The current HW division is embarrassing

[NextGen]

Guys who are natural heavyweights and very athletic usually will not go into MMA but other sports. Look at the heavyweight division in boxing. It’s not exactly strong there either. Getting punched in the head is not something most kids dream about growing up. They’d rather play other sports.

But that’s also what makes Aspinall so exciting because the UFC actually has one of those exceptions - a true HW with great athleticism and highly skilled. They’re just doing him dirty right now by giving Stipe a title shot over him and making him wait for a fight that may never materialize.

 

[The_Renaissance]

Highly original thread that hasn't been done multiple times per month for a decade. Don't watch. I skip 99% of WMMA fights for the same reason.

 

[Scheme]

Guys who are natural heavyweights and very athletic usually will not go into MMA but other sports. Look at the heavyweight division in boxing. It’s not exactly strong there either. Getting punched in the head is not something most kids dream about growing up. They’d rather play other sports.

But that’s also what makes Aspinall so exciting because the UFC actually has one of those exceptions - a true HW with great athleticism and highly skilled. They’re just doing him dirty right now by giving Stipe a title shot over him and making him wait for a fight that may never materialize.

It's not like other sports are much better prospects either. The percentage of people who want to become football/baseball/basketball/hockey/etc. athletes who actually make it there are very small.

Sports are a terrible career choice in general, you have to be the very best to get decent money, the average athlete's tenure is like 3-4 years in a lot of these leagues which means they on average have to make a lot of that money in 3-4 years to last the rest of their lives, you have to be marketable to make good money from sponsorships, drafted to a good team, etc. And it can easily all come crumbling down with an injury. On top of that other sports like NFL also have high rates of concussions and really bad injuries.

It's just a terrible career choice on many fronts, which is why usually only the poorest and most desperate become athletes. That is just turned to 11 in MMA with the explicit violence and worse pay.

 

[TeenageMutantLesnarTurtle]

View attachment 1069909
View attachment 1069910
Random 2014 rankings

Its a better top 10 than the current one, but its still not all that. Hunt, Rothwell and Browne were mediocre. Stipe had no real reputation yet and had recently lost to Struve. JDS, Cain and Reem were all somewhat past their peak. Werdum was 37 and wasnt anything special in his 00s Pride and UFC runs. Arlovski had people calling for his retirement in like 2010/11 already.

 

[marvinparsons]

Romanov is easily 30% bf

He clearly trains MMA, probably daily, so how many fucking calories does that guy put away to keep up that size??

They interviewed the Brazilian dude who dropped to LHW and he said that he had to eat 6,000 calories/day to keep his weight high enough for HW. So I'm assuming Romanov is in that range.

 

[NextGen]

BTW for the ones making fun of how MMA HWs look, here’s how the best NBA player looks like:



The issue with many of these MMA HWs isn’t even their physique but their lack of skill and technique. Some of them just hit hard enough to compensate.

 

[HI SCOTT NEWMAN]

Agreed Kitty Newman HW fighters think they don't have to train and rely on power - but then they don't have any cardio for the power XD bunch of chunkers

Very true, agreed. Also how many HW fights in UFC go to decision now? lots of them, there isn't even many KOs anymore in UFC HW fights, so many of them go to decision in modern times. Most of em can't bust a grape, nothing on those shots. For every 1 Tom, there are 15 awful HWs in UFC who have very little talent and skill. The division is the worst its ever been, we get a UFC HW title fight once every 2 years.

They are gonna have to put huge investment into the division, or just close it for now.

 

[TeenageMutantLesnarTurtle]

The division is the worst its ever been

Worse than the 90s?

Worse than the mid 00s with the likes of Paul Buentello, Gan McGee and Justin Eilers getting title shots at 2-0, 2-0 and 1-1 in the UFC respectively?

 

[TheGreatA]

HW is where the fat light heavyweights with no discipline go.

Let's face it though, any athletic heavyweight will probably choose another sport than MMA.

 

[killakillakilla]

HW would be better if the fighters could juice. UFC has had some legends though. Prime Cain and Prime JDS were both fucking great. DC vs Stipe 1 was a much more exciting matchup than the current Jones vs Stipe. UFC had Brock Lesnar, Randy Couture, Francis Ngannou. And Aspinall looks to have that potential too.

 

[Taric]

Sound like HW division has always been. Mostly jobbers with a handfull of good guys at the top.

In 2013 the UFC HW division consisted of these top 10 fighters:
Cain, JDS, Werdum, Cormier, Bigfoot, Barnett, Mir, Nogueira, Stipe, and Overeem

If you swapped out Bigfoot's name with Fedor's, that's basically a list of the top 10 greatest HWs ever. Maybe it's missing Ngannou.

So no, the UFC HW division used to be good.

