The Problem Isn't Ngannou or His Agent

[wwkirk]

Can the mods just merge it all in a big “I hate Dana” thread, please?

But there are so many flavors of Dana hating, and so many different reasons to hate him, with fresh ones appearing all the time. What to speak of the endless possibilities of Dana memes.

Dana himself would want all anti-Dana threads merged!​

 

[nhbfan8080]

.............

Now, one could argue that CAA playing hardball has a negative impact on their fighters, but with the exceptions of a few non-CAA fighters like Ronda, Conor, Anderson, and Jon, one could also argue that it has lead to quite a few of CAA's fighters having rather successful MMA careers (opportunities).

TLDR - The majority of heated negotiations and fall outs with top fighters that the UFC has had over the years have revolved around Dana's 13 plus year pissing match with CAA, further escalated by WME's purchase of UFC; mostly due to CAA being concerned more with their clients' best interests than those of UFC and WME. Which is exactly what anyone, in any industry, should fully expect from the agency that represents them.

Big thanks to anyone that read the whole thing.

Fun Fact: For all of you that are unsure why Dana is giving Jake Paul so much attention - Jake's "Warlock" manager that Dana mentioned recently is UFC's former Chief Financial Officer (2011-2016), and both Jake and his brother, Logan, are clients of WME's talent division. Logan was signed to CAA prior to joining his brother on WME's roster - It's all relative.

Great post. What happens if nearly every fighter just signed with CAA, that would be like having union.

 

[Bend NvR Break]

That's because he can't be in that position with his current ranking. Main events and co-main are usually title fights since they usually like to have 2 or more title fights on the same card. Nate has been a part of the biggest PPV's, so he does move the needle. UFC was just smart to stack the card and the match up, Nate vs Masvidal was great matchmaking for casual interest. You see the difference in PPV buys when it's Nate and Masvidal as the main event. There's usually an extra 300--600k buys compared to other cards.

Maybe. Maybe not. We won't know until Nate gets the opportunity to carry a card by himself as the A side. The issue is Nate wants (and I understand why) high profile opponents so we'll never know.

 

[weaselkenievil]

Thanks for posting, interesting read. Ignore the many idiots who get confused by a few paragraphs and then think they're cool by posting TLDR. Not sure why you would brag about the fact that you're so stupid you struggle to read a minutes worth of text. If it's too long for you shut the fuck up and go and comment on something you can read.

 

[avenue94]

You know if for example Paradigm, who Conor is repped by, has a similar rivalry with WME than CAA does?

They are small fish compared to CAA or WME.

Great post. What happens if nearly every fighter just signed with CAA, that would be like having union.

You would run into issues of conflict of interest before that point. What happens when all your agents have clients who are in the same division and want a title shot? That kind of problem, you see it with Ali in mma. You can't really rip 2 contenders in the same division without favoring one.

 

[MCS]

They are small fish compared to CAA or WME.

You would run into issues of conflict of interest before that point. What happens when all your agents have clients who are in the same division and want a title shot? That kind of problem, you see it with Ali in mma. You can't really rip 2 contenders in the same division without favoring one.

Can be small or big, but point is Ngannou's perspective. If a 3rd option would be better as both WME and CAA can have their downsides.

 

[FIghtxIQ]

Maybe. Maybe not. We won't know until Nate gets the opportunity to carry a card by himself as the A side. The issue is Nate wants (and I understand why) high profile opponents so we'll never know.

A or B side he helps sell the card. The numbers support that. He can't be main event without a belt on the line. Only Conor can main event a non-title fight. Doesn't mean other fighters not Conor doesn't also have casual interests. He may not sell to Conor's numbers, but it will be higher than most on the roster. Only a few UFC fighters are known by the casuals and Nate Diaz is one of them.

 

[FIghtxIQ]

It's risk versus reward, and the reward is much greater than the risk, because there is no risk.

It's very well known in the MMA community that UFC fighters are underpaid. That's been out in the open for a long time, there's no risk in that being echoed over and over again, even to casuals by influential figures like Jake. It will do very little to change much of anything.

UFC fighters themselves have complained about low pay for almost 20 years. What's changed? You also have to take two things into consideration - WME makes a lot of money from Jake, and there's no such thing as bad press.

Casuals watching Jake knock out former, aged and on the verge of retirement, UFC fighters does not hurt the UFC's brand in any kind of way. The UFC parted ways with them, as they were deemed to no longer be UFC caliber.

Take all of the crazy things Jones and McGregor have (allegedly) done over the years, while under contract with UFC, all of them, every detail, give it a bit of thought, then tell me that you are actually convinced that Jake Paul can hurt the UFC's brand or marketability. If those two can't do it, he can't either.

