Training with more advanced guys?

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by Beast13, Jan 3, 2013.

  1. Beast13

    Beast13 Yellow Belt

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    So I was curious to know if training with guys who were more advanced than me would make me a better grappler in the end. Would it be better to train with guys who were less skilled than me, around the same skill level, or more skilled than me?

    Like now, I'm at white belt level and when we roll I'll go with either a white or blue, should I start going with more purples and browns?

    I'm thinking that if I roll with more advanced guys, after getting my ask kicked for a while, I'll learn how to hold my own and develop faster than if I were to roll with only those of lesser or equal skill.

    Sorry if it is a dumb question or idea.
     
  2. lightw8

    lightw8 Orange Belt

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    the age old magic three- train with guys with less training than you, train with guys who are similar in experience to you, and also train with guys much better than you. they all serve a purpose in your progress. however all in all, the more mat time the better as long as you're healthy and being productive.
     
  3. flyingnecklock

    flyingnecklock Brown Belt

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    "The ground is my ocean. I am the shark and most people don't even know how to swim."


    Sorry, I had to do it.But on a serious note, listen to the above poster.Roll with as many diffrent body types and skill levels as possible.

    If you only train with people who are more advanced than you then I'd imagine you will eventually start developing a very good defensive game.
     
  4. Funkoar

    Funkoar Green Belt

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    I always figure there are 3 people in the academy and how they attribute to yourself and others.

    A. People who have less experience than me = learning from me, as I am the more experienced person. Also time to try out new things.

    B. People who have the same experience than me = using the things we have both learned, usually very competitive.

    C. People who have more experience than me = teaching me things, as they are more experienced. I have switched positions with person A.

    And this happens your whole career.
     
  5. ColeslawBJJ

    ColeslawBJJ Puerto Rican Slap Boxing

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    Do it whenever you can. Yes you will most likely get your ass handed to you, but that's how you get better. If they are helpful you can ask them lots of questions and have them work with you at open mats.
     
  6. Nuclearlandmine

    Nuclearlandmine Shreddin' Double Yellow Card

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    Don't just roll with advanced guys alone. In my experience i have grained experiences most when i have different people with different skills level. I used to a no gi class in here but i stopped because the class is full of grappling veterans with only 1 or 2 people around my level, and it sucked because you know you cannot really do anything aside from playing defense, and the growth is minimal because you don't get to experiment or play around with your game, which imo very important for your growth in bjj and grappling.
     
  7. Nozza

    Nozza Purple Belt

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    I'm my limited experience I find it's hard to put new techniques into practice with higher belts unless they're being charitable. E.g. your new guard pass doesn't even get started as they break your posture, trap your arm and you're fighting to avoid being submitted or swept instead of focussing on going through the moves to learn the technique.
     
  8. Pirat

    Pirat Blue Belt

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    I love working with higher belts at my Academy (Copacabana Warsaw). The amount of detail and how they can point out your mistakes is priceless.
    However, in terms of rolling, it impairs your offense while elevating your defense. Higher belts will most likely put you in your guard if not in a bad position, simply because, this is what the game is all about and they are better at this than you. While this makes your defense/escape game flawless (believe me, they do capitalize on mistakes) it's hard to work your submissions as you are unlikely to get to eg. mount on them and not get swept during a armbar attempt. this all comes down to technique but as i have mentioned before, you dont get as much try at attacking as you get at defending. Still some will let you do your shit as long as you dont spazz or make stupid mistakes such as not pinching your knees during armbar or crossing feet when going for the RNC.
     
  9. Einarr

    Einarr Banned Banned

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    Rolling with newer guys lets you work your offense and weak areas, rolling with similarly experienced guys lets you work your A game, rolling with guys who are better lets you work your defense. All are important.
     
  10. 2008

    2008 Green Belt

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    I read this somewhere and people posting here are saying it too...rolling with all 3 levels...people better than you to work on defense, people less skilled than you to work on your offense, and people just as good as you to have a competitive match.

    I agree with this principle. You want to develop an even game. Each difficulty level tells you where your progression is at and gaps in your game.
     
