If the U.S. Marine Corps is a separate service so should other subdivisions be

Discussion in 'The War Room' started by Ghost in the Dark, Mar 8, 2018.

  1. MadSquabbles500

    MadSquabbles500 Gold Belt

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    What be this NECC?

    Also from what I have read, this current incarnation of the US Marines started in 1933. That is when they decided to create the Fleet Marine Force. Basically another land army. Before then, regular Navy Sailors took part in amphibious assaults on foot. I made a thread about this

    https://www.history.navy.mil/resear...abetically/s/sailors-as-infantry-us-navy.html

    As recently as USA second invasion of Mexico while Europe was fighting WW1, US navy sailors took part in the second capture of the port City of Veracruz. They also had a large role on the ground during the Banana Wars.
     
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  2. MadSquabbles500

    MadSquabbles500 Gold Belt

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    That makes sense. You attack and take away your enemies ability to fight. So attack his supplies, his logistics. Its a tactic older than Sun Tzu.
     
  3. Ghost in the Dark

    Ghost in the Dark Purple Belt

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    Seems like the Marines simply work as a second army, with their own air force. Is is necessary for the navy to have its own army? Is it necessary for the navy's army to have its own air force?

    Afghanistan doesn't even have a coastline lol.
     
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2018
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  4. Ghost in the Dark

    Ghost in the Dark Purple Belt

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    Yeah from the days of sail and sword until about WW1 there was a lot more overlap. Thanks for the info.
     
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  5. MadSquabbles500

    MadSquabbles500 Gold Belt

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    Most other countries that have a working Navy, dont have a huge Marine Corp like the USA. Their Marine Corp is almost like elite forces. So those countries' Navies probably still have more overlap.
     
  6. MadSquabbles500

    MadSquabbles500 Gold Belt

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    I also wondered, do Air Force Pilots have to learn how to land on carriers, just in case there is no land base nearby for them? The Navy, and Marine corp can land on both kinds of surfaces.
     
  7. sub_thug

    sub_thug Red Belt

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    This is an oversimplification. Joint doctrine has Marines as part of Marine Expeditionary Forces and Marine Expeditionary Units. Marines go on Navy ships, float around, and have assets that are designed to act as a sort of global Quick Reaction Force in case of an immediate need. The Army has Quick Reaction Force capabilities, such as the 101st Air Assault and 82nd Airborne, and we have Special Operations Forces that are designed to be somewhere extremely quickly. As a service, we are more aligned with ramping up for 1-3 months, putting tanks onto rail cars and ships, and then traveling with all the big guns to whatever country we need to go. We are much slower than the Marines, but we have many more capabilities and the ability to logistically care for ourselves. Marines do a lot fewer things for shorter periods of time, but they can do them quickly.
     
  8. usmctanker242

    usmctanker242 Red Belt

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    I think this hits the nail on the head. Thinks of the Marines as the America's 9-1-1 force as we can usually be anywhere in the world in 48 hours. When the Army comes in they set up shop and have a massive footprint with serious supply lines and massive amount of personnel.

    During OIF I we ran into quite a few Army logistics units and they looked at us (the Marines) kind of like the poor kids next door. They had fresh water, an abundance of MRE's, and it was a totally different animal. They were eager to give us a ton of shit because we had almost nothing... the Army and the Marines are very different services.
     
  9. Gregolian

    Gregolian .45 ACP Platinum Member

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    "Why are we going to an Army PX?" -Wright
    "Cause the Army gets whatever the hell they want. Marines, we're like America's pitbulls. They mis-treat us, don't feed us, and every once in awhile let us out to attack someone" -Person
    "You want logistics, join the Army. Marines... we make do" -Colbert


    I remember stories of friends of mine that were in the Marines being billet'd or stationed with 82nd or 101st guys in Afghanistan. Marines didn't have enough batteries for their NODs or Thermals... fucking 82nd and 101st guys basically gave ALL of theirs to the Marines because "we can get more in an hour just by saying we lost them"
     
  10. jgarner

    jgarner Red Belt

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    That's pretty fair. I've always considered the Marine Corps to be an elite assault force at the tip of the spear. We aren't big Army and we shouldn't try to be. That's where I think our future lays. Something needs to be taken, then send a MEU. Let them seize the territory then give it to the army to hold. Otherwise, why have a second "army"? I definitely think we've earned the right to stay though. We've fought for America since 1775. It's also why I think the physical standards need to go up drastically. Got to earn that check and find a niche. Lately it seems like we've been getting slower.


    It's fucking crazy how well equipped they are. I remember watching an Army MP give away a pair of Oakley's to an Iraqi Army Commander at a meeting. I looked at him sideways cause those things were like gold and he just laughed and brought me to his HMMWV and pulled out an entire box of them.
     
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  11. Ice That Jaw

    Ice That Jaw Red Belt

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    The director of the navy is still the top leadership of the marines.
     
  12. Roaming East

    Roaming East Merchant of Death

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    whenever i hear that it reminds me of OIF I when the Air Force attached us to forward units. I went in country with a brand new FN made M4a1 (most army were still rocking M16a2's) ACOG, PVS14 still in the manufacturers plastic....man it was nice. saw some CCT's with that little NVG sight whose designation escapes me. For what its worth, i did have somebody steal my Wiley's....pretty sure it was a marine too.
     
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  13. jgarner

    jgarner Red Belt

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    Oh fuck yeah those Wiley's we got issued were horrible lol! Luckily we were allowed by command to purchase the Oakley's which was what I did. They actually saved my sight.

    I had an AK-47 round hit right next to me once and it fragmented and sent little metal pieces into my face. Had those little pieces of metal stuck in the glasses right where my eyes would have been. I can't imagine how badly that would have fucked me up if I wasn't wearing eye pro. I still have those glasses to this day.
     
  14. Fluffernutter

    Fluffernutter Black Belt

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    Don't worry, all are still parts of the MIC...equal parts.
     
  15. Ghost in the Dark

    Ghost in the Dark Purple Belt

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    The Marines were disbanded 1783-1798. I suppose if the Marines have that niche and do it well why fix something if it's not broken. Really does seem like they are just doing Army work though, it's not like their job has anything to do with the Navy. I mean if you look at WW2 it was the Army that did all of the amphibious stuff in Europe and most of it in the Pacific. But yeah if it works I suppose probably just leave it be.
     
  16. HunterSdVa29

    HunterSdVa29 Respect, tho Platinum Member

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    well ya. They aren't 'soldiers of the sea' anymore, the Navy doesn't engage in large scale Naval warfare w/ ships.....

    they still do their inherent job of Amphibious Assaults, we just haven't been fighting in aquatic based environments for awhile
     
  17. Ghost in the Dark

    Ghost in the Dark Purple Belt

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    Soldiers doing a light amphibious assault


    Marines driving main battle tanks in the desert


    ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
     
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  18. alanb

    alanb Brown Belt

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    This documentary was my tank class. I am in it just a little.
    If you go to 4926 that is me with the glasses in the center of the platoon marching
     
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  19. Arkain2K

    Arkain2K Si vis pacem, para bellum

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    This reminds me of the time when Conan is bewildered that there are Navy personnel in the middle of the desert at Al Udeid:

     
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2018
  20. usmctanker242

    usmctanker242 Red Belt

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    Wow, some familiar faces in that video. haha I graduated tank school in March '01 so I was a couple cycles ahead of you.
     
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