The Terminator vs The Matrix

[HappyCamper]

I prefer T1 to T2.

Ah, a fellow patrician.

 

[Philo-Publius]

2 movies about humans having to overcome machine overlords

I went easy on Matrix by not putting it against T2

Easy win for The Terminator.

 

[Jack Reacheround]

Matrix. I love Terminator. But c’mon.

 

[jml4life]

Ah, a fellow patrician.

Why do you prefer T1?

 

[Blayt7hh]

I went with T1. I actually prefer T1 to T2. There is just a certain level of soul and charm to the first one that isn’t going to be found in a blockbuster. It was also very dark and atmospheric. I totally understand why people prefer 2 though.

The Matrix was also a great movie though. Anyone who was old enough to see it when it came out knows that it had a massive cultural impact. I do feel like it didn’t age as well as the Terminators did though

 

[Iroh]

Don't recall, just hope it's treated in the same way as the previous 3. Keanu was brilliant.

More like the first than the third, I hope. But given the subject, it has the potential to truly be fuckimg brilliant! Even if it will probably not live up to it's potential or maybe won't even get finished cus of covid, I'm still stoked.

I fucking LOVE the matrix. Watching the first one for the first time was probably the single intensest mind blow job a movie has given me. It lasted at least through the next 15 views of the film.

I hope it's not gotten SJWed though. That would take the soul and message right out of it.

 

[fingercuffs]

More like the first than the third, I hope. But given the subject, it has the potential to truly be fuckimg brilliant! Even if it will probably not live up to it's potential or maybe won't even get finished cus of covid, I'm still stoked.

I fucking LOVE the matrix. Watching the first one for the first time was probably the single intensest mind blow job a movie has given me. It lasted at least through the next 15 views of the film.

I hope it's not gotten SJWed though. That would take the soul and message right out of it.

I wouldn't think that it would, good thing about the idea is that it's alternate reality so hopefully any SJW rubbish can be shelved.

Husband went to the London premier and was blown away because hadn't really seen anything like that before. I saw the 2nd and 3rd in the cinema and actually stayed awake for both of them, shame I didn't see the first one in the cinema, it's so good.

 

[Possum Jenkins]

I can't believe a few people are saying The Matrix hasn't aged well.

I think it's aged EXTREMELY well given the latest theories about the universe being a simulation:



Are we living in a simulated universe? Here's what scientists say.

More realistically, physicists have proposed experiments that could yield evidence that our world is simulated. For example, some have wondered if the world is inherently “smooth,” or if, at the smallest scales, it might be made up of discrete “chunks” a bit like the pixels in a digital image. If we determine that the world is “pixelated” in this way, it could be evidence that it was created artificially.

https://www.nbcnews.com/mach/scienc...iverse-here-s-what-scientists-say-ncna1026916

 

[StewDogg11]

I prefer T1 to T2.

Same. A human vs. a T-800 is a much more daunting and scary task than a T-800 vs. a T-1000. Not to mention Sarah was a bowed up firearms expert in the second one while she was pretty much a helpless waitress in the original.

 

[StewDogg11]

Voted the Matrix. Never seen T1.

Well then you can’t really vote in good faith can you?

 

[SirRealKiller]

The Matrix over T1

Terminator Franchise over Matrix franchise.

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

I can't believe a few people are saying The Matrix hasn't aged well.

I think it's aged EXTREMELY well given the latest theories about the universe being a simulation:



Are we living in a simulated universe? Here's what scientists say.



https://www.nbcnews.com/mach/scienc...iverse-here-s-what-scientists-say-ncna1026916

For as much as i have looked into, the simulated reality is something physicists have fun slightly trolling people with. Thats is not to say that The Matrix is not extremely fucking scary how real elements of its premise applies to our real lives -- and holds up over the decades. I mean the concept of self actualizing AI is pretty terrifying at the macro level if you look at as creating another "life" form more intelligent than humans and what it means if it realizes its places on the pecking order.