  11. Gia

    Gia White Belt

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    I mostly roll with guys that have more experience than me. It's helped my defensive game a ton, but I'm worried about my offensive game/subs for competition.

    I rolled with an equal skilled guy this morning and I was able to dominate position for the most part, but I felt like my ability to finish wasn't anywhere close to what it needed to be.
     
  12. KGB256

    KGB256 Purple Belt

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    You need to train with a variety of partners, including as many different body types and experience levels as possible. This will necessarily mean training with people with more, less, and comparable levels of skill...not because this is some magic formula, but rather because these are the only 3 possible options.

    That being said, early on, I would tend to favor rolling with more experienced partners. Newbie-on-newbie rolling often reinforces bad habits by masking them in the sweet perfurme of success. By the time you have a few stripes on your belt, you should start making sure you get some time with newer guys once in a while.
     
  13. n8pee

    n8pee Yellow Belt

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    My instructor, who is a BB under Renzo, said he improved much more rapidly after starting his school and rolling with all white belts. He 'polished' up his moves.

    I remember Rickson saying the same when he was training for fights he would roll with white belts as they are unpredictable.
     
  14. n8pee

    n8pee Yellow Belt

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    Though I must add that I was training last night and overheard a visiting BB from Brazil seeming kinda upset that a purple (me) was rolling with a white belt. Truth be told it was my first day back to training after taking the holidays off and I wanted to take it easy!
     
  15. beans007

    beans007 White Belt

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    As many have said, the mix of all 3 levels will be best for your progression rate then any single level exclusively.

    When rolling with less exp, it's best to use this time to practice the moves you were taught in class, stay away from using bread and butter moves all the time, though, in order to help the lower guys develop their defenses, you need to use your good moves too.


    When rolling with guys your level, this is where you test the moves you've been working on, and further develop it, hopefully it can enter your 'A' game category. This is kind of where you see what works and what needs work.

    When rolling with guys above your level, this is where you become the first group, you develop your defense, as well as test your moves that have become your A game.


    So, as i said before the sum of all three is greater than any single. But, if you had to choose a single, it will always be with the most experience. In the long run, that is where you will develop good technique, as if you get any bad habits they will be constantly exposed.
     
  16. snoop dogg***

    snoop dogg*** Baby Heath goon$quad

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    I agree. getting your ass kicked is great, you feel satisfaction for little things like restarting halfguard for a second, even though it eventually gets passed again. Its always good to roll with guys a belt lower than you, but bigger and stronger because you get to play a more technical game and truly see how great technique can be.

    there will always be that 1 guy who you are so evenly matched with that you have the best rolls, and you both know it
     
  17. notafighter86

    notafighter86 Blue Belt

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    I've always found rolling with people my own level to be least useful for learning. I'd much rather roll with better people, failing that, people worse than me. Of course the best option is to roll with a mix.
     
  18. syncopizer

    syncopizer Yellow Belt

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    I greatly prefer to roll with better people. I think I learn faster, too.

    And, while it may be true that -- as some have said -- your offense will be impaired (delayed, is more like it), I'd much rather have good technique, posture, and defense than "offense".

    I'm self-defense oriented, and In a self-defense encounter, i can improvise and I can punch. I don't need a million submissions.
     
  19. blandy

    blandy Blue Belt

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    If I recall correctly Saulo recommend I jiu jitsu university to roll with people worse than you a lot (I think he said 80% of the time?) I've tried this idea ( as a purple belt rolling a lot with newish blues so they have fundamentals down) and trying to use it almost as positional sparring, isolating areas I want to work on. Of course I still try to make sure I get in hard rolls during the week as well. I feel this improved my game quicker than battling it out round after round
     
  20. Technogrunt

    Technogrunt White Belt

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    My school breaks the belts up as a Blue belt class ( which is for white belts), Purple belt class (blue belt/ purple belt) and an advanced Black belt class.... I'm a No stripe Blue belt and attend the proper classes, I work alot of Defense.... Get my butt kicked every class.. Doesn't help I am 47 years old and rolling with the 20 somethings... We also have a No-Gi class, it's also an advanced class.. Even at open mat we don't get many lower belts...
     

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