Jake Paul alone is not going to force UFC to raise their expenses, no matter what he says.

All things considered, there is literally nothing happening regarding Jake and Dana that doesn't benefit WME. Jake bad mouthing Dana/UFC puts money in WME's bank account, Dana/UFC bad mouthing Jake puts money in WME's bank account. That's a lot to gain, with nothing to lose.

You are trying to say that WME/UFC is willing to tarnish their brand for one fighter? You really think Jake Paul is worth that much to WME to risk tarnishing the brand of one of their biggest earning business? Jake Paul is one fighter, they proved time and time again the brand is what matters most to them. Nothing good comes from media about UFC fighters being underpaid especially while they are having a lawsuit. This is just personal trash talk from both Dana and Jake. Dana talks shit about DLH because it's personal, they aren't doing it to try and promote each other, they do it to trash each other. Same with Jake and Dana, Jake took Dana's comments personal and hasn't stopped talking shit.

You should focus on what Jake's terms are and how much money would costs WME/UFC to implement that yearly from now on. No way that benefits WME/UFC, it's Jake trying to shit on Dana and UFC because he gets paid more and he's his own promoter.

 

[Rear Naked Toke]

Great post. What happens if nearly every fighter just signed with CAA, that would be like having union.

That would be nice, but major agencies of any kind are not likely to sign newer/unknown talent.

They would get very little in return in exchange for their time and efforts.

They could however use their resources to form a legit MMA union, and welcome anyone that fights, as unions require a fee to be a member.

CAA fighters, themselves, have attempted to form a union in the past, but until lower tiered fighters are confident enough to join them in their efforts, a union is unlikely.

The majority of low tiers are afraid of retaliation from the UFC if they try to unionize.

 

[Quietus]

shorter TLDR: Dana is a petty, psychotic gambling addict put into a position of power. Shitshows ensue.

 

[Rear Naked Toke]

You are trying to say that WME/UFC is willing to tarnish their brand for one fighter? You really think Jake Paul is worth that much to WME to risk tarnishing the brand of one of their biggest earning business? Jake Paul is one fighter, they proved time and time again the brand is what matters most to them. Nothing good comes from media about UFC fighters being underpaid especially while they are having a lawsuit. This is just personal trash talk from both Dana and Jake. Dana talks shit about DLH because it's personal, they aren't doing it to try and promote each other, they do it to trash each other. Same with Jake and Dana, Jake took Dana's comments personal and hasn't stopped talking shit.

You should focus on what Jake's terms are and how much money would costs WME/UFC to implement that yearly from now on. No way that benefits WME/UFC, it's Jake trying to shit on Dana and UFC because he gets paid more and he's his own promoter.

You are trying to say that the brand is going to be tarnished by one person whom, in the grand scheme of things, is irrelevant in the fight business. I've looked at Jake's requests, and it's foolish to think the UFC is going to accept them.

Why would they? So they can have him in the UFC? Why would they want him?

Since the UFC purchase in 2001, by the Fertitta's, the UFC's brand has been damaged not one time, and a lot of shit has happened and been said in those 20 years, all while rising from a 2 million dollar company to a 5 billion dollar company. All of a sudden, Jake Paul is going to be their demise?

The lawsuits have been going on for years, and in that time many fighters, whether a part of the lawsuit or not, have gone on record about how the UFC operates. It affects nothing.

Also, since the most prominent lawsuit is a class action, it involves every single fighter from a certain time frame that doesn't personally go through the process of opting out.

Mark Hunt has an individual lawsuit, and even though it's still ongoing, he's been ordered by the judge to pay all of the UFC's costs related to the case. Think about that for a minute.

This is corporate America; not anybody involved can afford to take on a multi-billion dollar company and expect to come out victorious.

Will payouts increase in the future? Sure, but they've been increasing for the last 20 years, all while UFC's revenue and profits increase with them.

 

[Oscar Madison]

 

[Rear Naked Toke]

 

[FIghtxIQ]

You are trying to say that the brand is going to be tarnished by one person whom, in the grand scheme of things, is irrelevant in the fight business. I've looked at Jake's requests, and it's foolish to think the UFC is going to accept them.

Why would they? So they can have him in the UFC? Why would they want him?

Since the UFC purchase in 2001, by the Fertitta's, the UFC's brand has been damaged not one time, and a lot of shit has happened and been said in those 20 years, all while rising from a 2 million dollar company to a 5 billion dollar company. All of a sudden, Jake Paul is going to be their demise?

The lawsuits have been going on for years, and in that time many fighters, whether a part of the lawsuit or not, have gone on record about how the UFC operates. It affects nothing.

