NBA So LeBron is the second greatest player ever...right?

gspieler said:
I’m not talking spacing or even shot selection. There simply is no big today that has the speed, footwork, and post skills(on both ends of the floor) as prime Hakeem. If it were as simple as “they could do that, but they choose not to because it’s inefficient”, you would still see some bigs pulling off like Dream(or better). But you don’t.
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Sengun is more skilled than Hakeem. Sorry to burst your make believe bubble.
 
Croaker said:
So he could beat a Championship Pistons but couldn't beat a 5 seed in the West?

lmao?
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Th West means good teams in the playoffs, one after another. The West 8th seed might be ranked way higher if they played in the east.
 
Nizam al-Mulk said:
Th West means good teams in the playoffs, one after another. The West 8th seed might be ranked way higher if they played in the east.
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Maybe, but those Pistons were a top team in the NBA and he single handily beat them
 
gspieler said:
I’m not talking spacing or even shot selection. There simply is no big today that has the speed, footwork, and post skills(on both ends of the floor) as prime Hakeem. If it were as simple as “they could do that, but they choose not to because it’s inefficient”, you would still see some bigs pulling off like Dream(or better). But you don’t.
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If Zion Williamson can average 25ppg in today's nba, Hakeem could put the same numbers he did in the 90s, today
 
Lebron choked in the finals once. Jordan literally never choked.

Jordan also had a DPOY - something Lebron never had.
 
Hog-train said:
Lebron choked in the finals once. Jordan literally never choked.

Jordan also had a DPOY - something Lebron never had.
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You're being generous and leaving out quite a few of LeBrick's colossal failures.

My favorite is 2010 against Boston when he mailed it in and blamed it on his team banging his mom.

<JagsKiddingMe>
 
Let's see what AI says:

AI Overview

Hakeem Olajuwon would not just succeed in the modern NBA, but would likely be the most dominant center in the league, functioning as an elite two-way force capable of averaging 26–28 points, 12 rebounds, and 2–3 blocks per game. His unique blend of elite post-skills, agility, and defensive prowess would be even more dangerous in today’s spaced-out floor, making him a perennial MVP and Defensive Player of the Year candidate.

Offensive Impact in the Modern Era
Feasting in Space: With reduced physical play and more spacing, Olajuwon’s "Dream Shake" and post moves would make him virtually impossible to guard one-on-one.

Versatility: While known for his post-game, Olajuwon had a strong mid-range game, leading many to believe he would easily adapt to shooting three-pointers, similar to modern centers like Joel Embiid.

Pick-and-Roll Dominance: His quickness would make him a nightmare in pick-and-roll situations, excelling both as a finisher and a playmaker.

Anchoring the Defense: As one of the greatest shot-blockers in NBA history (3.1 blocks per game over his career), he would easily anchor a modern defense, managing both the paint and switching onto smaller players.

Unmatched Lateral Movement: Experts note that Olajuwon possessed faster feet and better lateral movement than many modern bigs, including Dwight Howard.

Comparison to Modern Stars

The Ultimate Two-Way Player: Unlike modern elite centers who often specialize in either offense (Jokić) or defense (Wemby), Olajuwon offered elite, top-tier performance on both ends of the floor simultaneously.

Skill Set: His ability to handle the ball and move with "balletic grace" would make him arguably the best center in today's game.

In summary, Olajuwon would be a "monster" in today's game, with many analysts agreeing he would comfortably be the best center in the league.
 
TeTe said:
Let's see what AI says:

AI Overview

Hakeem Olajuwon would not just succeed in the modern NBA, but would likely be the most dominant center in the league, functioning as an elite two-way force capable of averaging 26–28 points, 12 rebounds, and 2–3 blocks per game. His unique blend of elite post-skills, agility, and defensive prowess would be even more dangerous in today’s spaced-out floor, making him a perennial MVP and Defensive Player of the Year candidate.

Offensive Impact in the Modern Era
Feasting in Space: With reduced physical play and more spacing, Olajuwon’s "Dream Shake" and post moves would make him virtually impossible to guard one-on-one.

Versatility: While known for his post-game, Olajuwon had a strong mid-range game, leading many to believe he would easily adapt to shooting three-pointers, similar to modern centers like Joel Embiid.

Pick-and-Roll Dominance: His quickness would make him a nightmare in pick-and-roll situations, excelling both as a finisher and a playmaker.

Anchoring the Defense: As one of the greatest shot-blockers in NBA history (3.1 blocks per game over his career), he would easily anchor a modern defense, managing both the paint and switching onto smaller players.

Unmatched Lateral Movement: Experts note that Olajuwon possessed faster feet and better lateral movement than many modern bigs, including Dwight Howard.

Comparison to Modern Stars

The Ultimate Two-Way Player: Unlike modern elite centers who often specialize in either offense (Jokić) or defense (Wemby), Olajuwon offered elite, top-tier performance on both ends of the floor simultaneously.

Skill Set: His ability to handle the ball and move with "balletic grace" would make him arguably the best center in today's game.

In summary, Olajuwon would be a "monster" in today's game, with many analysts agreeing he would comfortably be the best center in the league.
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That's interesting food for thought. As this is all speculation I'm not going to dedicate a lot of calories agreeing or disagreeing. Curious though as to who the "analysts" are that say he would comfortably be the best center in the league. It's probably picking up to some degree horse shit analysts.

So much of NBA fan and pundit analysis is just "feels" and marketing, and Olajuwan was the Jordan off-the-record-suspension fill in. And things like "he'd be a good three point shooter" if he just practiced it more and was above average for the mid range for a center at the time isn't something one hangs their coat on IMO. And making specific mention of Dwight Howard for some reason is interesting. It feels like that was probably scooped from a Reddit post. And Olajuwan was a big guy for the standards then, but not convinced of today where more tall folks the world over give basketball a try as compared to before it's the same degree of asset, and advanced stats while messy to analyze are way less enthusiastic.

All that said, it's impossible to make adjustments in any reliable way for things like advances in nutrition and training and how a player elevates versus peers for it, not to mention what the defensive three second rule does. And finally there is something to be said about a player's peak versus their total duration which becomes a matter of taste as to how much to weigh either.

I think fairest assessment is he was the best in the league for a bit and was a versatile two-way force and if Jordan was around it's hard to say who would have won, but Olajuwan did the job in front of him quite well ( IIRC they swept young Shaq in the finals one year but had quite a few challenging series up til then). The AI summary is likely an amalgamation of anonymous Reddit posters and likely doesn't point to a data driven analysis whatsoever unfortunately. And things like the "the Dream Shake" deemed unstoppable almost always points to excessive lore as opposed to something that would continue to be so in the modern game.
 
Lebron has the longevity of course, which helps his case. And he took the worst team to the finals with that terrible Cavs team.
If I have to win 1 series, there is nobody I'd take over Jordan.

It's so hard to compare players and eras. Kareem is probably a top 3 player of all time. Shaq was probably the most unstoppable offensive force to ever play. The only way to stop him was to foul him. Kobe. Duncan. Bird in his prime. Wilt. Some will say Magic, but his team was stacked!
 
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