The most liberal pope since Jesus?

[Aegon Spengler]

The current Pope, Pope Francis, is pretty liberal. He tried to change the catholic stance towards gays, condoms are still cool these days, he's even encouraging people to try and fight corporate greed: meaning he wants to address poverty and climate change.

IMO he's the most liberal pope since Jesus, unless you count Oprah as Pope of America, which she of course is.

 

[Ruprecht]

Yeah, I read a bit about his climate activism.
Not that his views are that extreme though really, since Catholicism has fairly strong social justice traditions (especially in South America) and since he's not from the US (the link between the denial of climate change, right wing conservative Christianity and a focus on eschatology is really an American thing, and more protestant than Catholic).
Quite a contrast to Ratzinger though, who really was pretty far towards the Right on the political spectrum of bishopdom.

 

[uppercutbus]

What is his stance on gays and condoms?

Lots of claims here. Bet it's just some vague smooth talking and ppl are intepreting it as "supporting gays".

 

[second sight]

he's playing rope a dope with the liberals, giving them climate change and sneaking in abortion

 

[dontsnitch]

The opinions of the pope are just the opinions of one man. The weight of his opinions are overrated.

 

[LionExMachina]

He's a "face" to former pope Maledict's "heel", nothing more.

They trotted him out to fill pews and repair the damaged PR that occurred when people in parishes around the world got sick of centuries of bum-sex that priests in his religious corporation were having with small children.

 

[Ruprecht]

I just googled and read a bit, and I don't think he supports gays. He's just backed away from active political opposition. As a bishop he opposed gay marriage in Argentina. The closest I've read to support was his statement, "Who are we to judge?"
Also it was Pope Benedict that said condoms were OK to prevent disease (but not for contraception, which seems a little vague). Pope Francis is still conservative on contraception issues, although he's said being a good Catholic doesn't mean breeding like rabbits.

 

[Ruprecht]

The opinions of the pope are just the opinions of one man. The weight of his opinions are overrated.

Not so much, in terms of the number of people and the effect his opinions can have.
To act like the Pope doesn't have real political and religious/cultural influence is... naive at best.

 

[Makani]

Funny how God can change his mind so much in a couple years.

 

[dontsnitch]

Not so much, in terms of the number of people and the effect his opinions can have.
To act like the Pope doesn't have real political and religious/cultural influence is... naive at best.

I didn't say that his words don't influence people, just that people put too much emphasis on them.

What does the Pope know that others don't? He's a symbol, and a powerful one, but that's it.

 

[dabausplaya]

 

[Jack V Savage]

he's playing rope a dope with the liberals, giving them climate change and sneaking in abortion

Climate change CTs have nothing to do with the ideological spectrum, really. It's just that in America, oil money is extremely important to one of the major political parties and to funding right-wing "libertarian" propaganda.

 

[Ruprecht]

I didn't say that his words don't influence people, just that people put too much emphasis on them.

What does the Pope know that others don't? He's a symbol, and a powerful one, but that's it.

He's the leader of an organisation of 1.1 billion people. An organisation which believes certain of his pronouncements are "infallible" and inspired by God.

Hence why his opinions matter...

 

[dontsnitch]

He's the leader of an organisation of 1.1 billion people. An organisation which believes certain of his pronouncements are "infallible" and inspired by God.

Hence why his opinions matter...

The impact of his opinions, and the truth of his opinions are radically different things.

 

[Ruprecht]

The impact of his opinions, and the truth of his opinions are radically different things.

You said, "the weight of his opinions".
The "weight of his opinions" is carried by the 1.1 billion people that think his opinions represent the will of God and the rest of us that share a planet with them.
If all you meant was, "I'm not a Catholic and don't believe any of that stuff" that's what you should have said.

 

[GrindingANARCHY]

Funny how God can change his mind so much in a couple years.

God doesn't change his mind, it's sinful man who changes God's words. Sin is still sin, including homosexuality.

 

[dontsnitch]

You said, "the weight of his opinions".
The "weight of his opinions" is carried by the 1.1 billion people that think his opinions represent the will of God and the rest of us that share a planet with them.
If all you meant was, "I'm not a Catholic and don't believe any of that stuff" that's what you should have said.

Maybe I didn't explain myself well, I simply meant that we shouldn't put that much weight on his opinions, not that people aren't influenced by him, although how much they are influenced is also debatable.

I don't really believe in denominations, so I'm not Catholic, but I am Christian, there is considerable overlap.

 

[LionExMachina]

God doesn't change his mind, it's sinful man who changes God's words. Sin is still sin, including homosexuality.

What about enabling child rape in the name of god?

Venial or Mortal?

 

[Forkfoot]

He has not tried to change the Catholic stance on gays or condoms; that's just liberal media spin. Everything he's been saying that's got everyone calling him the papal Jimmy Carter is pure Catholic doctrine.

2358 The number of men and women who have deep-seated homosexual tendencies is not negligible. This inclination, which is objectively disordered, constitutes for most of them a trial. They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided. These persons are called to fulfill God's will in their lives and, if they are Christians, to unite to the sacrifice of the Lord's Cross the difficulties they may encounter from their condition.

^ Catechism of the Catholic Church

 

[Forkfoot]

He's the leader of an organisation of 1.1 billion people. An organisation which believes certain of his pronouncements are "infallible" and inspired by God.

Hence why his opinions matter...

None of the controversial statements Francis has made were made ex cathedra, i.e. under papal infallibility. Not that that matters since, as I said above, all of his statements have been in total alignment with preexisting Catholic doctrine.