Why do some fans say boxing is just a form of fighting and mma is a real fight...

[sonofjay817]

Yet when they see knees to a downed opponent, and soccer kicks they say " it's too much" or " should not be legal"

Isn't that still just a form of fighting then? Seems very hypocritical of us to do

Its really very simple. Less rules and less padding (i.e. gloves and foot pads) the closer it is to real fighting. However, barring psychopaths, we all have our limits when it comes to one human being hurting another for sport. Does it make you a hypocrite if you would approve of rules against biting and eye gouging? Its subjective.

 

[Tevfik1907]

MMA is the ''closest thing'' to a real fight, they don't say it's a real fight, LOL.

Also, if the rules allowed you to knee a down opponent, that change in rules wouldn't be incredibly large difference in MMA.

However, if you allow using even elbows in boxing (not even kicking, just elbow) then that would be an incredibly large difference in Boxing, and that would change EVERYTHING in Boxing.

Boxing is an incredibly limited combat sports.

If I've to give example about how even the elbows alone could change everything in boxing;

Calzaghe knows Roy Jones Jr. can't use his elbows, thus he can get his head this close to Roy like this,

knowing that Roy can't use his elbows to hit him and from this angle Roy can't hurt him with his punches so Calzaghe can do this during a ''boxing match''. This is how technical the Boxing is, it's far away from a real fight.

While MMA is not that limited and even if you remove all the rules, and tell the guys that you can use everything, so they would obviously know they should protect themselves from knees when they were down, so they would take their guards and defense according to that, using knee is already allowed in MMA when you are not down for example.

But boxing? Down or standing, you can't do anything but just punching, you can't even use elbows, thus it's not even close to a real fight.

 

[king of theRing]

MMA is the ''closest thing'' to a real fight, they don't say it's a real fight, LOL.

Also, if the rules allowed you to knee a down opponent, that change wouldn't be incredibly large difference in MMA.

However, if you allow using even elbows in boxing (not even kicking, just elbow) then that would be an incredibly large difference in Boxing, and that would change EVERYTHING in Boxing.

Boxing is an incredibly limited combat sports.

While MMA is not that limited and even if you remove all the rules, and tell the guys that you can use everything, so they would obviously know they should protect themselves from knees when they were down, so they would take their guards and defense according to that, using knee is already allowed when you are not down for example.

But boxing? Down or standing, you can't do anything but just punching, you can't even use elbows, thus it's not even close to a real fight.

https://forums.sherdog.com/threads/...-unconscious-in-his-fourth-pro-fight.4182891/

This first reply is exact thing I was talking about. Bitches about legal moves, and say should be banned

 

[RightToBareKnuckles]

MMA is the sport of fighting. Sport is the key word, meaning there are rules and limitations.

don't burst my bubble!

 

[jimmy dakine]

Its all perspective...the shy guy gets bullied by the guy with the big mouth and complains that its not fair....the smooth talkin guy gets beat up some guy who likes to fight and says its not fair cuz I was just using words. The guy who likes to fight gets beat up by the guy who trained boxing and cries that its not a fair fight cuz he got training and I didnt. The boxer gets beat up by the kickboxer, and the kickboxer cries foul when he gets taken down by the BJJ guy and the BJJ guy says its not a fair fight when he gets shot by a criminal who doesnt give 2 shits that he trained for 20 years.....in other words. THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A FAIR FIGHT unless you agree on rules beforehand. NO RULES is the only REAL fight.

 

[Blayt7hh]

Yes they do

I've done bjj competitions... no one calls them fights. They call them competitions/matches/tournaments. I'm sure you can find an oddball example of someone doing it or try calling out "fight to win" promotion, but that's not being genuine.

 

[Hotdog666]

A rooster can fight, a pitbull can fight, anyone can fight. Very few can box. Boxing is a sport. That being said, I love old MMA and Pride

 

[king of theRing]

I've done bjj competitions... no one calls them fights. They call them competitions/matches/tournaments. I'm sure you can find an oddball example of someone doing it or try calling out "fight to win" promotion, but that's not being genuine.

Can somebody show this man how many elite guys call bjj matches " fights"

 

[Hotdog666]

Can somebody show this man how many elite guys call bjj matches " fights"

This is very true.

"I had 4 fights this weekend"

"You got in 4 fights???"

"Oh no, I mean BJJ"

 

[Ezekiel 25:17]

Yet when they see knees to a downed opponent, and soccer kicks they say " it's too much" or " should not be legal"

Isn't that still just a form of fighting then? Seems very hypocritical of us to do.


Just to clarify because we have some people trying to play dumb. We know one is closer to real fighting than the other. My point was why do those same people bitch about knees to downed or soccer kicks should stay illegal. Makes you look like a hypocrite

Cause the world is full of hypocrites bra.

 

[AnotherOldGuy]

Yet when they see knees to a downed opponent, and soccer kicks they say " it's too much" or " should not be legal"

Isn't that still just a form of fighting then? Seems very hypocritical of us to do.


Just to clarify because we have some people trying to play dumb. We know one is closer to real fighting than the other. My point was why do those same people bitch about knees to downed or soccer kicks should stay illegal. Makes you look like a hypocrite

Because MMA is closer to a real fight than boxing is. Though its still so far from a real fight (no weapons, no numbers) that being a bit closer makes very little difference. A little old lady with a gun can beat the best MMA fighter out there in a real fight.

 

[Sharkhunter]

because they are stupid, PS most street fights end on the feet within a punch or two

 

[fg1985bg]

It’s just closer to a real fight. No one ever said it’s a “real fight”. It’s a much less limited form of combat then boxing. The common consensus is that an MMA fighter would lose a boxing fight. However a boxer would get massacred in a MMA fight.

