Strength training for BJJ

Discussion in 'Strength & Conditioning Discussion' started by hundeblut, Aug 24, 2015.

  1. hundeblut

    hundeblut White Belt

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    Currently training BJJ for seven months now - usually two days a week. I have no plans for competing. I was looking for opinions on what type of strength-training I should add to compliment BJJ.

    I have intermediate numbers and narrowed my choices down to a Westside for Skinny Bastards variation versus a full-body 5/3/1 (alternating SQ/BP and DL/OHP with 1 or 2 accessories per day.)

    I'm leaning towards the Westside approach because it is geared towards a bit more size. After months of SS and Madcow, this is one of my goals. My only concern is how poorly will the extra mass hamper my BJJ endurance?
     
  2. Badger67

    Badger67 Taxidea taxus

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    Just a bit more size?
    If you're still training BJJ at the same level of intensity or more sessions per week of BJJ, not much if any.
     
  3. Jack Handy jr

    Jack Handy jr Silver Belt

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    do it don't drink the Kool-Aid with the whole "strength over technique" that's why a lot of your top BJJ practitioners juice. technique like strength only gets you so far in sub grappling .to be good imo you should work constantly on developing them both. my 2ct.
     
  4. KnightTemplar

    KnightTemplar Halloween Belt Platinum Member

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    If one of your goals is to get bigger, you could also try 5/3/1 with Boring But Big as assistance.
     
  5. Uchi Mata

    Uchi Mata Preaching the gospel of heel hooks and left kicks

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    You won't put on enough mass to hurt your BJJ unless you either juice or just get fat. 5/3/1 worked well for me, the big issue is not training weights so much that you're exhausted for BJJ. Make sure to keep your supplemental training supplemental. Guys who say they lift for BJJ and do BJJ 2x a week and lift 5x a week crack me up. The best way to get better at grappling is to grapple. I've got lots of funny pictures of my skinny legged love handled ass RNCing shirtless ripped dudes in tournaments.
     
  6. Emang8

    Emang8 Green Belt

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    How strong are you currently? Do you feel stronger than a lot of people you roll with?

    I myself have been an avid weightlifter for many many many years and have found strength to be very helpful in rolling. In my experiences when I was first starting out I was only lifting weights and doing a lot of explosive compound movements. While I was really strong my muscular endurance was lacking and after about 5 minutes of rolling my muscles were so fatigued they did me no good. This turned out to be a good thing and it forced me to learn how to be more technical. After a while I revamped my weightlifting program and lifted 3 times a week and focused more on BJJ, the more I did BJJ the better my muscular endurance got and the better my muscular endurance and cardio became the more fun BJJ became! Having a solid foundation in strength training helped me a lot because I didn't lose so much strength that I couldn't impose my will on my rolling partners. The type of strength training plan I adopted had doing squats and power cleans one day, bench, shoulder press, and tricep pushdowns another day, and barbell rows, deadlifts, and hammer curls another day. I kept the weights doable for a 8 - 10 rep range (not lifting heavy while doing BJJ, that's just crazy, before BJJ I lifted heavy (4-5 reps) all the time though).
     
  7. Tosa

    Tosa Red Belt

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    WS4SB has too much variety IMO. You're not practicing the same lifts enough to get really good at them. 5/3/1 has you regularly working with the same lifts, with each week building on the previous, and each 4wk cycle building on the one before that.
     
  8. oyaji poi

    oyaji poi oyaji belt

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    The only real difference between 531 and WS4SB is pre-planned programming of the main lift. The assistance/supplementary/accessory lifts are all optional with endless variations.

    I preferred WS4SB because I could do a 3-5 rep max which reflected how strong I was that day. I didn't like the confines of the 531 progression. This allowed me to vary the intensity depending on other sources of stress - this could be from grappling a lot, or not sleeping enough, or work/family etc. Regardless of all of those things 531 forces you to do a certain % in a certain order. With WS4SB you can lower or increase the intensity to suit your other training.
     
  9. oyaji poi

    oyaji poi oyaji belt

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    That being said, I roughly followed the WS4SB template. As Tosa said, it doesn't give you much practice on the main lifts. My solution to that was to skip the single leg stuff and do squat or deadlift as the first assistance lift.

    For lower body the basic template is:

    Main lift up to a 3-5RM
    Single leg 3-4x8-12 reps
    Hip-dominant lift
    Abs

    I rarely did a single leg lift, instead I would do either squat or deadlift for the prescribed set/rep range. Then follow up with something like back extensions or good morning or romanian deadlift.

