There is no difference between Contender Series fighters and Regular UFC direct hires

[Zebra Cheeks]

and to get them for CHEAP
These are essential the corporate version of "interns" (if interns took brain damage at work). Paying people less, committing to them for a few weeks, and then hiring a few of them.

The whack part is that unlike corporate internships, which are for college students, the UFC is making some very very legit foreign dudes do "internships" against other "interns", where both fighters would be the equivalent of mid level salary workers already if going with the corporate analogy and measuring their experience level and prior opponents.

Imagine how absurdly unfair it would be if you were someone with 10 years of pro engineering experience and the one company that remained that you wanted to work for made you start as an intern or temp against someone else in the same circumstances.
Meanwhile you find out some other intern has to do way less work against a can where neither guy has any real experience or faced legit guys.

That’s not true though. They still fast track certain guys like Alex Perreira who have serious professional experience. The contender series just happens to be effective for the large majority of their new recruits

 

[JKS]

Same guys, they just promote them on a show

 

[DjolexMTL]

Actually you are wrong about what the data says

How about you check out the ACTUAL STATS BELOW

Cool. Where's the comparison with fighters signed through the normal process?

 

[markantony20]

Shill doing shill work. Keep telling yourself that buddy. DWCS is for bums who want to stand and bang and fight for cheap. Every once in a while they will get a good prospect but it is not better than finding good prospects and signing them. Good prospects will wait and sign with Bellator for better money as opposed to going to DWCS.

Try telling Magomed Magomedov who’s beaten Petr Yan to go fight for 4k/4k on DWCS and he’ll spit in your face.

Bruh just does not like the UFC. This isn’t even about loving Bellator or ONE(which is completely understandable and admirable).

 

[Reffson]

Bo Nickal ain't wasting time. Wants a piece of Khamzat ASAP.

 

[Dreyga Hates You Sherbums]

The UFC could focus on signing champs from the organisations that they feature on fight pass like LFA, Titan FC, CFFC & Fury FC.

That’s literally who they sign for contender series— the champs from those orgs— the guy Bo Nikal beat tonight was the CFFC middleweight champion

 

[Zebra Cheeks]

Cool. Where's the comparison with fighters signed through the normal process?

Let me ask you something.

If on average a contender series fighter as of the data I collected in late 2020 had a winning percentage of 55%….that means they win 5% more than they lose. Who do you think is giving them that 5%?

 

[DjolexMTL]

Let me ask you something.

If on average a contender series fighter as of the data I collected in late 2020 had a winning percentage of 55%….that means they win 5% more than they lose. Who do you think is giving them that 5%?

I'm baked, thanks make sense

 

[brackis1]

That’s not true though. They still fast track certain guys like Alex Perreira who have serious professional experience. The contender series just happens to be effective for the large majority of their new recruits

they fast tracked Perreira because of Izzy.
That's it. And he got a ridiculous title shot lol. If anything that's an example even more plain as day that the UFC is not doling out career advancement based on MMA experience.

DWCS is still a wildly effective tool for trimming total contract expenses, whether that fighter gets 1 UFC contract or survives for many years and gets rich. It's still one extra cheap step where they have total control over the fighter while not paying full wages and benefits.
It's like when MLB teams stash MLB-ready players in the minor leagues so they can delay free agency by an extra year or two.
They can still make it, but the org pockets extra savings even though we all know they're talented.

 

[Zebra Cheeks]

they fast tracked Perreira because of Izzy.
That's it.

It's still a wildly effective tool for trimming total contract expenses.
It's like when MLB teams stash MLB-ready players in the minor leagues so they can delay free agency by an extra year or two.
They can still make it, but the org pockets extra savings even though we all know they're talented.

Right. And I agree it’s an effective way to try new talent, see them perform, and decide if they make the cut. I think based on what I’ve seen in the data, most guys who lose 3 in a row off the bat are cut. So I think the initial contracts are 3 fights.

So total, they are doing about 4 fights. At approx 10k/10k if not probably 15k/15k.

Same amount of fights required on a single season of tuf. But they get a word about matchmaking, timing, injury consideration and pay.

and instead of a shitty reality show we get real fights. Feels like everyone’s winning if you ask me

 

[brackis1]

Right. And I agree it’s an effective way to try new talent, see them perform, and decide if they make the cut. I think based on what I’ve seen in the data, most guys who lose 3 in a row off the bat are cut. So I think the initial contracts are 3 fights.

