War Room Lounge V20: Halloween Awareness: Dispatches Blast Yo Ass from a Pumpkin Patch

[HereticBD]

I must admit I thought Chael looked suspiciously sloppy. Then again, he's old and clearly more interested in talking than fighting these days (and possibly always was).

Gotta give him respect for hanging in there, and even having a few fleeting moments of control. Dude walked through hell to get some takedowns.

 

[Andy Capp]

I can't even understand half of what you've written here, and I don't think that's indicative of a problem with my reading comprehension.

LOL reading it now, sober, it's a bit run-on, but if you consider the context of the previous posts I'm sure you'll be able to understand.

 

[Andy Capp]

Gotta give him respect for hanging in there, and even having a few fleeting moments of control. Dude walked through hell to get some takedowns.

I give him nothing, not worth a fuck.

 

[Lord Commander Palis]

I’m in the hospital hooked up to electrodes.

Probably not smart to go after such a alpha male in such a weak condition.

 

[Ruprecht]

Gotta give him respect for hanging in there, and even having a few fleeting moments of control. Dude walked through hell to get some takedowns.

He definitely took some heavy shots early. I was dissapointed not to see some old school "swimming in the guard" GNP from Fedor when he had top control though.

 

[Andy Capp]

Interesting comment from Goldie to Bader,
"If Chael wins tonight you'll have to listen to Chael until January..."
Here's hoping not...

 

[HereticBD]

I give him nothing, not worth a fuck.

How can you be so callous towards an individual who has never said a bad word about anyone, and is the very definition of class?

For shame.

 

[Lead]

I must admit I thought Chael looked suspiciously sloppy. Then again, he's old and clearly more interested in talking than fighting these days (and possibly always was).

When he first went to bellator, he did less podcasts and when he did them, he'd just talk about how hard he's training. Then he lost to Tito. Since then, you wouldn't even know he's an active fighter from his show. He had a podcast the night before his fight. Sure, he talked about it, but the fact he had recording that on his mind and his schedule didn't go down the past month or so makes me think he doesn't take it too seriously on the training side

 

[Islam Imamate]

When he first went to bellator, he did less podcasts and when he did them, he'd just talk about how hard he's training. Then he lost to Tito. Since then, you wouldn't even know he's an active fighter from his show. He had a podcast the night before his fight. Sure, he talked about it, but the fact he had recording that on his mind and his schedule didn't go down the past month or so makes me think he doesn't take it too seriously on the training side

And yet he still beat Rampage...

 

[Jesus H. Sherdog]

You can call it pretending if you'd like(though I don't think someone like @InternetHero is pretending) but the point is in theory they actually care about spreading their religion to other people in order to save their souls while the Jews really don't which is probably why its far harder to convert to Judaism than it is Islam or Christianity.

Oh I know, I'm just saying that the distinction between Jewish imperialism vs Christian or Islamic imperialism is that the former wasn't ostensibly undertaken to spread the faith like the latter was.

The Christians were far more outnumbered by hostile entities than the Jews were though given they were a small sect being persecuted by the most powerful state on the continent. The Jews on the other hand were one ancient state surrounded by other ones in their infancy, a more preferable state of affairs I think. The Christians were able to turn it around eventually because they proselytized more aggressively than the Jews ever did.

The Arab Muslims were probably the most fortunate. They seemed to face tough odds at first when dealing with their fellow Arabs before they united the peninsula. But after they did they formed a nomadic tribal confederation, the nightmare of the settled civilizations. Its as Ibn Khaldun said many centuries later, the Arabs were a fierce barbarian peoples who could overrun the decayed settled societies of their time only to become such a decayed, settled society themselves and later find themselves overrun by a new group of barbarians in the Mongols.

Fair enough... and maybe it’s the Hawaiian perspective in me, but I’ll never see attempting to forcibly convert others as a positive. A people can rebuild their populations or their cities or wealth, but once their culture is erased that’s the worst genocide.

 

[Lead]

And yet he still beat Rampage...

That's what's funny. He took it super serious and lost to Tito then didn't give a shit and beat Wanderlei and Rampage.

 

[JDragon]

This one looks like it has serious potential.

 

[Islam Imamate]

Fair enough... and maybe it’s the Hawaiian perspective in me, but I’ll never see attempting to forcibly convert others as a positive. A people can rebuild their populations or their cities or wealth, but once their culture is erased that’s the worst genocide.

I think converting them is better than killing all the men, children, and little ones. I get the ancient world was a tough neighborhood, couldn't have been easy being living next to the Assyrians, but that's still cultural genocide. Btw Christians didn't force anyone in the early years, they merely convinced them. And Muslims rarely forcibly converted, that's also in the same article

The second question posed at the start of this essay was: is it true that Islam was spread by force?

