War Room OT Discussion v4

[Trotsky]

I think you'll really like it once to get used to a few characters having annoying personalities. It's amazing to watch Brian Cranston take a character from meek, defeated high school teacher all the way to a vicious kingpin.

Through season 4, I agree.

Then, all of the sudden, in S5E1 he magically turns into an evil villain. And the rest of that entire season was just insufferably lame, unrealistic, forced, and pretentious imo. Madrigal is the only premiere episode in that season.

 

[Gregolian]

Of all the spoilers to have gotten, that's a good one. For me the relationship between them is more interesting to watch after you already know that he's more than just bossy and controlling with him, but manipulating him on the deepest level almost right from the start.

ffffuuuuuuuu, I struggled with how Jax fucked with Juice (even if it was deserved in the later seasons)... Goddamnit.

Ugh, I just finished it like 2 days ago and I watch to restart The Wire and I've seen it like 4 times now but I REALLY want to re-watch this again

 

[Fawlty]

Through season 4, I agree.

Then, all of the sudden, in S5E1 he magically turns into an evil villain. And the rest of that entire season was just insufferably lame, unrealistic, forced, and pretentious imo. Madrigal is the only premiere episode in that season.

@Gregolian don't read this, major spoilers





seriously, don't



They needed to pick either Declan or Todd's Uncle to be the bad guy that season. It had great moments though. The train heist was excellent for me, I liked the move into fumigated houses (okay it was a little unrealistic for such a small lab to push out Czech Republic quantities), but I liked the whole Madrigal subplot- Lydia was a phenomenal character. I like how they handled Walt & Hank, and I loved how they finished up with Walt and Mike. It was perfect for Walt. If they would have toned down the evil genius thing a bit, it could have been a great season. Definitely had stellar moments.

 

[Gregolian]

If you don't want me reading why am I tagged and WHY no spoiler tags?

You are not a nice person OldFuck. Not nice at all.

 

[Gregolian]

I swear to fuck whoever on CW thought making Palmer this goofy mix of Ant Man and RDJ for the show... I'm going to kill them.

 

[Gregolian]

"Hair... fibers... pussy... it smells of pussy...."


"What, you saying a brother can't play lacrosse? Jim Brown, All American mid at Syracuse"
"You're putting yourself beside Jim Brown?"
"Lester...."

 

[senri]

I don't see the memo as a flop. I also would have won our bet.

Keep trying, Jack!

Have him bet on being absorbed by The Nexus. He needs to accept what is inside of him.

 

[Jack V Savage]

I don't see the memo as a flop. I also would have won our bet.

Keep trying, Jack!

Can you elaborate on this? No wrongdoing by anyone was pointed out. It's just an attempt to insinuate something negative so that partisans who don't pay close attention will dismiss the findings. You were saying that the CT would have something concrete to back it, no?

 

[waiguoren]

Can you elaborate on this? No wrongdoing by anyone was pointed out. It's just an attempt to insinuate something negative so that partisans who don't pay close attention will dismiss the findings. You were saying that the CT would have something concrete to back it, no?

I was watching PBS Newshour earlier. There was a Republican Congressman called Hurd who summed up my view concisely. I'll fetch the clip for you. Standby....

 

[Jack V Savage]

I was watching PBS Newshour earlier. There was a Republican Congressman called Hurd who summed up my view concisely. I'll fetch the clip for you. Standby....

Ugh. I don't like watching videos. I can absorb the info much faster with words. Can you just summarize?

 

[waiguoren]

Ugh. I don't like watching videos. I can absorb the info much faster with words. Can you just summarize?

Memo suggests FBI used questionable or even improper source material in FISA application to spy on Trump associate. McCabe says (according to memo) that warrant would not be granted without this material being submitted. Raises a lot of questions about safeguards in the FISA surveillance process, suggests that reforms are needed.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Memo suggests FBI used questionable or even improper source material in FISA application to spy on Trump associate. McCabe says (according to memo) that warrant would not be granted without this material being submitted. Raises a lot of questions about safeguards in the FISA surveillance process, suggests that reforms are needed.

So no specific wrongdoing (X did Y, which was improper) alleged, right? The implication is that there is a systemic conspiracy against Trump, that one of the sources of suspicion was used as evidence for the warrant and not checked and that it passed anyway.

The bet we discussed was about whether there would be specific wrongdoing pointed to. I'm aware of the purpose of the memo, and the reason Republican politicians and operatives are trying to help that process. This is another example of you willing to sacrifice your dignity in the name of tribalism.

Chait nails this one, IMO:

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2018/02/the-backward-logic-of-the-nunes-memo.html

 

[Jack V Savage]

Also, the NYT, WaPo, and WSJ all have sources contradicting the central claims of the memo (the FBI did, in fact, highlight that Steele's research was politically motivated and there were other sources), which goes to my other point: Nunes is a liar and the claims were almost certainly going to be false.

