WAR ROOM LOUNGE V15: Lunge

[HereticBD]

This sounds pretty crazy and I've been avoiding posting in the WR, but I legit find myself hoping to read a RIP post for certain posters.

I hate how nihilistic this administration has made me, honestly at this point the more dead Americans seems to be the best possible outcome.

How do I come back from these feelings?

<Lmaoo>

Good lord.

 

[Jack V Savage]

If this site is resulting in him wishing death -- then he needs to move on from it. Wai got mocked for being Triggered so much he called out Homer to fight -- but this is some next level reaction.

The thing about that one was that it was so ridiculous. I took A&I to be kind of expressing a broader sadness about what's going on in the country in a sort of exaggerated way.

BTW, you want to look at serious message-board beefs, check this (background: the WSJ did a profile on Mike Godwin, who is best known for founding "Godwin's Law" and it referenced another poster's challenging him to a duel).

MZ:
>>Does the WSJ print letters to the editors?

MG:
>Yes. In fact, I'd be wonderfully pleased if you were to manage to
>convince the Journal to print your letter--especially if you recounted
>your side of the "challenge." Please instruct them to call me if they need
>any additional urging to print your response--I'd actually pay them
>to print your letter in the letter column, were such a thing possible.
>If there is a God, the Wall Street Journal will accept your letter and
>print every word.
>
>I believe that no one can have a full appreciation of your contribution to
>the quarrel without actually reading your very words.


Mikhail Zeleny
UCLA Philosophy Department\\
Los Angeles, CA 90025\\
email: [email protected]}

November 28, 1993

The Wall Street Journal
Editorial and Publication Headquarters\\
200 Liberty Street\\
New York, NY 10281
\end{flushright}

\vspace{8pt}

Greetings,

\vspace{8pt}

It has come to my attention that your journal has seriously
misrepresented the circumstances of my exchange with one Mike Godwin,
in a recent article entitled ``Keeping the Peace''. As a writer, I am
appalled by your evident willingness to pass on an unverified and
unattributed claim in indirect speech, as if it were a fact. This is
particularly inexcusable, since the facts of the matter are part of
public record, readily verifiable by any responsible journalist.

Setting aside your nugatory and gratuitous characterization of myself
as a ``network bully,'' I would like to disclaim your irresponsible
and mendacious charge that I ``regularly threatened people in a
philosophy discussion group.'' Since making a threat of physical
violence is clearly illegal, I must insist that you {\it either}
substantiate this accusation with an unambiguous attribution of any
instance of such putative threat made by myself, {\it or} withdraw it
forthwith. As regards the rest of Mr.\,Godwin's claim, the facts are
as follows. On October 15 of 1991, I proposed to arrange a {\it free}
and {\it consensual} lesson in civility for an Internet correspondent
from Edinburgh, who, having taken umbrage at my public expression of
belief that homosexual activity is immoral, had previously replied to
it in an openly insulting manner. Mr.\,Godwin, ignoring the first
part of my offer, which exempted my interlocutor from any financial
burden associated with our proposed encounter, fallaciously inferred
that the invitation was not made in earnest, but rather represented a
craven attempt to imitate his own trademark sort of self-serving
persiflage. Evidently feeling slighted by my failure to respond in a
similar fashion to his own insipid taunts, he proceeded to do his best
to elicit a like challenge, in full awareness of the stated rules by
which such an engagement must proceed. Having made enough of a
nuisance of himself, Mr.\,Godwin at length earned his own invitation,
whereupon he publicly refused to adhere to its rules by insisting on
settling the quarrel with a trivial board game. In the ensuing
exchange, I made it abundantly clear to Mr.\,Godwin that his choice of
``arms'' was utterly incompatible with the nature of the enterprise,
--- for one surely cannot excise a noxious boil with a feather duster.
Nevertheless, Mr.\,Godwin steadfastly refused to comply with the code
of honor, in spite of his earlier protestations of readiness to do so.
Thus your blithe assertion that I ``never showed up'' for the contest
is misleading, insofar as I had explained to my would-be opponent,
that the engagement will not happen, until and unless he agrees to
conduct it in the prescribed fashion. And this is where the challenge
now stands.

