The Surface Phone concept – the start of a spectrum shift for smartphones?

[M3t4tr0n]

I suspect that Gorilla Glass and its competitors are dumping a lot of research dollars into catering to the needs of people like you.

It's about time technology and science got off their ass and made something the human race can actually benefit from.

 

[ehtheist]

It's about time technology and science got off their ass and made something the human race can actually benefit from.

Don’t you consider being able to watch a recording of them on your phone a helpful advancement? I mean, in the past, prior to video capturing and playback technology, you’d have to gather all the midgets and farm animals together and get them diddling each other in the barn any time you wanted to watch porn. Good engineering and science has saved you a lot of effort and lawsuits methinks.

 

[bad seed]

Cliff’s Notes: If you could have a phone running full Windows or another full x86 OS instead of Android/iOS, would this be something you’d seriously consider when you were buying a phone in the future? Get ready - you may be presented with this choice in 2017.

With Windows Phone looking like it is on its way out, one might think that MS is giving up on the smart phone market, but it seems like that is not the case. The rumoured Surface Phone would mark not an abandonment of the smart phone market, but a full spectrum shift for MS in the mobile arena and possibly the start of a spectrum shift for smart phones as a whole. Why would anyone suggest an MS phone has such potential? Because the rumoured Surface phone is likely to contain an atom processor rather than an ARM one and, as such, run a full version of Windows rather than some rinky-dink mobile OS. Simply put, the Surface phone, if the rumours are true and MS’s update trajectory to Windows 10 proves fruitful, will be a full x86 computer the size of a smart phone, and not an app-reliant ARM based mobile device as we know them.

I’m curious concerning the Sherbro take on this concept – does it interest you? Imagine getting home and plugging your phone into a docking bay and having it output to a monitor/TV and have a keyboard and mouse and then it functioned as your fully on, honest-to-God computer. Or possibly even in a few years when wireless audio/video games kinks worked out, you literally plop it down and have it just output to your TV/monitor and wirelessly connect to human interface devices. The question is, if you walked in to get your next phone and you were presented with an ARM using Apple or Android based phone reliant on apps and app stores but were also offered a full x86 Windows 10 phone that worked like a regular computer, would you have an interest in the Microsoft phone using full Windows ahead of a phone using an app-store based ARM operating system? Do you think a lineup of phones that were full computers would have an impact on the smartphone market in a way that the ARM based Windows Mobile never could?

Now of course, if this does happen, I don’t expect great things immediately. You look at the original Surface Pro vs the Surface Pro 3 and 4 and the improvement has been *drastic* going from a device that had smaller screens but was heavier and had poor battery life to a lighter device with a larger screen that has fanless options, far better battery life, and in general is a vast improvement to the point where it competes with tablets as tablets and with laptops as laptops and has Apple actually trying to steal in on its success with the iPad Pro. An initial offering of a Surface Phone would likely suffer in the realm of battery life, heat generation, and kinks to work out of the software – but, so did the Surface tablet line and it has improved *drastically* in just a few years and carved out a very real niche in the computing world. If Surface phones suffer initially from these types of pitfalls, are they something you’d be interested in a few years down the road when battery life, heat generation, etc, aren’t issues any more?

Personally, I’ve always viewed ARM based tablets and phones as transitory technologies. The “there’s an app for that” mentality is a side effect of hardware limitations on small devices which lead to a phones and tablets having to be simply functionally inferior little computers, relying on ARM chips not because of functional capability so much as size, low heat generation and power requirements, and cheapness. The x86 chips just didn’t exist to make tablets and phones that could work like real computers – but those days are coming to an end, and x86 manufacturers like Intel have seen the writing on the wall and have spent years making their chips more heat, size, and power friendly. These days though I do wonder – ARM chips have become their own massive ecosystems and despite being outright inferior from a standpoint of what they can do, these inferior computing options have such huge lineups and apps in their ecosystems that I’m not sure x86 options will just make them disappear, if they make them disappear at all. ARM might be here to stay – the ARM based platforms are simply too big in both market and mindshare to have people drop them for much more functional x86 operating systems on phones. We’ll see.

Lastly, if this is to happen, it wouldn’t remain an MS exclusive item for long. Third parties releasing full x86 phones may be in the future – a proper x86 Linux phone rather than a stripped down Android built for ARM, possible full Mac OS phones, and other companies releasing phones running a full version of Windows. A Surface phone would just represent the first major offering of a x86 phone running a full OS rather than a stripped down ARM based mobile OS.

