Opinion What do you think of white nationalism?

[dontsnitch]

Blacks get a pass because you cant separate their cultural identity from their race as of now. Maybe in a 100 years,

And browns get a pass because they're a minority, and Asians because blah, blah, blah. If white people move to Mexico, by your logic, they can be proud. Nice geographical moral relativity you got there. Meanwhile, America is nearing a race war.

 

[dissolved]

Do you feel guilty at all?

No. I've never done anything racist. And if I had I would hope I made quick apology and restitution if necessary. A guilt complex does no one good.

 

[Thought Criminal]

is this guy with a Rommel av arguing that white people aren't allowed to be proud of being white? That is such a sin to tell any person, let alone a white person part of a wonderful race that has contributed magnificent inventions and culture to humans.

Ask native americans if they want to go back to dancing around fires. Ask blacks if they want to go back to Africa where there is no welfare, no free housing, no affirmative action, living in mud huts.

Europeans civilized these people, not destroyed them.

 

[Rod1]

They can have pride in themselves sure. I think everyone should and it is healthy for humans (when not taken to extremes). It's dehumanizing to prevent any group from having pride in themselves.

Sure, they can as much pride as they want as long as their loyalty remains to a secular civil republic otherwise you end up like the Balkans.

 

[IDL]

Sure, they can as much pride as they want as long as their loyalty remains to a secular civil republic otherwise you end up like the Balkans.

Sure. And yes there are plenty of cases where various ethnic or cultural groups have broken off to try to establish sovereignty for their own best interests.

This is one of the challenges of empire expansion and ingrained in human nature.

It's also a basis for stripping people of their identities and assimilation (also part of empire).

 

[Rod1]

is this guy with a Rommel av arguing that white people aren't allowed to be proud of being white? That is such a sin to tell any person, let alone a white person part of a wonderful race that has contributed magnificent inventions and culture to humans.

Ask native americans if they want to go back to dancing around fires. Ask blacks if they want to go back to Africa where there is no welfare, no free housing, no affirmative action, living in mud huts.

Europeans civilized these people, not destroyed them.

You think Rommel was defined for being "white"?

Last time i checked the Germans didnt went to war against "non-white" countries.

 

[Rod1]

Sure. And yes there are plenty of cases where various ethnic or cultural groups have broken off to try to establish sovereignty for their own best interests.

This is one of the challenges of empire expansion and ingrained in human nature.

It's also a basis for stripping people of their identities and assimilation.

The Achaemenids were pretty succesful despite being multicultural in nature. Far more succesful than the greeks that followed them.

 

[IDL]

The Achaemenids were pretty succesful despite being multicultural in nature. Far more succesful than the greeks that followed them.

Results may vary.. Yeah in different contexts the dynamics will be different. I think the desire to break apart is when the relationship sours or the power structure is working against the interests of some groups.

 

[Voodoo_Child906]

is this guy with a Rommel av arguing that white people aren't allowed to be proud of being white? That is such a sin to tell any person, let alone a white person part of a wonderful race that has contributed magnificent inventions and culture to humans.

Ask native americans if they want to go back to dancing around fires. Ask blacks if they want to go back to Africa where there is no welfare, no free housing, no affirmative action, living in mud huts.

Europeans civilized these people, not destroyed them.

So you want to take pride in what people of the same skin pigmentation have done in the past? Seems strange to me.

 

[dontsnitch]

So you want to take credit for what people of the same skin pigmentation have done in the past? Seems strange to me.

Taking pride in what your ancestors did is the exact same principle as feeling shame for what your ancestors did, as is asking for special treatment based on what people with the same pigmentation have gone through in the past.

You can't place moral laws on an individual based on past events out of his control. You even acknowledge this in principle here. It should be obvious that if you allow one man to feel pride, you allow his neighbour the same privilege.

 

[Voodoo_Child906]

Taking pride in what your ancestors did is the exact same principle as feeling shame for what your ancestors did,

Are you mixing me up with someone else, I don't recall saying that white folk should feel shame in what their ancestors did?

as is asking for special treatment based on what people with the same pigmentation have gone through in the past.

This is not about the past, this is the state of minority societies in the west today.

You can't place moral laws on an individual based on past events out of his control. You even acknowledge this in principle here. It should be obvious that if you allow one man to feel pride, you allow his neighbour the same privilege.

Are we talking about the same thing? I'm talking about a Pride movement, not pride itself. I've given my definition of the Pride movement, what's your definition of pride in this context?