 

[HereticBD]

Through season 4, I agree.

Then, all of the sudden, in S5E1 he magically turns into an evil villain. And the rest of that entire season was just insufferably lame, unrealistic, forced, and pretentious imo. Madrigal is the only premiere episode in that season.

Magically turns into a villain? He was always a "villain". He was just a villain you rooted for, up until the end, which was by design.

Spoiler

Only thing I'd say that the final season was lacking in, was a central antagonist. The show certainly lost some magic after Gus bit the dust. The first four seasons were this methodical build up of Walt's place in the drug empire, and then once he wins the war and takes over, they just kind of shoehorned some white supremacist group in there to make up for Gus' absence. Although, that season was more focused on Walt's downfall and didn't really need a big bad, because Walt was the big bad.

 

[waiguoren]

So no specific wrongdoing (X did Y, which was improper) alleged, right? The implication is that there is a systemic conspiracy against Trump, that one of the sources of suspicion was used as evidence for the warrant and not checked and that it passed anyway.

The bet we discussed was about whether there would be specific wrongdoing pointed to. I'm aware of the purpose of the memo, and the reason Republican politicians and operatives are trying to help that process. This is another example of you willing to sacrifice your dignity in the name of tribalism.

Chait nails this one, IMO:

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2018/02/the-backward-logic-of-the-nunes-memo.html

I am legitimately unsure if you are serious or trolling at this point. I didn't think someone of above-average intelligence could consistently miss the point to such an extent.

The specific wrongdoing is that the FBI failed to properly vet the source materials it used to build a case to spy on Page (at best) or even used those improperly sourced materials deliberately for convenience or otherwise (worse).

Your eagerness to twist this into a partisan issue is disturbing yet unsurprising. Tribalists of all stripes have been doing it with reckless abandon for the past week or so.

I write the following with a heavy heart. Tribalism might have rotted your brain too thoroughly at this point for it to be redeemed.

 

[waiguoren]

Also, the NYT, WaPo, and WSJ all have sources contradicting the central claims of the memo (the FBI did, in fact, highlight that Steele's research was politically motivated and there were other sources), which goes to my other point: Nunes is a liar and the claims were almost certainly going to be false.

Please post a non-paywalled source. I am curious.

 

[Jack V Savage]

The specific wrongdoing is that the FBI failed to properly vet the source materials it used to build a case to spy on Page (at best) or even used those improperly sourced materials deliberately for convenience or otherwise (worse).

"The FBI" isn't a person, and there is no reason at all to think that they didn't properly vet the source materials. The vetting just wasn't included in the memo. Page was known to be compromised since 2013.

Your eagerness to twist this into a partisan issue is disturbing yet unsurprising. Tribalists of all stripes have been doing it with reckless abandon for the past week or so.

Of course it's a partisan issue. Is your belief that Nunes is genuinely concerned that there is a problem with the FBI's processes here? And then Trump wanted this known so that the public would push to support reforms? I mean, how naive are you pretending to be here? This is what I mean when I talk about your willingness to look ridiculous in the name of tribalism.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Please post a non-paywalled source. I am curious.

Well, all three sites are paywalled, no? But you get a certain number of free reads.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/02/...ackage-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news

https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...sa-10pm:homepage/story&utm_term=.f6f92527a809

https://www.wsj.com/articles/house-releases-gop-surveillance-memo-1517592392

Side note: as a big DFW fan, whenever I see "Fandos," I initially process it as "fantods."

 

[waiguoren]

Of course it's a partisan issue. Is your belief that Nunes is genuinely concerned that there is a problem with the FBI's processes here? And then Trump wanted this known so that the public would push to support reforms? I mean, how naive are you pretending to be here?

No issue needs to be viewed as a partisan issue unless you are a tribalist (hint, hint). Your insistence on assuming that I care one iota about Nunes's motivations is highly suggestive of a simplistic worldview in which everyone is on one team or the other.

Certainly I have rejected your tribalist characterization of the issue repeatedly in this case, emphasizing that I disagree vehemently with the characterizations of the memo by Sean Hannity and Alex Jones.

This is what I mean when I talk about your willingness to look ridiculous in the name of tribalism.[

The irony is so rich...

 

[Jack V Savage]

No issue needs to be viewed as a partisan issue unless you are a tribalist (hint, hint).

That's simply wrong. And you're denying that an obvious partisan issue is what it is for tribalist reasons, as you know.

Your insistence on assuming that I care one iota about Nunes's motivations is highly suggestive of a simplistic worldview in which everyone is on one team or the other.

Not at all. Your insistence that Nunes is acting out of genuine concern about FBI bias against Trump rather than out of an obvious attempt to discredit the investigation against him is suggestive of extreme tribalism. I don't buy for a minute that you even believe your own line here--you're just saying it to show your loyalty.