Why no uchi-mata in BJJ competition?

[Drew Foster]

Cool, I see you know your judo stuff!

Thank you. Even after I started BJJ after Judo, I actually was still more into Judo than BJJ/Sub Wrestling for a long time.

But now I just don't have anywhere to do Judo so I do privates with Dave Camarillo when he comes to NC for seminars, but other than that, I've kinda dove into this BJJ thing all the way, and I sadly haven't done any straight-up Judo classes or seminars for over a year. I really miss it.

 

[Drew Foster]

Go and do a Uchi mata on a BJJ competition guy and you will find out quickly why it is hardly used.

I normally am in total agreement with you (especially your avatar) but unless you can point out exactly what you mean, and why it's such a dangerous technique, I'm confused.

Do you just mean that it's not smart to do it the way most Judo players do? By going in and throwing and not worrying about who lands on top?

 

[Carrera26]

Go and do a Uchi mata on a BJJ competition guy and you will find out quickly why it is hardly used.

It's been quite reliable for me as well, both in Gi and no-Gi practice. Not to mention the "wrestlers stance" most BJJ guys take, and me having such long legs, is a perfect recipe for an Uchi Mata.

Especially O-Uchi --> Uchi Mata... it's money!

 

[Luther]

The takedown game in gi BJJ is something that is underdeveloped IMHO and needs a lot of further research and development to figure out which types of takedowns are the most effective.

Wholeheartedly agree, who know how the game will be in 10 years?

I just hope they will not introduce stupid arbitrary rules that change artificially the game.

 

[Luther]

Looks like it worked in the high level bjj comp video posted.

If you notice Uchi Mata is usually employed in BJJ when there's a clear stand-up skill gap, so the risks are mitigated.

Statistically you will find more leg grabs, sweeps and fireman's carry than turning throws, for a reason: they are more dangerous in BJJ.

 

[fourfif**]

If you notice Uchi Mata is usually employed in BJJ when there's a clear stand-up skill gap, so the risks are mitigated.

I normally am in total agreement with you (especially your avatar) but unless you can point out exactly what you mean, and why it's such a dangerous technique, I'm confused.

what he said.

Statistically you will find more leg grabs, sweeps and fireman's carry than turning throws, for a reason: they are more dangerous in BJJ.

Statistically you are more likely to see someone with wrestling experience in the US vs Judo experience as well.

That might be the actual reason.

 

[Luther]

Statistically you will find more leg grabs, sweeps and fireman's carry than turning throws, for a reason: they are more dangerous in BJJ.

Statistically you are more likely to see someone with wrestling experience in the US vs Judo experience as well.

That might be the actual reason.

Actually not, I'm talking about Brazilian Nationals, International Masters and Seniors, Copa do Mundo, Mundials (before they moved to California), all competitions held in Brazil, where Judo is MORE popular than wrestling: all turning throws (including Uchi Mata) are less popular because they are more risky in BJJ.

 

[Connoisseur]

I personally like the soto makikomi, it's actually a good no- gi throw, and if done right lands you right into side control/ scarf hold position.

 

[fourfif**]

Actually not, I'm talking about Brazilian Nationals, International Masters and Seniors, Copa do Mundo, Mundials (before they moved to California), all competitions held in Brazil, where Judo is MORE popular than wrestling: all turning throws (including Uchi Mata) are less popular because they are more risky in BJJ.

as per Drew's comment, I fail to see the danger in getting caught with a single leg on a single leg counter. We're going to have to just agree to completely disagree.

 

[lechien]

Looks like it worked in the high level bjj comp video posted.

vid is nice.

but I have seen with my own eyes Judo BB doing uchi mata getting owned by BJJ blue belt.

 

[Balto]

vid is nice.

but I have seen with my own eyes Judo BB doing uchi mata getting owned by BJJ blue belt.

I also use uchi mata in BJJ competition.

There are risks, but there are risks to anything. Overall it's probably one of my most successful throws in competition.

 

[lechien]

I also use uchi mata in BJJ competition.

There are risks, but there are risks to anything. Overall it's probably one of my most successful throws in competition.

I was not saying that he cannot be done.

People should train it and see if they can use it in their repertoire.

I assume that TS is looking at high % success throw and was wondering why he has not seen Uchi Mata in BJJ comp.

 

[fourfif**]

vid is nice.

but I have seen with my own eyes Judo BB doing uchi mata getting owned by BJJ blue belt.

I gotcha. Personally, I am definitely all for it. But I'm also the guy who will blatantly stick his leg out and just hope you shoot for the single. Unless they have it way up in the air, countering the single is definitely a high percentage scoring position for me, and has been for years. I'm actually going to try it tonight in hopes someone tries to work the single counter.

 

[bnosam]

Anyone have a video demonstrating uchimata counter to a single leg takedown?

 

[fourfif**]

Anyone have a video demonstrating uchimata counter to a single leg takedown?

no doubt. I wanna see that too.

In (wrestling) competition I would actually bait the single constantly,

check out Randy "the impossible leg" Lewis giving up the leg over and over again in competition, as a waaay older wrestler coming in and schooling the youngsters.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=

 

[judogido]

Uchi-mata is hard to get right.

It took me years to get it down pat. BJJers don't spend years on learning throws, they focus on basic takedowns like singles/doubles UNLESS they have someone who also teaches judo. Hence - you don't see it a lot in competition until you get to the higher levels (where the top guys probably cross-train anyway).

There is also the risk of over-rotation but I suppose any throw not executed properly has the risk of losing the thrower in a poor position.

 

[knoxpk]

Why dont we see more rolling/flying omoplatas in Judo comps? Because Judo guys dont train as much on the mat and therefore far fewer are REALLY comfortable and good with the move.

Probably the same reason you dont see a TON of well executed Judo throws in BJJ. Not to mention they are quick to take it to the mat.

We can watch a Judo match for MINUTES just to see one throw, in bjj you get it to the ground and quick.

 

[MUFC]

I was working Uchimatas today. Instructor let us work whatever throw/td we wanted for 10 minutes.

I'm really not good at them (or any takedown).

 

[Balto]

I think one of the biggest problems too is that when people cross train they approach things wrong. They notice that Judo guys are good at throwing, which is true. They also notice that BJJ guys are good on the ground, which is also true. Then they deduce that a Judo throwing strategy plus a BJJ ground strategy will be unstoppable in either sport. That is totally wrong.

If you take Judo techniques and strategies straight out of competition, most of them will fail miserably in BJJ competition. Likewise, if you take BJJ techniques and strategies straight out of competition, they will fail miserably in Judo. The benefit of cross training is learning the underlying concepts and then applying them in a relevant way to the particular situation you are in.

You need to learn the techniques of Judo when you train Judo (otherwise how else will you improve?) But learning the techniques is not the underlying goal. You really want to ultimately learn the concepts of Judo. You want to learn how to unbalance an opponent, how to time your entry correctly to take advantage of that moment, and how to throw your opponent in the most efficient way possible. Once you learn those, you can build a base of techniques for BJJ that differ from Judo competition techniques but still use good fundamentals. It works the same way in reverse when you try to apply BJJ to Judo competition groundwork.

 

[Drew Foster]

vid is nice.

but I have seen with my own eyes Judo BB doing uchi mata getting owned by BJJ blue belt.

I ahte to be Bill Nye the Science Guy here but one case of a Judo BB being owned by a BJJ Blue isn't enough for me to buy it.

In fact, I would almost expect that to happen if the Judo guy had little BJJ experience. As I said, you have to tweak your Judo when you start doing BJJ.