Finally, a note concerning the motivation behind these events. One of
the greatest scholars and publicists of our time set the standard of
discourse in the journal he edited, by articulating his belief that
the eighteenth-century custom of dueling should be reinstated for this
one thing, --- that a man who has been insulted in print should have
the right to challenge to a duel; [for] that would make the writers a
little more careful about trying to blow up their own ego by being
sarcastic. And yet it is an unfortunate aspect of our own time, that
many people who enjoy access to the most widely promulgated media in
the human history, should combine the incontinence that prompts them
to issue rash statements, with the irresponsibility that allows them
to disclaim the concomitant duty to account for their words in a
proper and adequate fashion. It must be remembered that an apologetic
retraction is always an option for one unwilling to stand up for his
opinions; but to persist in issuing bombastic communications without
assuming the responsibility for their consequences, is a clear mark of
moral rot. Thus by treating the gravamen of his habitual public
accusations as unworthy of his commitment to anything greater than the
stake of a board game, Mr.\,Godwin demonstrates the triviality of his
character in a more conclusive fashion than could be wished for by his
bitterest opponents. And yet, his spiritual redemption remains wholly
within his grasp. For even as the monopoly on the legitimate use of
violence is successfully maintained by the state, the responsibility
for maintaining one's dignity resides solely with the individual. And
inasmuch as this is bound to remain so in all foreseeable contexts of
social encounters, my moral purpose in issuing the challenge remains
legitimately sporting and therapeutic for everyone involved.
Consequently, it should be clear that in imputing to me a wish to
inflict harm upon himself, Mr.\,Godwin has egregiously misinterpreted
or misrepresented the point of the proposed exercise.

\vspace{8pt}

Cordially,

\vspace{8pt}

\begin{flushright}
Mikhail Zel\"eny
\end{flushright}

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

The thing about that one was that it was so ridiculous. I took A&I to be kind of expressing a broader sadness about what's going on in the country in a sort of exaggerated way.

BTW, you want to look at serious message-board beefs, check this (background: the WSJ did a profile on Mike Godwin, who is best known for founding "Godwin's Law" and it referenced another poster's challenging him to a duel).

Wishing death is beyond exaggerated -- it's obviously affecting his mental stability and no one is forced to sherdog - it's easy enough to not visit Internet message boards. The sort of debates and opinions are not really seen as frequently outside the Internet. There's also pure left wing boards out there for him to spend his time on.

I take his comment as unhinged over exaggerated

 

[Trotsky]

Lol I never understood why people take this site so seriously but this has to be the most "gotten to" post I've read on here.

Maybe you should just delete your account if you're triggered to the point of death wishes

I don't really think that's "gotten to."

There are plenty of people (and posters here) who are objectively shitty people: stupid, selfish, hateful, and completely unwilling to learn anything. And they are not only unpleasant, but also together the cause of untold suffering by countless people. And they are a threat to our society, our species, and our very fucking planet.

I don't actively wish any would die, but I certainly wouldn't lose a moment of sleep if they did. Fuck 'em.

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

I don't really think that's "gotten to."

There are plenty of people (and posters here) who are objectively shitty people: stupid, selfish, hateful, and completely unwilling to learn anything. And they are not only unpleasant, but also together the cause of untold suffering by countless people. And they are a threat to our society, our species, and our very fucking planet.

I don't actively wish any would die, but I certainly wouldn't lose a moment of sleep if they did. Fuck 'em.

Yeah, that's gotten to -- especially if this place is making you unhinged. You can simply just not log on to sherdog.

I mean I completely disagree on 99 percent of your political views, but I'm not triggered to the point of wishing death on you or people who share them

 

[HereticBD]

Wishing death is beyond exaggerated -- it's obviously affecting his mental stability and no one is forced to sherdog - it's easy enough to not visit Internet message boards. The sort of debates and opinions are not really seen as frequently outside the Internet. There's also pure left wing boards out there for him to spend his time on.

I take his comment as unhinged over exaggerated

It's the kind of shit you read on some nut's profile, after they've gone on some insane rampage, and everyone questions how nobody saw it coming. This is also the guy who posts his real name and address, challenging people to fights on here.

The cheese done slipped off this boy's cracker.

Absolutely hilarious that @Jack V Savage is trying to justify it. Good God. Not a partisan hack though. No Sir. LOL.

 

[Fawlty]

This sounds pretty crazy and I've been avoiding posting in the WR, but I legit find myself hoping to read a RIP post for certain posters.

I hate how nihilistic this administration has made me, honestly at this point the more dead Americans seems to be the best possible outcome.

How do I come back from these feelings?

You're a comic, dude. You have the artist's soul in its most loving and cynical form. You aren't coming back from this; your art is to live this.

just imo

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

It's the kind of shit you read on some nut's profile, after they've gone on some insane rampage, and everyone questions how nobody saw it coming. This is also the guy who posts his real name and address, challenging people to fights on here.

The cheese done slipped off this boy's cracker.

Absolutely hilarious that @Jack V Savage is trying to justify it. Good God. Not a partisan hack though. No Sir. LOL.

Jack isn't a hack by any means, I do find it odd that he puts death wishes below challenges to fights.

 

[HereticBD]

Jack isn't a hack by any means, I do find it odd that he puts death wishes below challenges to fights.

I find it odd how anyone could defend it at all. Guy is wishing death on people he doesn't even know. That's fuckin' loony toons.

 

[Trotsky]

Yeah, that's gotten to -- especially if this place is making you unhinged. You can simply just not log on to sherdog.

I mean I completely disagree on 99 percent of your political views, but I'm triggered to the point of wishing death on you or people who share them

Nor I you. But you're not a part of the group of people that I described, and neither am I.

