringer]

LOL at this shit.

Fury is only officially undefeated. Now go watch the first McDermott fight and tell me he won that. But I'm the one that's clueless? BTW master boxers don't get hit as often or as flush as Fury does. They avoid the types of bombs Fury has tasted repeatedly in his career. They're also more accurate with their shots. It's easy to look like you're a master boxer when you literally have all of the physical advantages over your opponents and yet Fury still manages to hit the canvas fairly often. I'm not the guy in my AV so now you've gone 0/3. You were wrong about my age, where I live, and my AV. Why? You assume too much.

Will cut out the rest of your baseless drivel.

I ask again, who in your opinion is a master boxer ?

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

Will cut out the rest of your baseless drivel.

I ask again, who in your opinion is a master boxer ?

Your question was already answered. I gave an example of who would qualify as a master boxer at heavyweight and explained why Fury wouldn't qualify (at least in my book). This topic is dumb anyway since you won't find many wizards at heavyweight. They're mostly at the lower weights and that's common knowledge.

 

[Nova44]

I never said that the only reason that he is a master boxer is because he fights behind the jab and is undefeated. I was responding to you buddy and brought up a couple of reasons why I thought Fury is one .

Usually when you fight behind a jab and exhibit good distance control, you must possess decent technical ability as a boxer.l and Fury has proven that he does have that ability event though at times he uses his physical advantage to overpower the opponent closer in the pocket.

So in my definition, technical ability + undefeated makes you a master boxer.

Now you still have not told me what your definition of a master boxer is and the only thing that I concede is that my definition and yours are not the same.

When you finally do, dropping the toxic language ,we can a civilized debate.

Sigh, predictable response. Though you at least explained your thinking so i'm more inclined to believe you're more of a novice fan rather than a troll, but who knows. If you don't get it you don't get it i suppose.

Sweet Pea for instance is considered a master boxer by a hell of a lot of people, and he was far better than Fury, yet by your logic he can't be counted as a master boxer. Wilder often utilized his jab and was undefeated for a many years but he is in no way a master boxer, yet by your logic...

I'm beating a dead horse at this point, so i'm just wasting my time replying to further messages when i'd only be repeating myself.

 

[rstringer]

Your question was already answered. I gave an example of who would qualify as a master boxer at heavyweight and explained why Fury wouldn't qualify (at least in my book). This topic is dumb anyway since you won't find many wizards at heavyweight. They're mostly at the lower weights and that's common knowledge.

So you think Usyk is a master boxer and Fury is not?

So you agree that definition is subjective?

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

So you think Usyk is a master boxer and Fury is not?

So you agree that definition is subjective?

I think Usyk qualifies but it's not like he doesn't get hit. The difference is that he doesn't get hit by stupid shots and Fury does. His punches are also much sharper. Fury misses a lot of shots. Usyk's footwork is much better as well. Of course it's subjective but only to a point. Fury is crafty IMO but he's not what I'd call masterful as a boxer. When he fights Usyk watch what he'll do. He'll look to pressure him immediately rather than try to beat him at his own game by looking to outbox him.

 

[rstringer]

Sigh, predictable response. Though you at least explained your thinking so i'm more inclined to believe you're more of a novice fan rather than a troll, but who knows. If you don't get it you don't get it i suppose.

Sweet Pea for instance is considered a master boxer by a hell of a lot of people, and he was far better than Fury, yet by your logic he can't be counted as a master boxer. Wilder often utilized his jab and was undefeated for a many years but he is in no way a master boxer, yet by your logic...

I'm beating a dead horse at this point, so i'm just wasting my time replying to further messages when i'd only be repeating myself.

You just can't help yourself and have to be disparaging all the time. Sure, I am the novice and you are the expert on a subject which is subjective at best

Unfortunately you never fully comprehend my argument. It was never that only a guy who fights behind a jab is a master boxer , I never claimed this , you are arguing against a straw man and I agree that the discussion is futile at this point.

 

[rstringer]

I think Usyk qualifies but it's not like he doesn't get hit. The difference is that he doesn't get hit by stupid shots and Fury does. His punches are also much sharper. Fury misses a lot of shots. Usyk's footwork is much better as well. Of course it's subjective but only to a point. Fury is crafty IMO but he's not what I'd call masterful as a boxer. When he fights Usyk watch what he'll do. He'll look to pressure him immediately rather than try to beat him at his own game by looking to outbox him.

I don't dispute that Osyuk according to your definition is a master boxer . I believe that Fury to be one as well and that he will hand Usyuk his first loss and potential KO. If my prediction is right , it's hard to argue that Fury is not a master boxer.

 

[TheGreatA]

I think Usyk qualifies but it's not like he doesn't get hit. The difference is that he doesn't get hit by stupid shots and Fury does. His punches are also much sharper. Fury misses a lot of shots. Usyk's footwork is much better as well. Of course it's subjective but only to a point. Fury is crafty IMO but he's not what I'd call masterful as a boxer. When he fights Usyk watch what he'll do. He'll look to pressure him immediately rather than try to beat him at his own game by looking to outbox him.

Fury is far from the most fundamentally sound boxer out there, for sure. What I'd describe him as, is "cagey", or crafty, as you put it. He has a lot of tricks in his bag, and he's pretty clever in the way he goes on about his business in the ring, which is more than you can say for most of the heavyweight division. It helps that he's faster and more coordinated than most other men of his size.

He knows better than to try boxing a guy like Usyk, he'll do the same thing he did a lot earlier on in his career against Cunningham, imposing his weight and size, bending the rules a bit while doing so. He's faster than the other big guys but he knows he's not faster than Usyk. It's not going to be a contest of skill but rather a matter of Usyk trying to somehow negate Fury's massive size and weight advantages.