 

[Taric]

It's not like other sports are much better prospects either.

What are you rambling about? NFL defensive ends (edge rushers) are on average 6'4, 285lbs, and top 1% athletes in strength, speed, and agility for their size.

Even the low end DE prospects who don't even make the NFL are incredible athletes.

 

[muaythaibeast]

Pride had a deeper division 20 years ago.

Lots of the top guys would be at 205, or even 185 today though, based on size. Mirko, Fedor, Don Frye, Couture, Coleman, Randleman, would all be smaller than someone like Jiri or Rakic.
There aren't that many legit 110kg+ athletic blokes out there that would do this for a living.

 

[theincognito]

In 2013 the UFC HW division consisted of these top 10 fighters:
Cain, JDS, Werdum, Cormier, Bigfoot, Barnett, Mir, Nogueira, Stipe, and Overeem

If you swapped out Bigfoot's name with Fedor's, that's basically a list of the top 10 greatest HWs ever. Maybe it's missing Ngannou.

So no, the UFC HW division used to be good.

There are guys right now that are better than some of those:

Aspinall
Francis
Gane
Nemkov
Almeida

If you have 5 active guys who are better than half the GOAT list, that's pretty good.

The problem is the division is spread out across different promotions.

And you have to let them juice.

 

[TeenageMutantLesnarTurtle]

In 2013 the UFC HW division consisted of these top 10 fighters:
Cain, JDS, Werdum, Cormier, Bigfoot, Barnett, Mir, Nogueira, Stipe, and Overeem

If you swapped out Bigfoot's name with Fedor's, that's basically a list of the top 10 greatest HWs ever.

At that time Nog, Barnett and Mir were all past their prime though, Nog by like a decade. Stipe wasnt THE Stipe yet, he was just some random dude who got knocked out by Stefan Struve. Werdum was a weird one, an aging guy who hadnt really made much of a mark in the 00s in his actual physical prime but was having a late career resurgence after the Fedor win.

Not saying it isnt still a strong list, it is. I think some of the current guys could beat some of those guys though.

 

[TadDunbar]

I had high hopes for Romanov but he decided to put on 25 lbs of fat

 

[fishbisquit]

If you take out the juicers, and you take out the fat guys, and then look at guys who are skilled, trained, and have heart...... in the last 40 years, it equals a handful. Throw a guy like goodridge in todays training and he may become the best heavyweight of all time. Right now, Fedor, Jones, Crocop, DC, Nog, Mir, and a few more arent just those guys, they are the only top 30 that even make the grade.

 

[Xoleth]

And yet there are some people in here who, unironically, believe that guys like Lewis, Romanov, Gane, and Tuivasa are "next generation" talent in relation to guys like Cain, Barnett, Fedor, Cormier, Kharitonov, Alexander, Mirko, etc.

Gane & Tuivasa would be grapplefucked by all of these guys.
Tuivasa would probably lose to them on the feet too.
Romanov has shitty striking. Good wrestling, though... for the first 3 minutes.

Still, Aspinall can be next generation talent. He is well rounded and talented.

 

[jarj]

LHW kills HW cause most good HW's are in the 220-235 region and these guys prefer to cut to 205

great fighters weighin 260 like aspinall, jones, gane and big frank are exceptions

These great fighters just prefer to cut 15-30 pounds for no reason? It's a personal challenge thing?

 

[Pancake Sprawl]

It's not like other sports are much better prospects either. The percentage of people who want to become football/baseball/basketball/hockey/etc. athletes who actually make it there are very small.

Sports are a terrible career choice in general, you have to be the very best to get decent money, the average athlete's tenure is like 3-4 years in a lot of these leagues which means they on average have to make a lot of that money in 3-4 years to last the rest of their lives, you have to be marketable to make good money from sponsorships, drafted to a good team, etc. And it can easily all come crumbling down with an injury. On top of that other sports like NFL also have high rates of concussions and really bad injuries.

It's just a terrible career choice on many fronts, which is why usually only the poorest and most desperate become athletes. That is just turned to 11 in MMA with the explicit violence and worse pay.

the biggest reason that nobody really addresses, is that there is zero prestige or respect for being a MMA fighter, world champion or not. all sports share the things you're talking about but only MMA has no prestige and that is due to a combination of many things. shitty pay, shitty fanbase, shitty organizations, the fact that becoming a pro MMA fighter means nothing, literally anyone can become one given how there is no standard except that you get paid to fight, the mental gymnastics that orgs like UFC go through just to create their own rankings so they can justify shit matchups that their algorithm showed is the highest percentage of selling the most amount of tickets.

nobody wants to kill themselves for a sport that not only won't appreciate you when you're in your prime but will guarantee shit on you when you're done.