Wrestling vs Judo?

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by omgitsrick, Apr 18, 2008.

  1. omgitsrick

    omgitsrick Green Belt

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    Two fighters of equal caliber spar in open grappling, wrestler and judo, who wins?

    Yes I used search.
     
  2. Blast D*

    Blast D* Banned Banned

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    In just grappling...... the judo player would win obviously because of his submissions.... but all depends on the wrestlers experiance, skill and sheer athleticism.
     
  3. omgitsrick

    omgitsrick Green Belt

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    Well there are submission wrestlers too yknow.
     
  4. gracie_barra**

    gracie_barra** Purple Belt

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    with absolutely NO bias, (btw this is probably the most unbias answer you will hear in this thread)

    for MMA:

    wrestling
    in pure grappling (ie subs + no gi): judo

    no submissions, both guys of equal caliber in their respective arts, no gi:

    wrestling

    no subs, with gi:

    judo
     
  5. PSJJJJ

    PSJJJJ Guest

    Atemi-Waza ftw!
     
  6. NinjaKilla187

    NinjaKilla187 Blue Belt

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    Wrestling can be adapted very effectively for use in combat and martial arts competition but it is not a martial art. There are no strikes or submissions in Greco, Freestyle or Folk. In order to use them for fighting, either in competition or for real, you have to adapt them by adding submission techniques or strikes from other arts.

    Judo is a full spectrum fighting art with takedowns, defense, striking and submissions that has been adapted for safe sporting practice.

    High level wrestlers tend to be really, really good at shooting double legs and ground control and these techniques can be very effective in neutralizing any other kind of grappling when performed by a good athlete.

    Everything else being equal; size, strength, experience, speed, etc., my money is on the Judo man because he has more fighting techniques in his bag of tricks.
     
  7. bobbylight**

    bobbylight** Banned Banned

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    Well what are they going for? If they are going for subs obviously the judo player has the advantage. If they are going for just pins, the wrestler. Two different sports with different objectives.
     
  8. bobbylight**

    bobbylight** Banned Banned

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    I have never heard someone say wrestler and mean submission wrestler.
     
  9. bobbylight**

    bobbylight** Banned Banned

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    OK, I have thought about this for a while. Who would win the takedown war between karo and GSP? Or Karo and Hughes. It is the wrestlers. Judoka are susceptible to double leg takedowns, and that is a HUGE part of mma takedowns. They might be better in the clinch, but many judoka don't adapt well without the gi.

    Call me a judo hater if you want, but I'm a blue belt in judo, and recognize it is GREAT for the clinch, but a quality wrestler is going to be better at takedowns in mma, and they are going to be better at keeping someone down. Wrestlers train without a gi for their whole life, judoka adapt their gi game to no gi. It's a no brainer who will be better.
     
  10. UrbanSavage**

    UrbanSavage** Pepe Silvia

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    Judo wins any sort of grappling/mma right off the bat if both guys are coming without any other training besides the wrestling and judo. After that, I think they end up just being pretty much equal to one another if they both start crosstraining.
     
  11. Blast D*

    Blast D* Banned Banned

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    theres also bjj and sambo guys too, whats your point? the threadstarter is not talking about submission wrestlers....... he's talking about wrestlers.
     
  12. Q mystic

    Q mystic Silver Belt

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    You must then overrate gripping w/o gi...in an mma match? Most gi fighters certainly could on the ground if strikes were allowed.

    Any shot is susceptable to a knee and we don't see any resemblance of the habitual positions from wrestling in mma. Maybe we might in an oly gold noob mma fight but then we might see subs.

    I have searched heavy and long for the winner in this for close to 30 years. MMA has proven to me why I did choose judo over wrestling. Not to mention that judoka don't fall over if you shoot on them.:)

    The point earlier by ninja was interesting in that the grappling sport of judo initiated from arts allowing strikes. Never really considered that before. I like how judoka stand upright in a fight.

    Don't get me wrong here as I don't want it to go any certain way...wrestlers have as much a chance to win in modern mma as judoka. We're splitting hairs for fun here for any interested. I doubt Couture is.:)
     
  13. Q mystic

    Q mystic Silver Belt

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    Interesting. How would the judoka lose ground and the wrestler gain over him?

    It wouldnt go that way imo. Sub wrestler? Yes. Oly wrestler? No.
     
  14. Blast D*

    Blast D* Banned Banned

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    by the wrestler getting a solid top position and the judoka not training enough ne-waza....
     
  15. UrbanSavage**

    UrbanSavage** Pepe Silvia

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    Because I think that wrestlers work a shitload of movements that judo guys don't, and a lot of those movements translate really well to MMA and submission grappling. The judo guy would have to pick up on all the nogi stuff as well as taking the double and single legs more seriously, and the wrestler would need to learn submissions and develop a bottom game.

    I just think that right off the bat that judo wins, but as they both round out their games that they'd end up evening out.
     
  16. Q mystic

    Q mystic Silver Belt

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    I see. Ever try to teach a good wrestler the sub game? Or even to try to make them stand upright?

    I agree with you on the angling. That what makes a wrestler such a scrambler. They can cut an angle on your core better than a judoka but there really isn't alot of difference imo to getting there except the stand up to takedown/throw. I feel a judoka will learn a wrestlers advantage quicker than a wreslter will learn a judokas.

    Which movements do wrestlers practice btw, that judoka don't? I believe you big time but just curious. Thanks.
     
  17. Hammer Time

    Hammer Time Brown Belt

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    judo by being more wellrounded. submissions are gonna be the difference in the fight. judo guy could stalemate the wrestler in takedowns but on the mat judo guy wins do to inequality of submission knowledge.
     
  18. EL CORINTHIAN

    EL CORINTHIAN Black Belt

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    Judo vs wrestling

    Wrestler with singlet
    Judoka with GI
    Pin or submission for victory
    Wrestler goes for double leg
    Judoka chokes him unconcious


    Interesting
     
  19. Q mystic

    Q mystic Silver Belt

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    My classic at this time would be Hector Lombard vs Josh Koshchek

    Or

    Akiyama vs Henderson
     
  20. UrbanSavage**

    UrbanSavage** Pepe Silvia

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    Well, so much of the fight in wrestling is scrambling to get to your feet or trying to pin the other guy, whereas a huge portion of that fight is taken out of the equation in judo once a throw is performed. So many times in judo competition, it's one quick throw and it's all over but in wrestling, even if you get the takedown you still have to pin him and fight to finish it.

    Mostly the movements I'm saying are probably the ability to scramble and get back to your feet. I know high level judo is a very athletic sport, but I just think that wrestling is based more on strength and conditioning than judo is and all the shooting and re-shooting and sprawling that wrestlers do are extremely beneficial for MMA or submission grappling.
     

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