Outside of that, concepts in the movie that seemed far fetched ended up, or could end up terrifyingly real. Take this for example this could explain how Neo had the ability to manipulate "the machine world" while being unplug from the matrix:
Biohackers Encoded Malware in a Strand of DNA

But yes, that movie fucking holds up big time.

 

[My Spot]

I loved all of The Matrix movies,

 

[Halge]

Nothing beats the Terminator theme. But Matrix is a better movie.

 

[Possum Jenkins]

For as much as i have looked into, the simulated reality is something physicists have fun slightly trolling people with. Thats is not to say that The Matrix is not extremely fucking scary how real elements of its premise applies to our real lives -- and holds up over the decades. I mean the concept of self actualizing AI is pretty terrifying at the macro level if you look at as creating another "life" form more intelligent than humans and what it means if it realizes its places on the pecking order.

Outside of that, concepts in the movie that seemed far fetched ended up, or could end up terrifyingly real. Take this for example this could explain how Neo had the ability to manipulate "the machine world" while being unplug from the matrix:
Biohackers Encoded Malware in a Strand of DNA

But yes, that movie fucking holds up big time.

Actually, I think the AI-becoming-smarter-than-us-and-enslaving us thing is the least realistic part of the movie. Noam Chomsky said in a video that people have been afraid of that since the early 50s when he started working at MIT. But to this day, computers don't show any creativity or independent thinking. They simply do the work they're programmed to do.

And while I haven't looked into it way too much, the simulation thing seems pretty real. I remember reading articles of teams of physicists saying they can/will run experiments that can prove this. Also, Neil DeGrasse Tyson has spoken on it tons of times and it's always serious.

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

Actually, I think the AI-becoming-smarter-than-us-and-enslaving us thing is the least realistic part of the movie. Noam Chomsky said in a video that people have been afraid of that since the early 50s when he started working at MIT. But to this day, computers don't show any creativity or independent thinking. They simply do the work they're programmed to do.

And while I haven't looked into it way too much, the simulation thing seems pretty real. I remember reading articles of teams of physicists saying they can/will run experiments that can prove this. Also, Neil DeGrasse Tyson has spoken on it tons of times and it's always serious.

I think Noams knowledge of it is limited to his days trying to aid in developing Command and Control technology during the late 50's early 60's that end failing at the time -- but has been successfully implemented later via other programing methods. Uploading consciousness into a cybernetic system was way out of reach during chomsky's time -- but its becoming a reality now - and with that, theres pathways that are leading us to developing computers with analytical decision making, so its not out of the realm that self actualization is out of the cards.

Its an unprovable hypothesis (akin to proving a deity) at best, we can and have proven elements that can resemble aspects of the theory - like, photon afterglow being able to carry information without carrying energy, aspect of quarks coding rambling computer coding , etc. The Perimeter Institute in Waterloo Ontario has had several if its theoretical physicists hold live talks on this issue and released papers -- they always preface it as a grain of salt / fun topic. Check out Nick Bostrom's work on it if you want the philosophy side and Hod Lipson for the practical

 

[I Am Legion]

Both groundbreaking. Both amazing, Terminator takes it.

 

[j123]

In terms of which movie I liked, I'm more interested in Terminator due to the blend of it reaching into the field of "magic"

In terms of story which A.I is better and achieving their goals, I have to say it would be the Machines in the Matrix. The machines have basically gotten to the point of gaining full sentience and emotions on par with humans, they also have enslaved and colonized humans with an iron fist and there's basically no breaking the cycle. The idea of "the one" as a messiah figure to switch the roles back to the beginning is a contingency that was created under the Machines to make sure the Matrix stays functioning. Prior experimentation with it, it resulted in humans dying or waking up en-mass and it caused more net loss for them (humans being used as batteries for them. Weather that is for creative processing power or actual energy cell is a big debate with movie critics).