(for your reference, if you want to see an article on what is being speculated for the Surface phone)
http://www.itbusinessedge.com/blogs/unfiltered-opinion/microsoft-surface-phone-what-it-could-be.html

Still no Pokemon Go for Windows. Dead on arrival.

 

[ehtheist]

Still no Pokemon Go for Windows. Dead on arrival.

Actually, with emulation software like Bluestacks, it’s quite possible on a Windows device. Pretty much anything that is on Android would be available for this type phone, along side any legacy and desktop app that runs on a PC.


What I don’t think some people out there get is that, after years of people bitching and pissing and moaning about one phone having more or different apps than another, after judging a phone by the content of the app store it is tied to, a x86 phone has the potential to have everything. There are emulators for the Apple Store and the Google Play store which give you access to pretty much every damned thing on the two respective platforms, along with the backlog of PC legacy/desktop programs which dwarfs both of those app stores combined. I use the term “spectrum shift” because, in a way, a phone like this makes platform loyalty obsolete from a software standpoint. If you iPhone or Android device does something that you like, a x86 Windows phone can do it too. There is no “Oh, I can’t get that app on my phone…”

I’d like to think x86 phones are the future. Not necessarily Windows, but phones with this more capable type of processor. After years of people involved in the “I can get this app and you can’t” wars, after shunning of platforms for not having certain apps, will a phone that lets you get every app, regardless of platform, be appealing? Personally, I think most people are brand fanatics and only used the "oh, my phone has better apps" as an excuse to support them fetishizing their cellphones - but, we will see.

 

[kickboxjh]

I use my phone and computer for different tasks.

I like the idea though, because I know many younger people don't own computers at all, and only use them for work.

That being said most consumers only use a handful of apps, and have no use for a computer.

 

[BoogerDawson]

It certainly looks nice. However, my problem with Windows 10 mobile is the lack of apps that I need. I use a lot of google apps, and there's no Windows 10 equivalent. I have a Lumia 820, which I'm running Windows Phone 10. I use this as a mini-tablet. Both WP 8.1 and 10 have been very smooth and stable, more so than Android, which I use as my primary phone.

The Continuum feature is something that I'm not sure that I'd use very much.

 

[ehtheist]

It certainly looks nice. However, my problem with Windows 10 mobile is the lack of apps that I need. I use a lot of google apps, and there's no Windows 10 equivalent. I have a Lumia 820, which I'm running Windows Phone 10. I use this as a mini-tablet. Both WP 8.1 and 10 have been very smooth and stable, more so than Android, which I use as my primary phone.

The Continuum feature is something that I'm not sure that I'd use very much.

Keep in mind, what makes this a potential "spectrum shift" is that it wouldn't run Windows 10 mobile - it would run Windows 10 proper, on a true x86 processor. One of the biggest perks of a x86 processor is desktop style emulation. I use a Surface 3 tablet for my school work and I have Bluestacks on it. Essentially, I can use any Google Play store app on my tablet. Outside of horse power, RAM, etc, there is no reason an emulation program like Bluestacks couldn't be used to use any app in the Play store on a Surface phone.

 

[BoogerDawson]

Keep in mind, what makes this a potential "spectrum shift" is that it wouldn't run Windows 10 mobile - it would run Windows 10 proper, on a true x86 processor. One of the biggest perks of a x86 processor is desktop style emulation. I use a Surface 3 tablet for my school work and I have Bluestacks on it. Essentially, I can use any Google Play store app on my tablet. Outside of horse power, RAM, etc, there is no reason an emulation program like Bluestacks couldn't be used to use any app in the Play store on a Surface phone.

I'll try Bluestacks on my desktop. Thanks for the tip.

 

[ehtheist]

I'll try Bluestacks on my desktop. Thanks for the tip.

It’s great. I play all the Kingdom Rush games and Plants VS Zombies through it, and a few miscellaneous other Play store apps that I find beneficial to have access to.

 

[marioh]

That’s because my Surface 3 runs a x86, unlike the Surface 1 and 2, processor which gives it access to desktop and legacy apps. Now, if my phone could do this, which a Surface phone should be able to do, it would open up worlds beyond anything any phone has available from a software standpoint.

Surface Pro 1 and 2 ran full Windows 8. I thought the regular Surface 2 did as well.

 

[M3t4tr0n]

Don’t you consider being able to watch a recording of them on your phone a helpful advancement? I mean, in the past, prior to video capturing and playback technology, you’d have to gather all the midgets and farm animals together and get them diddling each other in the barn any time you wanted to watch porn. Good engineering and science has saved you a lot of effort and lawsuits methinks.