The answer is, in one sense, yes, but even this needs careful qualification. Warfare did play a major role both in the rise of Islam and its later diffusion. But some places were Islamised without any war at all, notably Malaysia and Indonesia. Above all, even where Islam was spread by jihad, it was not usually done the way people imagine. People usually think of holy warriors as engaging in something like Charlemagne's forced conversion of the Saxons, war for the extirpation of wrong beliefs throughout an entire community. But that model is very rare in Islamic history. The effect of war was usually more indirect.

But if people were allowed to keep their religion under Muslim rule, how could the jurists define jihad as missionary warfare? How was it different from other forms of imperialism, such as the Crusades (which were fought for the recovery of the holy land, not the conversion of the Muslims) or secular expansionism?

The answer is that in effect jihad just was ordinary imperialism, but it was undertaken, or at least justified, on the grounds that it would result in conversion, if not straightaway, then sooner or later - and it usually did so too, in a number of ways.

Muslim rulers would move in along with judges and religious scholars to build mosques, apply Islamic law, place restrictions on the building of non-Muslim houses of worship and introduce other discriminatory measures so that the original inhabitants were reduced to tributaries in their own land. They were not necessarily persecuted. The Muslim record of tolerance is generally good. (Obviously, there are plenty of examples of persecution of one kind or another; that religious minorities generally speaking did better under Muslim than under Christian rule under pre-modern conditions nonetheless remains true, however hackneyed the claim has become.) But the non-Muslims would soon have a sense that history was passing them by, that all the action was elsewhere, and this would translate into a feeling that their own beliefs were outmoded. So they would convert too, and that's the method that really mattered.

 

[Jesus H. Sherdog]

Fair enough... and maybe it’s the Hawaiian perspective in me, but I’ll never see attempting to forcibly convert others as a positive. A people can rebuild their populations or their cities or wealth, but once their culture is erased that’s the worst genocide.

@Kafir-kun @InternetHero

The key word there though is “forcibly.” I absolutely don’t have a problem with Muslims or Christians in general, nor anyone trying to spread their philosophies or religion through discourse.

I don’t want to sound like I have a “hate-boner” for Muslims or Christians since really the vast majority of them I know are great people. I even have a friend who is a Jehova’s Witness (really great guy) and they are basically the poster sect for proselytizing haha.

 

[Fawlty]

I absolutely don’t have a problem with Muslims or Christians in general, nor anyone trying to spread their philosophies or religion through discourse.

I know you weren't talking to me here, but man, I have a major problem with people who go around telling lies and fairy tales to vulnerable people, in order to brainwash and fool them into believing very outdated and immoral philosophies. And it still kind of amazes me that more decent people don't have a major problem with that sort of abuse and con artistry.

 

[Islam Imamate]

@Kafir-kun @InternetHero

The key word there though is “forcibly.” I absolutely don’t have a problem with Muslims or Christians in general, nor anyone trying to spread their philosophies or religion through discourse.

I don’t want to sound like I have a “hate-boner” for Muslims or Christians since really the vast majority of them I know are great people. I even have a friend who is a Jehova’s Witness (really great guy) and they are basically the poster sect for proselytizing haha.

I get that but like I showed in that earlier posts Muslims rarely forcibly converted people and Christians didn't either for at least the first 400 years of their existence.

I'm just being frank about the religions. Jews are generally not open to converts because that's not what their religion is about unlike Christianity and Islam for better or for worse.

 

[HomerThompson]

That's what's funny. He took it super serious and lost to Tito then didn't give a shit and beat Wanderlei and Rampage.

Tito is the GOAT LHW CONFIRMED!!!

 

[Islam Imamate]

I know you weren't talking to me here, but man, I have a major problem with people who go around telling lies and fairy tales to vulnerable people, in order to brainwash and fool them into believing very outdated and immoral philosophies. And it still kind of amazes me that more decent people don't have a major problem with that sort of abuse and con artistry.

You call it con artistry and the telling of lies but doesn't that imply the people converting others don't believe in what they say they do? Do you really think missionaries don't believe in Christianity despite spending their lives trying to convert people?

 

[HomerThompson]

You call it con artistry and the telling of lies but doesn't that imply the people converting others don't believe in what they say they do? Do you really think missionaries don't believe in Christianity despite spending their lives trying to convert people?

What does it matter if they believe in the horse shit? It's still horse shit.

 

[Fawlty]

You call it con artistry and the telling of lies but doesn't that imply the people converting others don't believe in what they say they do? Do you really think missionaries don't believe in Christianity despite spending their lives trying to convert people?

The vast majority. There are some legitimately mentally insane people who believe it though.