MMA fighters know what’s it’s like to be punched. Boxers have no idea what a choke, armbar, elbow, leg kick, knee and on and on feel. Again, it’s not a real fight but it’s MUCH closer then Boxing will ever be. That’s just my feelings and I’m a huge fan of boxing. Most MMA fans are just boxing fans that transitioned over to loving MMA like myself.

 

[Dan Torrance]

Yet when they see knees to a downed opponent, and soccer kicks they say " it's too much" or " should not be legal"

Isn't that still just a form of fighting then? Seems very hypocritical of us to do.


Just to clarify because we have some people trying to play dumb. We know one is closer to real fighting than the other. My point was why do those same people bitch about knees to downed or soccer kicks should stay illegal. Makes you look like a hypocrite

The sport started out as No Holds Bared tournamants. No biting, No eye gouging, I think crotch shots may have even been allowed.

So it existed in relation to boxing at the time and the argument that MMA is real fighting vs. boxing is a sport was really based on the argument that Gracie Ju Jitsu is real fighting and boxing is a sport where the UFC was created to be the proving ground for it's effectiveness, which it did.

The no knees and soccer kicks came later as the commisions created the unified rules and Dana White established MMA as a sanctioned sport in all 50 states and took the sport and it's rule set global so as to remain consistent.

In it's early days it was barely even allowed to exist and those rules were created to appease various governing bodies and politicians and such so that it could be allowed to put on events in states where it had been banned.

 

[king of theRing]

I feel

The sport started out as No Holds Bared tournamants. No biting, No eye gouging, I think crotch shots may have even been allowed.

So it existed in relation to boxing at the time and the argument that MMA is real fighting vs. boxing is a sport was really based on the argument that Gracie Ju Jitsu is real fighting and boxing is a sport where the UFC was created to be the proving ground for it's effectiveness, which it did.

The no knees and soccer kicks came later as the commisions created the unified rules and Dana White established MMA as a sanctioned sport in all 50 states and took the sport and it's rule set global so as to remain consistent.

In it's early days it was barely even allowed to exist and those rules were created to appease various governing bodies and politicians and such so that it could be allowed to put on events in states where it had been banned.

But don't you think we're way past that now? Luke if ONE came to the states, their rules should follow

 

[Dirge]

Having been in more than a few street fights in my youth, most street fights were boxing matches in the 80's and early 90's. Given most guys in a street fight usually don't have any training and MMA didn't really become a thing until the 90's.

you'd get the odd guy that thought he was Bruce Lee because he watched kung fu movies but most just stood around and tried to take each other's heads off.

Mind you i did get in a fight with a guy with a wrestling background when i was 19 or 20 outside a bar. I boxed most of my early life and didn't have any bloody idea what was going on when he shot for a double, picked me up and slammed on the pavement. When i woke up in the ambulance, I asked the paramedic if I won.

 

[suffersystem]

Can somebody show this man how many elite guys call bjj matches " fights"

I don't do BJJ, but I never recalled it being called a fight very often, even on here. I am sure there are a few, but I def don't think near what you are trying to impress upon us in here

 

[Dan Torrance]

I feel


But don't you think we're way past that now? Luke if ONE came to the states, their rules should follow

yes, and no.

The rules are what brought about the eventuality of the style of guys like Luke Rockhold and Khabib. Now that its a thing and once there is a second generation of guys then yeah. If Gordan Ryan gets his take down game on point then the MMA grappling style will be firmly established from the Wrestling, Sambo and BJJ branches within MMA and once that happens then yeah, then It's time to lift the rule and allow the further evolution of MMA to occur.

The important thing is that the next gens of those grappling heavy styles are established and the styles are codified or whatever needs to happen to preserve it. Once that happens though then it's just holding back what MMA ends up turning into without those rules.

IMO I have a lot of insight into what it ends up looking like but there's been a ton of other innovations such as styles adapted to a cage. I have personal bias though towards my own vision based on my old school style. It was very Dominique Cruz meets Mighty Mouse meets Prince Naz meets Wonderboy Thompson meets Bruce Lee with an added twist.

 

[MCS]

It's a generational question. Past gen rarely complained about soccer kicks. More so wanting to get them back.

 

[Greg House]

Nobody says is a real fight. They say it's as close as it gets. Because it's the truth. Boxing is just a punching contest, that's it. As soon as you hold them, the referee stops you.

Have you seen a street fight with no weapons and with no "friends" involved? They do 3 things ( Punching, grabbing and punching and muscling the other to the ground so the can jump on top of them and ground and pound or simply soccer kick them.

MMA is exactly that but done by experts. It's not just punching, there are calf kicks and weird karate kicks because using those gives them an edge over boxers. It's not just grabbing and punching, you have judo throws and all sorts of grecorroman wrestling types of trips and takedowns. And they use wrestling techniques to "muscle" people to the ground and once there, there is this JiuJitsu World that they need to understand to survive.

You say you want the soccer kicks in MMA but if you watch the early UFC and Pride events, they were very rare. The truth is that is hard to land those on a person fighting back and often it's just easier to jump on top of them (which you shouldn't do on a street fight because their friends will sucker punch you).

The soccer kick is really a finishing move in a street fight, not part of the actual fight. If they are landing more than one of them, it's because the other guy is done. Which is what you see so much on a street fight because with no referees, the other guy needs to stop on his own once he wins or is stopped by the crowd way too late.

As for knees to the head. You can see them in ONE FC. They have 40 events a year just like UFC. They are always allowed. They barely change anything in fights. Just another move to be aware that can finish a fight.