UFC/Pride Heavyweight Champions with least-to-most Top 10 ranked wins at Heavyweight.

[tripleo]

They both have a lot more wins at HW. DC only had 28 fights and he split time between 2 divisions.

right but I was referring solely on the names they fought, not just HW

anyway moving on

 

[acannxr]

Mark Kerr def won the UFC Heavyweight tournament. Multiple times.

Do you see Mark Kerr listed as a UFC Heavyweight Champion?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_UFC_champions#Heavyweight_Championship

 

[kflo]

But the problem is during that era Fedor was in his prime fighting the top fighters were split between two separate organizations, Pride & UFC. So the fact Fedor has less top 5 wins has more to do with the fact he did not have all of the top 10 heavyweight fighters in Pride. Some of those were in the UFC which made those fights impossible at that time.

I didn’t say it was all his or the orgs fault. It’s just the facts. Of course, there were many top hw fighters in pride he didn’t fight as well that would have been good fights to see.

 

[kflo]

He's counting all the wins that fit the criteria and is using the same criteria for everyone. If you want to make your own list not based on the criteria set out in the OP then make your own thread.

Right. These are stats and people should assess stats and not use them solely to draw conclusions.

 

[GOATtalks]

Cro Cop was one of the best strikers of his wra and even trained Stipe at one point. Fedor definitely crushed some cans while he also defeated the best heavyweights during his prime too. And speaking of blown up light heavyweights, is that not what Fedor was? If he would have dieted correctly? I think him being undersized made those wins even more impressive.

I’m not sold on CroCop’s striking. Yes, he fought in K1, but that doesn’t always translate to MMA. CroCop fought terribly against Fedor. He’s also KOed by way less decorated fighters too many times to really consider him an elite striker.
I meant that they all were small and wouldn’t have fought at HW if they started now.
Pride mostly had small skilled HW fighters and huge unskilled guys like Zulu, Choi or Sapp. A bit of a freak show fights.
Guys who knew how to fight were all undersized HWs and would really struggle against true HWs like Stipe, Ngannou, Blaydes or Gane.
Fedor was 6’ tall 230 lbs
CroCop 6’2 tall 220 lbs
Today’s MWs like Rockhold, Weidman, Costa or Romero are bigger than that.

 

[GOATtalks]

JDS fought worse competition when he was younger?

This was possibly the greatest HW run of all time 9-0 in the UFC HW division and he definitely wasn't the same fighter after the Cain beatings.



Literally all those fighters listed would lose to the five years younger version of themselves.

2010 Ubereem would flatline Econoreem in two minutes.

Werdum is inconsistent you can see the fights where he turns up our of shape like JDS and Stipe comes in overweight and looking sloppy.

That whole Arlovski run was over cans or past prime fighters the best run was over Schaub, Bigfoot and Browne two of whom were retired in the next twelve months and Bigfoot was shot.

Arlovski was slow and shot I dont know what to tell you if you could see that.

I agree DC and Ngannou were great wins.

Yes. I would bet my money on Stipe, Ngannou and Blaydes to win all of those fights.

 

[GOATtalks]

Lol, this guy telling Fedor and Cro Cop how to fight.

I’m sorry we should praise them, even at times when they fought horribly

 

[GOATtalks]

how are Ngannou and DC better wins than Stipe and Cain?

Good point. I would say they are equally good

 

[r-harper-1]

Cain isn’t a top ten win for Werdum ?

 

[acannxr]

Cain isn’t a top ten win for Werdum ?

I addressed that already on page four:

Velasquez was inactive for 20 months and Belfort was inactive for 18 months, as a result they were removed from the rankings.

 

[r-harper-1]

I addressed that already on page four:

Seems odd ....beat the champ ...but not a top 10 win

 

[acannxr]

Seems odd ....beat the champ ...but not a top 10 win

FightMatrix removes fighters from the rankings if they're inactive for too long (although suspended fighters seem to be an exception to this), which is a better alternative than how the UFC handles their rankings (McGregor is currently ranked as a #4 Lightweight, despite having not fought in that division in over two years).

 

[DayV]

I’m not sold on CroCop’s striking. Yes, he fought in K1, but that doesn’t always translate to MMA. CroCop fought terribly against Fedor. He’s also KOed by way less decorated fighters too many times to really consider him an elite striker.
I meant that they all were small and wouldn’t have fought at HW if they started now.
Pride mostly had small skilled HW fighters and huge unskilled guys like Zulu, Choi or Sapp. A bit of a freak show fights.
Guys who knew how to fight were all undersized HWs and would really struggle against true HWs like Stipe, Ngannou, Blaydes or Gane.
Fedor was 6’ tall 230 lbs
CroCop 6’2 tall 220 lbs
Today’s MWs like Rockhold, Weidman, Costa or Romero are bigger than that.

MMA is not equall only to UFC, cage and unified rules.
Cro Cop was allways excellent while fighting in the ring, while UFC rules and cage go aginst his style because they enforce a lot more movement in big space to avoid strikes, lot more distance and wrestling / clinching.
Size and lenght / reach, weight are less important in ring MMA because there is no fence wrestling and no space to move and keep distance / reach advantage in smaller space with 4 corners.
In ring and Pride rules Cro Cop can go against anyone.
In Fedor fight his main problem was preparation, he fought too many times in short period. Mirko had 12 fights in only 2 years before Fedor, this was not UFC where you have a year between fights to rest and prepaire. He could have done a lot better in rematch that he deserved.

