Sleep Aids/Dreaming

[eneyman86**]

Hi all, i've searched through a few of the threads in the past about sleep aids and such but wanted to create a new one which combines various supplements and what the benefits are of them all. Anyways, I want to get better, deeper sleep in which I dream more and want to know which supplements I should use. I have heard melatonin, valerian, ZMA, and GABA. What I want is actually a powerful effect that I guess puts me out cold after working out or a hard day but does not leave me messed up in the morning when I wake up. I have tried Tylenol PM these past 2 nights and have had great sleep and a crazy dream where I was killing cylons in battlestar galactica, but I woke up all lethargic and groggy. What are the differences between ZMA and GABA and which is better, also which should I get between melatonin or valerian (or both?) Any tips would be great, thanks all!

 

[ronin0352]

I take GABA & ZMA & so far I'm pretty impressed with the results. My sleep time is limited due to my crazy work schedule, but I seem to get a lot more QUALITY sleep now. I take a scoop (roughly 5 gms) of GABA & the recommended serving of ZMA (3 pills with the brand I have.) I wasn't too impressed with melatonin in the past, and never tried Valerian. Good luck

 

[Vice]

I too have badass dreams when doing any type of drowsy cold medication. And I too generally do not wake up the greatest if not timed properly.

Never tried any real sleep aide...

 

[eneyman86**]

Hey, have you noticed any changes in dreams or having more dreams when in these supplements? Also, is GABA safe and something that I should take if I don't life weights?

 

[Jake Martin]

Sweet, I want to have BSG dreams. Preferably me, number six, and a change in sheets in the morning...

 

[Zero_Sen]

I'm a bona fide insomniac.

I've tried valerian in the past, and I didn't notice any benefit to my sleep. There is a mild relaxation effect, but nothing to write home to the sandman about. Plus valerian smells kind of like stinky feet. Even in caplet form.

With melatonin alone, I've noticed nothing. But when I stack it with other sleep aids, it seems to get the job done. Definitely increases the quality and "depth" of sleep.

I haven't tried GABA yet, but I hear really good things and I'm going to look into it.

I actually haven't heard much about ZMA as a sleep aid per se ... more of a testosterone-boosting supplement that you take before bed. But if anyone has any info, I'd appreciate a link.

 

[Jake Martin]

I haven't tried GABA yet, but I hear really good things and I'm going to look into it.

I actually haven't heard much about ZMA as a sleep aid per se ... more of a testosterone-boosting supplement that you take before bed. But if anyone has any info, I'd appreciate a link.

I've no links, but I'm told the magnesium is what actually causes the muscle relaxation and 'sleepy' effects.

I'm interested in GABA, but for now I'm going to partake in some of this actual 'sleep' stuff we're all so excited for.

 

[MikeMartial]

ZMA + GABA is my gold standard stack.

 

[eneyman86**]

Mike, does the ZMA+GABA relax you a little or put you out cold?

 

[Lubaolong]

ZMA + GABA is my gold standard stack.

I think I'll try some of that. I'm going on 89 hours right now. Crazy, huh?

 

[MikeMartial]

I think I'll try some of that. I'm going on 89 hours right now. Crazy, huh?

That's out of control, shit. Why?!?!

 

[WRoutson]

i took a prescription sleep aid called elefil or elevil or something like that.i had a really hard time falling asleep after some personal shit,and eventually i evened out and was able to fall asleep normally again.didn't have any dependency issues either.

 

[black koala]

Melatonin is the only substance that I take at night to help me sleep. It really puts me in a deep sleep and allows me to have very long dreams. The pills are not expensive at all and you wake up feeling great. Seriosly you have to try them and post about your dreams. The only time I remember having dreams is when i take them.

 

[MikeMartial]

Mike, does the ZMA+GABA relax you a little or put you out cold?

It doesn't "put you out cold"; the Mg in the ZMA is a natural muscle relaxant, and the b6 (theoretically) causes increased serotonin/dopamine release, which enhances dreaming. Neither of these will put you to sleep instantly---they just help the sleep process along.

GABA is an inhibitory neurotransmitter, so it's just potentiating these effects in a similar manner.

My issue is actually falling asleep in the first place; whether it's due to stress or the inability to unwind, I don't know. I'm not keen on working out after 7PM precisely for this fact.

I've tried pretty much EVERY type of sleep aid under the sun, and I also had a small short term prescription for zopiclone (Imovane) at one point; a regular dose of ZMA and 750mg GABA has had the most efficacy with the least amount of side effects, for me.

 

[eneyman86**]

awesome replies you guys, has anybody tried Phenibut? I am reading alot of things about it and people recommend it..

 

[Lubaolong]

That's out of control, shit. Why?!?!

