The Rear-Foot Elevated Split Squat

[Cratos]

Does the RFESS build functional strength??

Only if done on a Bosu ball, with eyes closed.

 

[Jay]

dude, of course it does. It's from functionalstrengthcoach.com.
The RFESSoBBwEC is better though.

 

[k1ck]

I'm not a doctor, but following common sense I'd say that the pressure on the spine and potential injury risk is higher in this exercise. Your spine is not really very safe standing on one leg with half of your squat max on your back... It's better to stand on both legs and distribute twice the weight equally.. but that's just me.

 

[vision1]

Mike Boyl is a skinny fuck who probably doesn't even lift weights. The whole point of squatting is to build the posterior chain. "Oh no the lower back is getting in the way of training my quads like a bodybuilder!" He is a good example of why most coaches are garbage.

I don't think you understood his point of view

 

[joshetc]

Mike Boyl is a skinny fuck who probably doesn't even lift weights. The whole point of squatting is to build the posterior chain. "Oh no the lower back is getting in the way of training my quads like a bodybuilder!" He is a good example of why most coaches are garbage.

Thank you.

Your back being the weak point in squats is the shittiest reason to not do squats, ever. If your back is the weak point it means you SHOULD SQUAT MORE.. not do it less.

 

[vision1]

If your back is the weak point it means you SHOULD SQUAT MORE.. not do it less.

Why?

 

[SDMF]

Why?

...

 

[vision1]

...

...

 

[Cap'n]

I want those 5 minutes of my life back.

 

[SDMF]

...

We are all waiting for you to explain why squats suck, since you love this Mike Boyle twink so much.

 

[vision1]

Why don't you explain why back squats suck to us, since you love this Mike Boyle twink so much.

Do you have zero reading comprehension? Where did I say back squats suck? Where did I show my love for Boyle?

Josh said you should squat more if your back is the weak point and I didn't understand that. Should you squat less if your back is the strong point?

 

[SDMF]

Do you have zero reading comprehension? Where did I say back squats suck? Where did I show my love for Boyle?

Josh said you should squat more if your back is the weak point and I didn't understand that. Should you squat less if your back is the strong point?

Well first you were acting like I didn't understand Boyle's point of view which I do -- he thinks split squats or unilateral work is better than squats because the lower back/posterior chain is not as much of a limiting factor. Boyle is an idiot because the lower back and overall torso strength is much more relevant to "functional strength" than unilateral leg strength. If the lower back is weak it should be strengthened, not left to stagnate while you do movements to work around the weakness. A chain is only as strong as the weakest link.

 

[vision1]

Well first you were acting like I didn't understand Boyle's point of view which I do -- he thinks split squats or unilateral work is better than squats because the lower back/posterior chain is not as much of a limiting factor.

Yes

Boyle is an idiot because the lower back and overall torso strength is much more relevant to "functional strength" than unilateral leg strength.

Debatable. Depends entirely on what "function" we're talking about.

If the lower back is weak it should be strengthened, not left to stagnate while you do movements to work around the weakness. A chain is only as strong as the weakest link.

Boyle doesn't mention the rest of his programming in the presentation, but I'm sure he has other exercises to work the lower back.

A chain is only as strong as the weakest link, but the weakest link will change with different movements. You have to remember that Boyle trains athletes in a wide variety of sports. Does a hockey player trying to improve his skating speed require the same lower back development as a power lifter? I'm pretty confident a power lifter requires a higher lower back:legs strength ratio than most athletes. It wouldn't make sense to have that hockey player ignore split-squats and stick to only back squats when the limiting factor in his skating speed is quad strength for example.

 

[joshetc]

Do you have zero reading comprehension? Where did I say back squats suck? Where did I show my love for Boyle?

Josh said you should squat more if your back is the weak point and I didn't understand that. Should you squat less if your back is the strong point?

I don't see how the inverse works, and never said that.

If your back is too weak to squat why would you not squat? The posterior chain effects of squatting are half the reason to do so.

