Why is Tachiwaza/Takedowns neglected in BJJ?

[redaxe]

Watch Demian Maia vs anyone besides AS if you wanna see a BJJ guy using good takedowns in MMA. Or watch pretty much any Jacare Souza fight

 

[Carrera26]

Am I wrong to think a BJJ Blackbelt should be able to hang with good wrestlers and judoka in taking the fight to the ground?

I agree with you in many ways, I would say that yes you are wrong to think that. I wouldn't expect them to do great, but it would be nice to see them do stuff you would learn in the first 6-12 months of Judo. Being "able to hang" and "not getting slaughtered" are 2 very different things.

 

[MMA junkie]

Am I wrong to think a BJJ Blackbelt should be able to hang with good wrestlers and judoka in taking the fight to the ground?

No. That is like saying a College Wrestler with no sub defense training should be able to hang with a BJJ BB in a BJJ tournament.

If you wrestled before, you would realize how much Wrestlers train takedowns. Each side has their expertise, hence why people cross-train.

I don't buy the whole sport BJJ thing either. Dedicated MMA fighters train BJJ applied to MMA.

 

[crackbaby420**]

No. That is like saying a College Wrestler with no sub defense training should be able to hang with a BJJ BB in a BJJ tournament.

I agree that a wrestler without sub knowledge couldnt hang in a bjj blackbelt division but a sumbmission expert should be more than proficient in taking his opponent down and defending takedowns. A BJJ blackbelt that cant do takedowns is like a great surfer that cant paddle into a wave.

If you wrestled before, you would realize how much Wrestlers train takedowns. Each side has their expertise, hence why people cross-train.

Well BJJ has come up with all these new guards being implemented in sport grappling when the community could be focusing on being more proficient in takedowns. It's not like we dont have the time to work standup and ground to be an expert at both instead of just the ground.

I don't buy the whole sport BJJ thing either. Dedicated MMA fighters train BJJ applied to MMA.

What do u mean by u not buying the whole sport thing?

 

[MMA junkie]

I agree that a wrestler without sub knowledge couldnt hang in a bjj blackbelt division but a sumbmission expert should be more than proficient in taking his opponent down and defending takedowns. A BJJ blackbelt that cant do takedowns is like a great surfer that cant paddle into a wave.

A BJJ BB can do takedowns. However when you compare them to a Wrestler, it is not fair.

What do u mean by u not buying the whole sport thing?

That a BJJ guy is focused on Sport and they don't practice takedowns. If I wanted to improve my takedowns, I go to a Wrestler, not a BJJ school (unless it had a very talented takedown guy). There's a reason GSP trains with the Canadian Wrestling team.

 

[YeahBee]

Watch Demian Maia vs anyone besides AS if you wanna see a BJJ guy using good takedowns in MMA. Or watch pretty much any Jacare Souza fight

He did threw Sonnen really nice but the best part of his takedown game is that he cna pull guard so effortsly when he gets sprawled/stuffed

Many BJJ guys just try and try to go for the takedown and gas or get reversed
2.40, really nice, failed takedown, guardpull, immidiate sweep attempts, semi stand up and takedown of his own

 

[crackbaby420**]

A BJJ BB can do takedowns. However when you compare them to a Wrestler, it is not fair.

I understand taking down a good wrestler aint easy even if u are an expert in takedowns. I do think that BJJ fighters should be able to defend takedowns from these good wrestlers if they are using solid technique.

I know a bjj fighter shouldnt mind going to his back but in MMA being on your back means u r losing to the judges. Even in a street fight u dont wanna be on ur back. A good bjj fighter should be able to stay off his back when he wants to. You cant always rely on just getting your opponent into your guard. That will only work sometimes, you need to be prepared when pulling guard will just get you smashed.

That a BJJ guy is focused on Sport and they don't practice takedowns. If I wanted to improve my takedowns, I go to a Wrestler, not a BJJ school (unless it had a very talented takedown guy). There's a reason GSP trains with the Canadian Wrestling team.

I hear you on that but in reality I would want to go to a BJJ school to learn takedowns. BJJ will teach u to setup the takedown in a fighting situation. Wrestling will teach u takedowns minus all the details that involve u getting punched in the face.

 

[Vector_X]

For one this point can vary greatly from school to school. In response to your question I don't think its neglected at most schools as just not completely focused on. In a BJJ competition the takedown is just a portion of the match with a lot more going on after or during that from sweeps to submissions, which take a ton of time to really drill and get good at. Judo does do a good mix of standing and ground, but a BB in judo isn't going to really hang with BB in jiujitsu on the ground either. A really solid wrestler might be able to take a BJJ BB down and atleast attempt to control him(assuming the wrestler lands on top), but that's probably about all he would be doing instead of actually pulling the submission off especially if gis are worn. Now this is just my opinion but I've found it to be fairly accurate.

 

[Vector_X]

He did threw Sonnen really nice but the best part of his takedown game is that he cna pull guard so effortsly when he gets sprawled/stuffed

Many BJJ guys just try and try to go for the takedown and gas or get reversed

2.40, really nice, failed takedown, guardpull, immidiate sweep attempts, semi stand up and takedown of his own

That's kind of the beauty of a shot anway. Unless the guy has an extremely good sprawl it's not too tough to just pull guard if it gets stuffed. True you're now fighting off your back, but atleast your in an area where you feel the most comfortable.