I don't really know. I've had trouble sleeping sometimes for the last couple years now. Friday night, I stayed up talking to someone on MSN until about 11 AM Saturday. Then I couldn't fall asleep, so I just stayed awake with plans of sleeping Saturday night. But for some reason, I was just really wired and couldn't sleep, so I decided to catch up on some stuff for school and my business. Then last night I actually did sleep for about 1.5 hours, but a phone call woke me up. I feel a little jacked up, but I don't feel like I could sleep if I lied down right now. I'm going to take about 8 Benadryl tabs in a bit.

 

[TX911]

i took a prescription sleep aid called elefil or elevil or something like that.i had a really hard time falling asleep after some personal shit,and eventually i evened out and was able to fall asleep normally again.didn't have any dependency issues either.

elavil (amitriptilyne) is a TCA (tricyclic antidepressant.) Sounds more like he was more addressing the issue of the anxiety and emotional effects that were disturbing your sleep cycle rather than just prescribing you a sleep aid like alot of docs do in the form of benzos like temazepam, estazolam, alprazolam, triazolam, etc which can all be habit forming.

 

[Yep.]

I take a 5mg melatonin pill before I go to bed and 30 minutes later I'm sleeping like a fuckin' baby.

 

[ronin0352]

It' doesn't "put you out cold"; the Mg in the ZMA is a natural muscle relaxant, and the b6 (theoretically) causes increased serotonin/dopamine release, which enhances dreaming. Neither of these will put you to sleep instantly---they just help the sleep process along.

GABA is an inhibitory neurotransmitter, so it's just potentiating these effects in a similar manner.

My issue is actually falling asleep in the first place; weather it's due to stress or the inability to unwind, I don't know. I'm not keen on working out after 7PM precisely for this fact.

I've tried pretty much EVERY type of sleep aid under the sun, and I also had a small short term prescription for zopiclone (Imovane) at one point; a regular dose of ZMA and 750mg GABA has had the most efficay with the least amount of side effects, for me.

That small of a dose helps? I read this on the True Protein forum and figured 3-5gm was the recommended dosage.

Med Sci Sports Exerc. 2007 Dec 4 [Epub ahead of print]

Growth Hormone Isoform Responses to GABA Ingestion at Rest and after Exercise.

Powers ME, Yarrow JF, McCoy SC, Borst SE.
1Division of Athletic Training, Shenendoah University, Winchester, VA; 2Department of Applied Physiology and Kinesiology, Center for Exercise Science, University of Florida, Gainesville, FL; and 3Geriatric Research Education and Clinical Center, VA Medical Center, Gainesville, FL.

Oral administration of the amino acid/inhibitory neurotransmitter gamma aminobutyric acid (GABA) reportedly elevates resting serum growth hormone (GH) concentrations. PURPOSE:: To test the hypothesis that GABA ingestion stimulates immunoreactive GH (irGH) and immunofunctional GH (ifGH) release at rest and that GABA augments the resistance exercise-induced irGH/ifGH responses. METHODS:: Eleven resistance-trained men (18-30 yr) participated in this randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled, crossover study. During each experimental bout, participants ingested either 3 g of GABA or sucrose placebo (P), followed either by resting or resistance exercise sessions. Fasting venous blood samples were acquired immediately before and at 15, 30, 45, 60, 75, and 90 min after GABA or P ingestion and were assayed for irGH and ifGH. RESULTS:: At rest, GABA ingestion elevated both irGH and ifGH compared with placebo. Specifically, peak concentrations of both hormones were elevated by about 400%, and the area under the curve (AUC) was elevated by about 375% (P < 0.05). Resistance exercise (EX-P) elevated time-point (15-60 min) irGH and ifGH concentrations compared with rest (P < 0.05). The combination of GABA and resistance exercise (EX-GABA) also elevated the peak, AUC, and the 15- to 60-min time-point irGH and ifGH responses compared with resting conditions (P < 0.05). Additionally, 200% greater irGH (P < 0.01) and 175% greater ifGH (P < 0.05) concentrations were observed in the EX-GABA than in the EX-P condition, 30 min after ingestion. GABA ingestion did not alter the irGH to ifGH ratio, and, under all conditions, ifGH represented approximately 50% of irGH. CONCLUSIONS:: Our data indicate that ingested GABA elevates resting and postexercise irGH and ifGH concentrations. The extent to which irGH/ifGH secretion contributes to skeletal muscle hypertrophy is unknown, although augmenting the postexercise irGH/ifGH response may improve resistance training-induced muscular adaptations.
PMID: 18091016 [PubMed - as supplied by publisher]

Can't post the link as I clicked on it and you have to be registered with them to access.

EDIT: Here's the link to the page I found that on though.
http://serv01.siteground174.com/~trueprot/showthread.php?t=1157

 

[TKMaxx715]

would sleep aids help if im getting enough sleep but am tired all day? Im hoping im just not getting quality sleep or something...

PS: my diet isnt the greatest but its a helluva lot better than most i know as i do cut out a lot