 

[dontsnitch]

Are you mixing me up with someone else, I don't recall saying that white folk should feel shame in what their ancestors did?



This is not about the past, this is the state of minority societies in the west today.



Are we talking about the same thing? I'm talking about a Pride movement, not pride itself. I've given my definition of the Pride movement, what's your definition of pride in this context?

This conversation has done me in, I think I'm gonna bow out at this point.

I'll say that I do appreciate you keeping it civil, sorry if I got animated with you. I got short with some people and I'm not sure if you were on the receiving end, but if I did that's my bad. The others deserved it, you did not.

I'm gonna get a beer. Cheers.

 

[Voodoo_Child906]

This conversation has done me in, I think I'm gonna bow out at this point.

I'll say that I do appreciate you keeping it civil, sorry if I got animated with you. I got short with some people and I'm not sure if you were on the receiving end, but if I did that's my bad. The others deserved it, you did not.

I'm gonna get a beer. Cheers.

If you don't get a dark beer it's racist! LOL

Till next time.

 

[Guestx]

All black people had to be slaves, or ancestors of slaves, nor all white people slave owners for what I said to be true. There are many black heritages, but one thing they all have in common is at one point in history there skin color, and skin color alone, had them looked at as less people and/or property. This is some thing all black people have in common, this shared history. The shared history of white heritages is one of enslaving people who were not white.

It is because of these histories that saying "black pride, or brown pride" have different connotations then saying "white pride."

I think there's a lot more shared history of white heritages than just the fact that whites have owned slaves at various times. (It's also worth noting that Africans have a long history of enslaving their own people.)

Especially if we're talking about the last 500 or so years, the majority of intellectual/scientific/technological advances have come from Europeans or those of European descent. So white people basically.

Am I wrong to feel pride because of this reality?

 

[Voodoo_Child906]

I think there's a lot more shared history of white heritages than just the fact that whites have owned slaves at various times. (It's also worth noting that Africans have a long history of enslaving their own people.)

Especially if we're talking about the last 500 or so years, the majority of intellectual/scientific/technological advances have come from Europeans or those of European descent. So white people basically.

Am I wrong to feel pride because of this reality?

Ya kind of, first of all there's a few reasons Europeans became the most advanced group in the world, most of it was geography. Second of all I don't see how anyone could be proud of someone else's accomplishments, seems strange to me.

 

[Guestx]

Now do I think that a Hispanic fighter with a "Brown Pride" tattoo carries a negative connotation the way a "White Pride" tattoo would on a White fighter does, no I don't. Really anyone what looks at history should have little problem understanding why.

Here's where I have a problem:

The phrase "white pride" is so generic that it's ridiculous to claim that because some small group of people have used it inappropriately that everyone else is barred from using it appropriately.

You'd have a better argument with "White Power" than "White Pride," although even then I think there are appropriate uses for the phrase.

 

[PolishHeadlock]

And browns get a pass because they're a minority, and Asians because blah, blah, blah. If white people move to Mexico, by your logic, they can be proud. Nice geographical moral relativity you got there. Meanwhile, America is nearing a race war.

I need some examples of Asian pride.

 

[Guestx]

Ya kind of, first of all there's a few reasons Europeans became the most advanced group in the world, most of it was geography. Second of all I don't see how anyone could be proud of someone else's accomplishments, seems strange to me.

Well that's a whole other discussion.

Should you feel any kind of national pride, for instance, when your country does well at the Olympics? I think you should. I mean, it's certainly not a moral requirement, but I do think it's good to cheer for your fellow countrymen, and in some ways the success of the individual is also a success for the nation.

 

[Guestx]

Really grow a brain.

It is not about what is and is not acceptable.

Frankly, that's EXACTLY what this conversation has turned into. What kind of pride is acceptable?

The truth is you can get a pass for just about ANY kind of pride except for white pride. There are people who would tell you that you are literally morally wrong if you take pride in being white and the heritage that goes along with that.

 

[Voodoo_Child906]

Well that's a whole other discussion.

Should you feel any kind of national pride, for instance, when your country does well at the Olympics? I think you should. I mean, it's certainly not a moral requirement, but I do think it's good to cheer for your fellow countrymen, and in some ways the success of the individual is also a success for the nation.

Why exactly, I'm happy for them as athletes, for their dedication and hard work. Why should people who have been sitting on their ass eating cheetohs for years feel a sense pride that someone in the geographic region did well at a sporting event?