Also, since the most prominent lawsuit is a class action, it involves every single fighter from a certain time frame that doesn't personally go through the process of opting out.

Mark Hunt has an individual lawsuit, and even though it's still ongoing, he's been ordered by the judge to pay all of the UFC's costs related to the case. Think about that for a minute.

This is corporate America; not anybody involved can afford to take on a multi-billion dollar company and expect to come out victorious.

Will payouts increase in the future? Sure, but they've been increasing for the last 20 years, all while UFC's revenue and profits increase with them.

You just proved my point. You didn't really argue it. I said UFC wouldn't do that ever, it is not in their best interest for someone like Jake Paul who isn't part of the UFC diss UFC and their fighter pay and contracts. He's exposing the problems with UFC in pay and contracts. You think this type of media exposure benefits UFC/WME and this is something they are planning with Jake Paul? No because it'll just makes the companies fighters all unhappy and make them realize they are getting under paid and have bad contracts compared to boxing.

The point of the lawsuits is anti-trust lawsuits, so having bad contracts is part of that and not paying the fighters properly is also part of that. That's why UFC/WME made contract adjustments after buying UFC and Dana is always saying how their fighters get paid more than some boxers and using their highest paid fighters as examples. Which even then doesn't compare to the highest paid boxers and their champions. This is why a lot of fighters are wanting to switch to boxing. Contracts and pay is better if you can get your boxing to a high level or get a Jake/Logan Paul fight. Plus you can be your own promoter and protected by the Ali Act as a boxer. No protections as an mma fighter.

So no, none of this benefits WME/UFC in any way.

 

[Takes Two To Tango]

I haven't read what you wrote TS, but I liked it anyways just because many have already. So I just go along with the group.

 

[Mike]

You're not wrong. Dana finds every way he can to throw fighters under the bus when they ask for more money. He does it to everyone, even massive draws.

 

[honzo]

It wasn't even long and was pretty informative.

What was your series TS?

 

[Rear Naked Toke]

But there are so many flavors of Dana hating, and so many different reasons to hate him, with fresh ones appearing all the time. What to speak of the endless possibilities of Dana memes.

Dana himself would want all anti-Dana threads merged!​

Nice AV, forgot about him.

 

[Law of One]

Why do people brag about not having the literacy or attention span to read something that takes like 3 minutes? Do you also brag about not being able to do 20 pushups?

thanks TS, interesting read

 

[Rear Naked Toke]

You just proved my point. You didn't really argue it. I said UFC wouldn't do that ever, it is not in their best interest for someone like Jake Paul who isn't part of the UFC diss UFC and their fighter pay and contracts. He's exposing the problems with UFC in pay and contracts. You think this type of media exposure benefits UFC/WME and this is something they are planning with Jake Paul? No because it'll just makes the companies fighters all unhappy and make them realize they are getting under paid and have bad contracts compared to boxing.

The point of the lawsuits is anti-trust lawsuits, so having bad contracts is part of that and not paying the fighters properly is also part of that. That's why UFC/WME made contract adjustments after buying UFC and Dana is always saying how their fighters get paid more than some boxers and using their highest paid fighters as examples. Which even then doesn't compare to the highest paid boxers and their champions. This is why a lot of fighters are wanting to switch to boxing. Contracts and pay is better if you can get your boxing to a high level or get a Jake/Logan Paul fight. Plus you can be your own promoter and protected by the Ali Act as a boxer. No protections as an mma fighter.

So no, none of this benefits WME/UFC in any way.

None of that is a new discovery for MMA fighters, they already know the contracts are shit and that they're paid less than some boxers, but some are paid more than most boxers. Transitioning to boxing is not some kind of mega solution for most MMA fighters' financial woes, especially considering that boxing is much more dangerous than MMA.

I'm saying UFC won't sign Jake because he has no business being in the UFC, it has nothing to do with what he's saying in the media. I'm not sure how you think that I'm agreeing with you. So far, I've agreed with nothing that you've said. Also, boxing is far more corrupt than MMA, and you're talking about it like it's greener pastures. Is the money better, yes, for a very select few.

If Jake wasn't already an internet star, he would not be making the type of money in boxing that he is right now. Name one other boxer that's 5-0 that draws any kind of attention or makes the kind of money Jake does, or made millions in their debut. You're talking about Jake like he's some sort of standard when he's probably the largest anomaly in the history of combat sports.

The road map that you're presenting is that an MMA fighter can simply defy the enormous odds already stacked against them, get signed by UFC, become a household name, then transition to boxing to make more money.

They would have better odds playing the lottery.