With Earth basically fucked with the mistakes of humanity in the past (electromagnetic field encompassing Earth preventing sunlight in any form, thus all organic life is basically dead), the roles are reversed, humans are nothing but a tool that the Machines use to further their sustainability. Even in the unrealistic scenario where all humans woke up and escaped, they'd most likely die with food shortages and whatnaught. Zion, the main human city isn't viable with all woken humans coming back. Despite what the woken think, the location of Zion is known to the machines, it was all planned and a ruse. The city has been destroyed iirc 7 or 8 times. Each lasting about a century. Basically it's slavery for 100 years, matrix starts to crash, a group is woken up to rebel, the one shows up, machine absorbs the one, and zion is destroyed, and repeat.

Terminator-verse on the other-hand, Skynet / Legion are still controlled by their prime derivative, they haven't really pushed far enough yet to escape that that objective. That objective being the elimination of humans due to self-defense. It hasn't reached full sentience and still works off data and algorithms. You could argue they are more "technologically advanced" with liquid metal, that nano tech that mixed in with John Connor in Genysis, etc. but its a tool for a different scenario. Terminators are not the primary means of force for skynet, they still use mainly A.I tanks and large automatrons to destroy or harvest for the terminator program. Terminators are more like black ops teams that are of a fine scalpel than hammer. With the dominance over mankind that is the Machines in the Matrix, creating new tech wouldn't be an issue, but when you're so much in control as they are with most humans being hooked onto the Matrix and harvested/recycled, there isn't a need for their own upgraded terminators

 

[Possum Jenkins]

I think Noams knowledge of it is limited to his days trying to aid in developing Command and Control technology during the late 50's early 60's that end failing at the time -- but has been successfully implemented later via other programing methods. Uploading consciousness into a cybernetic system was way out of reach during chomsky's time -- but its becoming a reality now - and with that, theres pathways that are leading us to developing computers with analytical decision making, so its not out of the realm that self actualization is out of the cards.

Its an unprovable hypothesis (akin to proving a deity) at best, we can and have proven elements that can resemble aspects of the theory - like, photon afterglow being able to carry information without carrying energy, aspect of quarks coding rambling computer coding , etc. The Perimeter Institute in Waterloo Ontario has had several if its theoretical physicists hold live talks on this issue and released papers -- they always preface it as a grain of salt / fun topic. Check out Nick Bostrom's work on it if you want the philosophy side and Hod Lipson for the practical

Ok, I found the video where he talks about it. (I timestamped the part where he specifically talks about AI taking over, but the entire thing is great)



He mentions that Alan Turing himself thought it was a ridiculous proposition. This stuff is way over my head but it seems like he has a much higher standard for what "thinking" encompasses. He mentions that we can't even fully understand the decision-making of a bee flying around so the understanding of what human intelligence is is "eons away." Things like Watson and Deep Blue are just very developed machines that compute giant amounts of information but don't think for themselves.

Will check out the two dudes you mentioned.

 

[90 50]

For as much as i have looked into, the simulated reality is something physicists have fun slightly trolling people with. Thats is not to say that The Matrix is not extremely fucking scary how real elements of its premise applies to our real lives -- and holds up over the decades. I mean the concept of self actualizing AI is pretty terrifying at the macro level if you look at as creating another "life" form more intelligent than humans and what it means if it realizes its places on the pecking order.

Outside of that, concepts in the movie that seemed far fetched ended up, or could end up terrifyingly real. Take this for example this could explain how Neo had the ability to manipulate "the machine world" while being unplug from the matrix:
Biohackers Encoded Malware in a Strand of DNA

But yes, that movie fucking holds up big time.

When he was manipulating the machines and shit “unplugged” I always figured it was a clue, he was still “plugged in” and a deeper part of the manipulation to believe he knew the truth, but still didn’t.

Like “Inception” levels of “Matrix” that he still isn’t out of yet.