So total, they are doing about 4 fights. At approx 10k/10k if not probably 15k/15k.

Same amount of fights required on a single season of tuf. But they get a word about matchmaking, timing, injury consideration and pay.

and instead of a shitty reality show we get real fights. Feels like everyone’s winning if you ask me

Guys who were clearly UFC-direct signee worthy are getting fucked out of at least one full paycheck and the job security of a contract. Is the UFC gonna still sign them or pay for their surgeries if they blow their knee out training for a contender series fight the way they would if they'd already signed a UFC contract?

Alex Pereira got canshow matchups in the actual UFC to start his UFC career and rushed to a title shot despite having a few fights.
If he can get signed direct; there's at least 15 guys on this season alone who should be direct signees.
Assuming at least 5 of those finishes would have earned a performance bonus, that's a total of 15 guys getting $15,000 less each during the most important portion of their careers, plus the loss of bonuses and health insurance, so spread out across 15 guys thats prolly about $425,000 (50k insurance, 150k in bonuses, 225k in less win+show wages)
And guess who most of those guys are? Poor as fuck foreign dudes with tons of pro experience fighting against each other while a bunch of aussies and Americans with 7-2 records fight beside them lol.
The UFC is saving themselves millions of dollars at the bottom end of their roster because they don't actually give a shit if their whole roster has talent anymore and mostly want bodies and some chosen contenders.
Not unlike how pro sports teams will cut guys at the end of the roster who are actually better than other benchwarmers, but cost more.

 

[Zebra Cheeks]

Guys who were clearly UFC-direct signee worthy are getting fucked out of at least one full paycheck and the job security of a contract.

Alex Pereira got canshow matchups to start his UFC career and rushed to a title shot despite having a few fights.
If he can get signed direct; there's at least 15 guys on this season alone who should be direct signees.
Assuming at least 5 of those finishes would have earned a performance bonus, that's a total of 15 guys getting $15,000 less each during the most important portion of their careers, plus the loss of bonuses and health insurance.
And guess who most of those guys are? Poor as fuck foreign dudes with tons of pro experience.
The UFC is saving themselves millions of dollars at the bottom end of their roster because they don't actually give a shit if their whole roster has talent anymore and mostly want bodies and some chosen contenders.
Not unlike how pro sports teams will cut guys at the end of the roster who are actually better than other benchwarmers, but cost more.

How are they supposed to solve it?

If they bring these guys in too fast people complain about the level of competition. Even now some of the fight nights have very low skill levels. How are they supposed to promise a quality product when the regional scene is so flawed, filled with can crushers and career L’s.

Damned if they do, damned if they don’t. I agree it would be much better if everyone was paid 100k/100k or even 50k/50k off the bat and they were reliable, professional, marketable and showed up ready to fight 3 rounds.

But they aren’t, and they don’t. It’s a screening process and while it’s not perfect, it feels necessary to me.

 

[brackis1]

Do you also think TUF is a scam?? How is DWCS any different from TUF?

TUF was a reality show with training involved, tons of camera time for all fighters outside a 2 minute promo segment, and less risk of damage because 2x5 fights and no pro record blemish.
Oh and almost everyone on the show still got to fight in the UFC in the finale at the very least. Some even got second chances on the show as replacements.

they were handing out 5k bonuses for a finish in those 2rd fights literally 15 years ago after fighters got pissed about fighting for free.... and And now are trying to sell us on the idea of 5k/5k 3rd fights for dudes with 10-0 records training with world champs lol.

 

[Dreyga Hates You Sherbums]

Guys who were clearly UFC-direct signee worthy are getting fucked out of at least one full paycheck and the job security of a contract. Is the UFC gonna still sign them or pay for their surgeries if they blow their knee out training for a contender series fight the way they would if they'd already signed a UFC contract?

Alex Pereira got canshow matchups in the actual UFC to start his UFC career and rushed to a title shot despite having a few fights.
If he can get signed direct; there's at least 15 guys on this season alone who should be direct signees.
Assuming at least 5 of those finishes would have earned a performance bonus, that's a total of 15 guys getting $15,000 less each during the most important portion of their careers, plus the loss of bonuses and health insurance, so spread out across 15 guys thats prolly about $425,000 (50k insurance, 150k in bonuses, 225k in less win+show wages)
And guess who most of those guys are? Poor as fuck foreign dudes with tons of pro experience fighting against each other while a bunch of aussies and Americans with 7-2 records fight beside them lol.
The UFC is saving themselves millions of dollars at the bottom end of their roster because they don't actually give a shit if their whole roster has talent anymore and mostly want bodies and some chosen contenders.
Not unlike how pro sports teams will cut guys at the end of the roster who are actually better than other benchwarmers, but cost more.