 

[joshetc]

A chain is only as strong as the weakest link, but the weakest link will change with different movements. You have to remember that Boyle trains athletes in a wide variety of sports. Does a hockey player trying to improve his skating speed require the same lower back development as a power lifter? I'm pretty confident a power lifter requires a higher lower back:legs strength ratio than most athletes. It wouldn't make sense to have that hockey player ignore split-squats and stick to only back squats when the limiting factor in his skating speed is quad strength for example.

Obviously powerlifters or any lifters in general require more lower back strength than any other athletes. That is the nature of the sport, though. This doesn't mean a hockey player can neglect PC work in favor of a lift that does everything the squat does and less.

 

[oxcart]

Obviously powerlifters or any lifters in general require more lower back strength than any other athletes. That is the nature of the sport, though. This doesn't mean a hockey player can neglect PC work in favor of a lift that does everything the squat does and less.

Boyle would seem to be arguing that the stress on the legs is restricted by the lower back in the squat. If that's true, your last sentence doesn't hold. I don't know why everyone is getting so worked up. This is a place for discussion last time I checked.

 

[SDMF]

Boyle would seem to be arguing that the stress on the legs is restricted by the lower back in the squat. If that's true, your last sentence doesn't hold. I don't know why everyone is getting so worked up. This is a place for discussion last time I checked.

Do you think posterior chain/torso strength is not important for athletes?

 

[vision1]

Do you think posterior chain/torso strength is not important for athletes?

That's not the point. Why use back squats as your main leg movement, when the weight you're able to use is limited by back strength? You can always do single leg squats + PC exercises to make up for the lack of hip extension in split-squats.

It's kind of similar to someone wanting to strengthen their erectors as much as possible, but can't do heavy deadlifts because their grip gives out. Should this person use sub-max weights and never fully stress their erectors, or should they switch to using straps while simultaneously doing grip specific exercises on the side?


The main flaw in Boyle's argument is he assumes that lower back strength is the limiting factor in EVERYONE's back squat, which is definitely not the case. I'm 99% sure I'm one of those people who doesn't fit into that category. My heavy squats always turn into goodmornings because my body naturally forces my strong back to do most of the work.

The way Boyle concludes that leg recruitment is limited due to being able to use more than 50% loads on split-squats is idiotic. It's a completely different movement, and the elevated leg does a fair bit of work. A better test would be to perform a single leg squat off of a high box (ie. a pistol where the unloaded leg can hang down the side of the box). You also need to take into account the extra BW load. With a bi-lateral squat, body weight is spread across both feet, whereas with the test I described, the entire BW is placed on one foot. You then have to figure out which parts of your body don't add to the load (like the loaded foot for example). Much more complicated than Boyle realizes.

 

[SDMF]

That's not the point. Why use back squats as your main leg movement, when the weight you're able to use is limited by back strength? You can always do single leg squats + PC exercises to make up for the lack of hip extension in split-squats.

Because the legs cannot transfer force upward without a strong posterior chain. On top of that, hip strength is far more important than quad strength, which Mike Boyle does not seem to understand. You say do PC chain exercises to make up for it... Hmmm... What is the most obvious posterior chain exercise... Holy shit, the back squat, which we just replaced because Mike Boyle hasn't learned anything in his 25 years of coaching. Maybe we should just replace squats with leg extensions, that way we don't have to worry about these silly compound movements where you have weaknesses.

 

[vision1]

Because the legs cannot transfer force upward without a strong posterior chain.

Then how the fuck do they transfer force upwards during a split-squat?

On top of that, hip strength is far more important than quad strength, which Mike Boyle does not seem to understand.

More important for what? Back Squats? You don't seem to understand that different movements require strength in different muscles.

You say do PC chain exercises to make up for it... Hmmm... What is the most obvious posterior chain exercise... Holy shit, the back squat, which we just replaced because Mike Boyle hasn't learned anything in his 25 years of coaching.

Don't tell me you can't think of better posterior chain exercises...

Maybe we should just replace squats with leg extensions, that way we don't have to worry about these silly compound movements where you have weaknesses.

You're right ... Split-squats are an isolation movement that only targets the quads ... :icon_neut