 

[bad seed]

Actually, with emulation software like Bluestacks, it’s quite possible on a Windows device. Pretty much anything that is on Android would be available for this type phone, along side any legacy and desktop app that runs on a PC.


What I don’t think some people out there get is that, after years of people bitching and pissing and moaning about one phone having more or different apps than another, after judging a phone by the content of the app store it is tied to, a x86 phone has the potential to have everything. There are emulators for the Apple Store and the Google Play store which give you access to pretty much every damned thing on the two respective platforms, along with the backlog of PC legacy/desktop programs which dwarfs both of those app stores combined. I use the term “spectrum shift” because, in a way, a phone like this makes platform loyalty obsolete from a software standpoint. If you iPhone or Android device does something that you like, a x86 Windows phone can do it too. There is no “Oh, I can’t get that app on my phone…”

I’d like to think x86 phones are the future. Not necessarily Windows, but phones with this more capable type of processor. After years of people involved in the “I can get this app and you can’t” wars, after shunning of platforms for not having certain apps, will a phone that lets you get every app, regardless of platform, be appealing? Personally, I think most people are brand fanatics and only used the "oh, my phone has better apps" as an excuse to support them fetishizing their cellphones - but, we will see.

but wont there be a substantial performance hit using emulation?

 

[ehtheist]

Surface Pro 1 and 2 ran full Windows 8. I thought the regular Surface 2 did as well.

The Surface Pro series have all run full Windows. The regular Surface though – 1 and 2 both ran Windows RT and had ARM processors. On the regular non-pro Surface line, the 3 was the first one to actually sport a x86 processor.

 

[ehtheist]

but wont there be a substantial performance hit using emulation?

I don’t notice it with the games I play on my Surface 3. A vast majority of apps are fairly resource light because they all but have to work on crappy budget phones with piss-all for RAM and terrible processors. I can’t say for sure whether an emulated Pokemon Go would run well on a phone that doesn’t exist yet but my experience using Bluestacks to emulate Android apps on my Surface 3 – which only has an Atom processor – is that I’ve never had so much as a hiccup.

 

[ehtheist]

Just wait until VR technology gets better - you'll feel like you're in the barn covered in pig shit.

 

[M3t4tr0n]

Just wait until VR technology gets better - you'll feel like you're in the barn covered in pig shit.

Sounds like my usual Saturday night

No but for real was watching some Ted talks the other day and seen a couple on holograms and VR and that shits for real. The future is here.

 

[BoogerDawson]

It’s great. I play all the Kingdom Rush games and Plants VS Zombies through it, and a few miscellaneous other Play store apps that I find beneficial to have access to.

I installed it on my desktop to try out. I don't know if it'll work better on a phone as there is one issue that is somewhat of a pain with the desktop. For an app like Gmail or Google Voice, when I compose a message or text, with Bluestacks, I have to type out the complete email address or phone number. On an Android phone, the first character I type, all my contacts that start with that character are pulled up, which I can select. I rely on Google Voice and use Gmail quite a bit, so for it to work properly is essential for me. Anyways, I'm very interested to see how the Surface Phone turns out.

 

[ehtheist]

I installed it on my desktop to try out. I don't know if it'll work better on a phone as there is one issue that is somewhat of a pain with the desktop. For an app like Gmail or Google Voice, when I compose a message or text, with Bluestacks, I have to type out the complete email address or phone number. On an Android phone, the first character I type, all my contacts that start with that character are pulled up, which I can select. I rely on Google Voice and use Gmail quite a bit, so for it to work properly is essential for me. Anyways, I'm very interested to see how the Surface Phone turns out.

Good to know. I've never used mail programs or Google Voice with Bluestacks with it. Hope it works out better for you, as I've found it pretty awesome.

 

[DrBdan]

I'm not really a hardware guy so I'm not sure that I care specifically about x86 vs ARM or whatever but when I saw a demo video of Continuum I thought it was a brilliant idea. I would totally buy a phone that could be docked and used like a laptop or connected to a TV to stream videos.

 

[D3thr0n3d K1ng]

The raw capability of the devices - they offer exponentially more software options than things like Android and iOS.

Such as?

Also, I desperately hope you don't use a Samsung device if you're calling Windows "bloaty"

Even a Samsung phone with all that Touchwhiz Sampack crap still runs better than any original version of Windows. Can you imagine Windows 10 or Vista on your phone? You get in a life threatening situation, have to make an emergency call and your phone crashes on you as youre trying to call for help. Lulz no thanks.