Also "KOed too many times" is tentative statement, because he had a lot more fights than the most. And most of those losses were not in his PRIDE rules and ring, but in unadequate UFC rules and cage after he allready had 50+ pro fights.

Cro Cop fought a ton of elite fighters during his career from Liakhovich, Alexei Lezin, Rubalcaba, Sinan Samil Sam; - to Hoost, Aerts, Le Banner, Hug, Bonjasky; to Fedor, Nog, Barnett, JDS, Wanderlei, while modern UFC stars are trying as hard as they can to fight as less as possible.

 

[r-harper-1]

FightMatrix removes fighters from the rankings if they're inactive for too long (although suspended fighters seem to be an exception to this), which is a better alternative than how the UFC handles their rankings (McGregor is currently ranked as a #4 Lightweight, despite having not fought in that division in over two years).

Fightmatrix sucks imo

 

[ConditFan]

Fightmatrix sucks imo

Yeah. They're better than UFC ranks though. I'd rather use sherdog rankings but they don't go back that far

 

[Fioretti]

@acannxr

Is there a way for you to check Suredawg rankings historically?

There is, but he's refused to do so previously, and prefers to go with fightmatrix. You know...fightmatrix - who's known for fucking up historical rankings and being way off in most cases.

It's weird.

 

[acannxr]

Fightmatrix sucks imo

What alternative would you suggest that covers all promotions, all fighters, and is accessible as far back as the early 1990's?

There is, but he's refused to do so previously, and prefers to go with fightmatrix. You know...fightmatrix - who's known for fucking up historical rankings and being way off in most cases.

It's weird.

Why are you speaking for me? Especially when I've already answered his question?

Only way to find them is by doing painstaking searching through webarchives.

It's very easy to be a critic @Fioretti , but you could always make your own list based on whatever rankings you want, no one is stopping you.

 

[Fioretti]

What alternative would you suggest that covers all promotions, all fighters, and is accessible as far back as the early 1990's?


Why are you speaking for me? Especially when I've already answered his question?


It's very easy to be a critic @Fioretti , but you could always make your own list based on whatever rankings you want, no one is stopping you.

Don't get angry when others point out the mistakes or the lack of legitimacy in your one and only source. It's a known fact that fightmatrix is inaccurate. If I made this thread series, I didn't - you did, and others were helping the accuracy of the data by pointing out errors, I wouldn't be mad or defensive. If you refuse to alter the data at all, and insist on using ONLY fightmatrix, you should put *Fightmatrix ONLY* in the title of these threads. It's misleading and inaccurate information, which defeats the entire purpose of stat threads.

I mean, it's like you're taking the time to do something to be informative, but are too lazy and stubborn to do it right. Then you get mad at others for pointing out the errors. Very weird, man.

 

[acannxr]

and others were helping the accuracy of the data by pointing out errors

You haven't pointed out any errors, you've only disagreed, there's a difference.

The notion that there could be an "error" in one site's rankings suggests that rankings, conceptually speaking, are fact-based, but they're not fact-based.

And much like I asked @r-harper-1 :

What alternative would you suggest that covers all promotions, all fighters, and is accessible as far back as the early 1990's?

It's easy to say that FightMatrix is flawed and that I should use something else, but you clearly haven't thought the suggestion through because it's just not that simple.

Then you get mad at others for pointing out the errors.

And how exactly can you gauge my emotional state through nothing more than text? I'm not mad, I'm not even irritated, I'm just pointing out that you're hiding what's nothing more than a disagreement over how I've made this list behind the mask of "constructive criticism".

 

[GOATtalks]

MMA is not equall only to UFC, cage and unified rules.
Cro Cop was allways excellent while fighting in the ring, while UFC rules and cage go aginst his style because they enforce a lot more movement in big space to avoid strikes, lot more distance and wrestling / clinching.
Size and lenght / reach, weight are less important in ring MMA because there is no fence wrestling and no space to move and keep distance / reach advantage in smaller space with 4 corners.
In ring and Pride rules Cro Cop can go against anyone.
In Fedor fight his main problem was preparation, he fought too many times in short period. Mirko had 12 fights in only 2 years before Fedor, this was not UFC where you have a year between fights to rest and prepaire. He could have done a lot better in rematch that he deserved.

Also "KOed too many times" is tentative statement, because he had a lot more fights than the most. And most of those losses were not in his PRIDE rules and ring, but in unadequate UFC rules and cage after he allready had 50+ pro fights.

Cro Cop fought a ton of elite fighters during his career from Liakhovich, Alexei Lezin, Rubalcaba, Sinan Samil Sam; - to Hoost, Aerts, Le Banner, Hug, Bonjasky; to Fedor, Nog, Barnett, JDS, Wanderlei, while modern UFC stars are trying as hard as they can to fight as less as possible.

CroCop was never excellent, he was only good. He was never the #1 guy, not in Pride, not in K1 and even less so in UFC. Yeah he fought those great guys and mostly lost to all of them. And he was who he was in UFC, not because of his fight mileage, but because of his skills.
Adesanya has twice as much pro fights as CroCop had when he came to UFC. Izzy has more than 100 pro fights and he’s in his 30’s as well. These excuses are lame and old