You are really stuck on this concept of “UFC-direct signee worthy”.

It doesn’t exist. They grab all the guys from the same pool. They have signed green guys with 3-0 to UFC contracts and had guys with 20+ on the DWCS.

There is literally no distinction between the CS guys and Direct hires. None

 

[brackis1]

How are they supposed to solve it?

If they bring these guys in too fast people complain about the level of competition. Even now some of the fight nights have very low skill levels. How are they supposed to promise a quality product when the regional scene is so flawed, filled with can crushers and career L’s.

Damned if they do, damned if they don’t. I agree it would be much better if everyone was paid 100k/100k or even 50k/50k off the bat and they were reliable, professional, marketable and showed up ready to fight 3 rounds.

But they aren’t, and they don’t. It’s a screening process and while it’s not perfect, it feels necessary to me.

It's not hard: they have multiple match makers.

6-2 dudes with regional opponents?
DWCS
Brazilian or Russian guy with 10+ wins and no losses and experience against tough vets?
Sign to UFC

They're trying to lump as many guys into the contender series route as possible because it's CHEAP
Every pro league ownership group tries to invent ways to regulate how much new entrants are paid and how long their contracts are.
In the NBA for example, guys who gets drafted in the late 1st round are often fucked and make less money over their careers than 2nd rd or UDFA players who aren't forced into a 5 year contract with a slotted salary.

 

[BEATDOWNS]

I never understood the hate. I got it when it was guys who went on tuf and lost and they got contracts anyway.

I have a problem with this statement "guys who went on TUF and lost and got contracts anyway" So obviously the guy that wins the whole thing gets a "better/bigger contract" now that that is out of the way what you said is only partially true. They would put the guys from the show on the finale and the winners of those fights would get contracts and that is literally the exact same concept as The Contenders Series. The guys that won impressively where given a contract. Total contradiction by you here.

 

[djason1988]

Usually UFC direct signees were champions in other organizations. DWCS signees are not usually.

This. Generally signees are proven fighters with a track record to match. DWCS guys have hardly any fights and fight others with the same. Dudes with 2-5 fights under their belts aren't proven commodities.

 

[brackis1]

You are really stuck on this concept of “UFC-direct signee worthy”.

It doesn’t exist. They grab all the guys from the same pool. They have signed green guys with 3-0 to UFC contracts and had guys with 20+ on the DWCS.

There is literally no distinction between the CS guys and Direct hires. None

Dude are you really this slow?
You're agreeing with my point lmao.
They're putting 20+ guys in the same show as 3-0 guys and mushing them together into a pile of cheap contract goo.

How is this so fucking hard?
The 20+ win guys if signed directly, would be getting paid more.
Seriously I don't know how else to explain this to you.
Have you ever held a paying job in your life?
Do you not get the difference between 5/5k and no bonus vs 12/k/12k and a 50k bonus? It's a basic mathematical concept.

 

[Dreyga Hates You Sherbums]

TUF was a reality show with training involved, tons of camera time for all fighters outside a 2 minute promo segment, and less risk of damage because 2x5 fights and no pro record blemish.
Oh and almost everyone on the show still got to fight in the UFC in the finale at the very least. Some even got second chances on the show as replacements.

they were handing out 5k bonuses for a finish in those 2rd fights literally 15 years ago after fighters got pissed about fighting for free.... and And now are trying to sell us on the idea of 5k/5k 3rd fights for dudes with 10-0 records training with world champs lol.

1)So more camera time makes it big a scam?? How does that work?

2)Less risk of damage I don’t buy they fight more fights in shorter timespan and train the whole time


3) Yes they should get paid more. Doesn’t make it a scam

 

[brackis1]

This. Generally signees are proven fighters with a track record to match. DWCS guys have hardly any fights and fight others with the same. Dudes with 2-5 fights under their belts aren't proven commodities.

So what about dude with 10+ wins, no losses, with wins against guys with top league experience, and who have been selected in gyms as direct training partners of UFC champions due to their elite skills?