    For upper body I'd do 3x10-15 with the main lift after the rep max

    Bench 3-5 RM
    Bench 3x10-15 or 2xAMAP (at 50-60% of the day's max)
    Row 4x10
    Accessory lifts (whatever is written in the WS4SB template)

    I lifted 3 times a week, Monday would be a combined upper and lower repetition day. Usually press or dips with chins, squats or deadlift variation 4-5x10-12, and/or sled drags/prowler pushing. Thurs lower ME, Friday upper ME.
     
  10. hundeblut

    hundeblut White Belt

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    Thanks all, I appreciate the responses

    While reviewing assistance template set-ups in W4SB ideas one thing that stood out was the use of unilateral movements (step-up and lunge variants).

    How useful are these in changing positions while grappling?
     
  11. KnightTemplar

    KnightTemplar Halloween Belt Platinum Member

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    I know even less about Grappling than I do about Strength Training.:eek: So take the following advice with a very large dose of salt: don''t worry too much about trying to replicate sport specific movement patterns. Focus on getting stronger at the main compound exercises, then apply that extra strength and power through the techniques of your chosen sport.

    Also, movements like Step Ups and Lunges can be added to any decent strength training program, like 5/3/1 or Juggernaut. They are not exclusive to W4SB.

    If you check the FAQ, there is an MMA Strength Training program designed by Glenn Pendlay himself.:cool:
     
  12. oyaji poi

    oyaji poi oyaji belt

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    One of the main mistakes people make in strength training is trying to replicate movement patterns from their sport with weights. Strength is a general quality that you develop in the weight room then apply in a specific context by practicing your sport.

    Perfect practice makes perfect. Practicing with dumbbells in hand or a barbell on your back is nothing at all like actually shooting a double. The result is a poorly performed shot and a compromised strength training movement using lighter weights which means you're not going to get better at shooting and you'll be weaker than if you did a proper exercise.

    I've personally never liked single leg movements, too many compromises and risk. I prefer the stability of two legged exercises.
     
  13. rE

    rE Orange Belt

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    Regarding the unilateral exercises, I would recommend Bulgarian split squats. I started doing it because my gym was short on weight, stayed for the quad and glute development.

    More importantly, as a BJJ guy(or if you were a wrestler/judoka) you want either full rope climbs without leg assistance if you can, or rope pullups(two ropes of towels side by side) to teach you how to exert force while gripping something. Everyone I know that has included them in their training has seen increased performance.
     
  14. monsieur_jj

    monsieur_jj Purple Belt

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    i have the same question, only that i can only lift two days a week usually sat and sunday and i do bjj 4x a week, i need a good routine of strength and weightloss(I got fat from honeymoon weight and have struggled to lose it because i am turning 30 soon)
     
  15. KnightTemplar

    KnightTemplar Halloween Belt Platinum Member

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    Both Juggernaut and 5/3/1 can be run as two day splits. Weight loss is more dependent on diet than training, though obviously training will play it's part.
     
  16. j123

    j123 Pro Sherdogger 500-0-1

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    If you're familiar with the rep/set schema for 531, this is a good variation for what you're requesting

    http://www.jimwendler.com/2012/02/531-and-mma/

    Weight loss will be the result of your diet
     
  17. Badger67

    Badger67 Taxidea taxus

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    ^ My only issue with that is PC's/snatches and variations aren't suggested (though can easily be thrown into the accessory work). I also find 5/3/1 to be a better "out of camp" program than in camp program.
     
  18. Bubblun

    Bubblun Brown Belt

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    dude, you could strength train as much as you want, but if you train 2 times per week bjj you are not going anywhere in bjj.
     
  19. KnightTemplar

    KnightTemplar Halloween Belt Platinum Member

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    Incorrect. You're never going to challenge serious, competitive BJJ players if you only train twice a week. But you will develop techniques and the ability to apply them. It will just take a lot longer, and be on a lower level, than the guy who lives in the academy.
     
  20. Pancake Sprawl

    Pancake Sprawl WAR IGOR!!!11

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    I don't train anymore but I'd definitely look into grip training and the tools they have at ironmind.com.

    Strengthening my grip without any real weight lifting besides just grappling i could really feel the difference in control i had when I'd go for wrist control.
     

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