And it's not a matter of political views. I didn't mention anything about political views, unless you think that dishonesty, inconsistency, selfishness, willful stupidity, and hatefulness are doctrinally inherent to the political right, which I would assume you don't.

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

I find it odd how anyone could defend it at all. Guy is wishing death on people he doesn't even know. That's fuckin' loony toons.

I think he's more just prone to depression and is frequent drug user / drinker which fuels those kids of thoughts -- I don't think he will jump off a ledge but he definitely should move on from this site

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

Nor I you. But you're not a part of the group of people that I described, and neither am I.

And it's not a matter of political views. I didn't mention anything about political views, unless you think that dishonesty, inconsistency, selfishness, willful stupidity, and hatefulness are doctrinally inherent to the political right, which I would assume you don't.

For some on the American political right, I do. I'm selfish when it comes to my income -- but back to the original point, if this site is triggering murderous rage, seems like the easiest fix, is to not log on, no?

 

[HereticBD]

I think he's more just prone to depression

Definitely. Which is more worrying. It ain't the first deranged post I've read from this guy. Banning him would be merciful. He needs to get the hell away from here, that's for damn sure.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Jack isn't a hack by any means, I do find it odd that he puts death wishes below challenges to fights.

I guess I'm not taking it as seriously as you guys are. I mean, I'm taking it as him saying, essentially, "man, people are really fucked up and it's depressing." If Heretic is trying to portray me as being supportive of politically motivated violence against random dipshits who spew bullshit online, that's a hysterical overreaction. My response to him was actually to say that those people are not America and not worth worrying about.

For some on the American political right, I do. I'm selfish when it comes to my income -- but back to the original point, if this site is triggering murderous rage, seems like the easiest fix, is to not log on, no?

Murderous rage was not expressed anywhere.

 

[Trotsky]

For some on the American political right, I do. I'm selfish when it comes to my income -- but back to the original point, if this site is triggering murderous rage, seems like the easiest fix, is to not log on, no?

Except I specifically told you I don't wish death on anyone, let alone wish to kill them. I don't think Agony said that either.

And those people exist outside of Sherdog lol. Unless you intend on living in a dark room without internet or tv, you're going to encounter them.

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

I guess I'm not taking it as seriously as you guys are. I mean, I'm taking it as him saying, essentially, "man, people are really fucked up and it's depressing." If Heretic is trying to portray me as being supportive of politically motivated violence against random dipshits who spew bullshit online, that's a hysterical overreaction. My response to him was actually to say that those people are not America and not worth worrying about.



Murderous rage was not expressed anywhere.

I take it more seriously with a very obvious and easy remedy. And, sure, murderous rage isn't an accurate statement, but death fantasy is still pretty extreme. AI is a good guy but he may need to move on if it's causing him depression and either hyperbolic or genuine death wishes

 

[HereticBD]

I guess I'm not taking it as seriously as you guys are. I mean, I'm taking it as him saying, essentially, "man, people are really fucked up and it's depressing."

Cool. Everyone else not trying to desperately spin it, reads it as

"I've avoided the WR, because when I log on I get triggered so badly that I've now started to wish death on people I disagree with in there."

The only reason you're pathetically trying to justify it, and twist his OWN words around, is because he's wishing death on right wingers. Give it a fucking rest, Jackie.

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

Except I specifically told you I don't wish death on anyone, let alone wish to kill them. I don't think Agony said that either.

And those people exist outside of Sherdog lol. Unless you intend on living in a dark room without internet or tv, you're going to encounter them.

I know you don't but agony flat out said it and I take it as genuine. You're not going to encounter them nearly as frequently or fervently as you do online. I work in the same city soulcrusher lives, I don't encounter his ilk at all.

edit -- i shouldn't phrased it as murderous rage, but rather death fantasy

 

[ObamaPhoneLady]

This sounds pretty crazy and I've been avoiding posting in the WR, but I legit find myself hoping to read a RIP post for certain posters.

I hate how nihilistic this administration has made me, honestly at this point the more dead Americans seems to be the best possible outcome.

How do I come back from these feelings?

The Trump admin didn't make you a cunt. You've always been a cunt.

 

[Trotsky]

Jack isn't a hack by any means, I do find it odd that he puts death wishes below challenges to fights.

You're talking about two different things, though. Waig's challenge to fight IRL was directed toward a specific person with whom he was having an argument. Agony's wasn't directed at a specific person, but rather a group of people, and wasn't in a fit of rage.

Challenging a person online to an IRL fight is (imo) more "gotten to" than being so jaded by their contributions that you'd be happy if they got hit by bus.

I know you don't but agony flat out said it and I take it as genuine. You're not going to encounter them nearly as frequently or fervently as you do online. I work in the same city soulcrusher lives, I don't encounter his ilk at all.

edit -- i shouldn't phrased it as murderous rage, but rather death fantasy

Kudos on the correction. And condolences on living in the same city as RIPWarrior.