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

I don't dispute that Osyuk according to your definition is a master boxer . I believe that Fury to be one as well and that he will hand Usyuk his first loss and potential KO. If my prediction is right , it's hard to argue that Fury is not a master boxer.

Fury might be able to use his size to bully Usyk but I think he'll make it quite difficult for him to do. He isn't going to just stand in front of him. Fury could smash him and it wouldn't necessarily mean that he's a master boxer. Unless of course he outboxes him. What Fury will do is look to fight Usyk, utilize intelligent pressure, an maul him. Wilder knocked out Ortiz twice but nobody would call him a better boxer or technician.

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

Fury is far from the most fundamentally sound boxer out there, for sure. What I'd describe him as, is "cagey", or crafty, as you put it. He has a lot of tricks in his bag, and he's pretty clever in the way he goes on about his business in the ring, which is more than you can say for most of the heavyweight division. It helps that he's faster and more coordinated than most other men of his size.

He knows better than to try boxing a guy like Usyk, he'll do the same thing he did a lot earlier on in his career against Cunningham, imposing his weight and size, bending the rules a bit while doing so. He's faster than the other big guys but he knows he's not faster than Usyk. It's not going to be a contest of skill but rather a matter of Usyk trying to somehow negate Fury's massive size and weight advantages.

I don't think he's a good enough pure boxer, or counterpuncher for that matter, to call him a master boxer is all. Like you said his fundamentals aren't even the best in the division. I think he'll approach Usyk the way he did with Wilder in the second fight and look to take the fight to him immediately. He'll have to try and cut the ring off otherwise he'll be chasing a gazelle and eating counters in the process. Cunningham was actually outboxing Fury and was ahead on the cards after 6 or 7 rounds. Whichever it was. Fury did eventually smash him but it was dirty to cross-face him like that. Had Cunningham not stood there for it then he might've lasted longer or even made it the distance.

 

[TheGreatA]

I don't think he's a good enough pure boxer, or counterpuncher for that matter, to call him a master boxer is all. Like you said his fundamentals aren't even the best in the division. I think he'll approach Usyk the way he did with Wilder in the second fight and look to take the fight to him immediately. He'll have to try and cut the ring off otherwise he'll be chasing a gazelle and eating counters in the process. Cunningham was actually outboxing Fury and was ahead on the cards after 6 or 7 rounds. Whichever it was. Fury did eventually smash him but it was dirty to cross-face him like that. Had Cunningham not stood there for it then he might've lasted longer or even made it the distance.

I think he's one of the best, most complete boxers of his size that has ever existed. But that isn't saying much when your competition is guys like Primo Carnera, Jess Willard and Vitali Klitschko I guess. From the moment he debuted, as bad as he sometimes looked early on (particularly that John McDermott fight which you brought up), I was always impressed by his speed. It allowed him to get away with a lot of things that weren't fundamentally sound, like the way he basically "clubs" with his punches and rarely throws anything straight other than the jab. Fair enough, when combined with his reach, it makes him extremely awkward to fight against, but you'd still like to see a more solid 1-2 from him every once in a while, like that of a Wladimir Klitschko.

His speed is somewhat negated by his clumsy, awkward punching technique, particularly when going up against smaller guys who are just much more compact and precise with their punches. I expect to see a lot of holding and hitting from Fury, and the choice of the referee will make a big difference.

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

I think he's one of the best, most complete boxers of his size that has ever existed. But that isn't saying much when your competition is guys like Primo Carnera, Jess Willard and Vitali Klitschko I guess. From the moment he debuted, as bad as he sometimes looked early on (particularly that John McDermott fight which you brought up), I was always impressed by his speed. It allowed him to get away with a lot of things that weren't fundamentally sound, like the way he basically "clubs" with his punches and rarely throws anything straight other than the jab. Fair enough, when combined with his reach, it makes him extremely awkward to fight against, but you'd still like to see a more solid 1-2 from him every once in a while, like that of a Wladimir Klitschko.

His speed is somewhat negated by his clumsy, awkward punching technique, particularly when going up against smaller guys who are just much more compact and precise with their punches. I expect to see a lot of holding and hitting from Fury, and the choice of the referee will make a big difference.

Yeah he is one of the best giants that has existed. He's effective with his style and the physical advantages that he possesses. I expect Usyk to make him look pretty silly in there at times. As you said he's clumsy. Well coordinated for a big man and moves well for one but not compared to a smaller more athletic fighter like Usyk. I don't see Usyk letting him hold often. He'll try but I think he'll remain slippery and be on the move throughout the whole fight. He has the stamina to pull it off. The ref could very well make a big difference. If he lets him hold & hit then it'd benefit Fury greatly. Or if he lets him blanket him. If he can't do either then he's going to get outboxed.

 

[rstringer]

Fury might be able to use his size to bully Usyk but I think he'll make it quite difficult for him to do. He isn't going to just stand in front of him. Fury could smash him and it wouldn't necessarily mean that he's a master boxer. Unless of course he outboxes him. What Fury will do is look to fight Usyk, utilize intelligent pressure, an maul him. Wilder knocked out Ortiz twice but nobody would call him a better boxer or technician.

Fair enough, so let's see how the fight goes and how Fury wins if he does.

Btw , do you consider Ali as a master boxer? Because he wasn't hit a lot but with the hands low , you may argue his fundamentals were flawed.

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

Fair enough, so let's see how the fight goes and how Fury wins if he does.

Btw , do you consider Ali as a master boxer? Because he wasn't hit a lot but with the hands low , you may argue his fundamentals were flawed.

No, I wouldn't. His fundamentals weren't very good but he managed to get away with it because of his talent and athleticism. With that said he still had the ability to outbox just about anyone.