Sambo - past, present and future of MMA?

[KillerIsBack V2]

Sambo doesn't have as many athletes coming into MMA as wrestling and BJJ, but it's been very well represented by Fedor and Khabib.

Not only they had great success in MMA, but they represent their styles so well because I think they really can bring their style over that closely resembles their style of fighting from their own arts whereas most other martial arts requires them to adapt to MMA and likely calls for more adjustments.

Regarding the past, it's incredibly difficult to say Fedor is not the best of his time. He was the fighter of the decade for a reason, going undefeated at heavyweight for 10 years, and for me he's the GOAT period.

In the present, Khabib has a pretty strong argument that he IS the best of his time as well, though if you ask me his competition is bit lacking.

And I feel like, there will be more fighters with sambo backgrounds that will come around and dominate the sport. Islam looks legit at lightweight, Evloev looks great at featherweight, Amosov looks phenomenal at WW, Ankaleev looks great at LHW, and there's Minakov who should still be undefeated after 10+ years at heavyweight barring the complete injustice in his last fight, though I think Minakov fucked himself over with all the inactivities and fighting over contracts I think.

During Fedor's reign, it looked like it felt more like the case of an exceptional fighter. But now, it may just be that Sambo was and is and will be the past, present and future of MMA.

Khamzat in the beginning of his of his mma career KO'd a 3 time world champion in sambo who was already much more experienced in pro mma than him.

Only match that got me on the Khamzat train.

 

[Deleted member 110072]

Technically Sambo isn't even a base. It's another version of different martial arts combined into one

Combat sambo does arguebly have some skills to it that are quite specific though not just taken from other sports, the way it combines striking and grappling especially.

It is itself a rather transitional MA though, someone like Fedor for example was a Judoka for much longer than he was a sambo fighter pre MMA, quite a high level Judoka finishing 3rd in the Russian champs twice(probably good enough to go to the Olympics for less strong judo nations).

I would say that judoka looking to move to MMA should definately consider combat sambo training as it does seem like a much better fit than standard MMA training. Sambo allows for more effective transitions into clinch work and catching opponents off balance which naturally works well with Judo whilst also adding in leg based takedowns.

Look at guys like Akiyama and Ishii and how undramatic their games became, very slow and upright striking that did not link into their judo well at all.

 

[Hotora86]

I also expected modern hybrid martial arts like Sambo and Kudo to prosper in MMA but surprisingly... they don't.

Maybe the Sambo and Kudo guys just focus on Sambo and Kudo and don't want to transition to MMA as much... not sure.

 

[HuskySamoan]

There is a diffirence

Sambo focuses on transitions and seqeuences whereass vanila amateur MMA does not

Both Fedor and Khabib are brutal in transitions whereas most fighters, even legends like Silva, look robotic, they get taken down, pull a textbook BJJ guard and do everything robotically

Sounds like different scoring systems. Also Khabib has a Judo and Wrestling background ontop of Sambo and Fedor was an Olympic level Judoka, his initial background too. That shit helps eh.

 

[D 1 Wrestler]

American wrestling has provided many more champions and top 10 fighters. You listed two guys because there are only two guys to list. Most sambo guys don't make it out of crappy russian regional promotions and they are lucky that the elite russian wrestlers don't care for mma

Khamzat, a wrestler, worked a sambo champ. A good wrestler with solid striking will forever be the best potential

 

[backlight]

American wrestling has provided many more champions and top 10 fighters. You listed two guys because there are only two guys to list. Most sambo guys don't make it out of crappy russian regional promotions and they are lucky that the elite russian wrestlers don't care for mma

Khamzat, a wrestler, worked a sambo champ. A good wrestler with solid striking will forever be the best potential

I agree completely, that's why most mma champs achieved success with their d1 wrestling

Spoiler

 

[D 1 Wrestler]

I agree completely, that's why most mma champs achieved success with their d1 wrestling

Spoiler

Sure they have, do you really want to make a list of american wrestlers who have made top 10 throughout the years and compare it to any other base?

I'm sure you'll respond with something like that's because there are more american wrestlers entering mma therefore it's inevitable. But the reason is because folkstyle wrestling is the best base for MMA.

 

[TJ177]

I think having a grappling background with a focus on takedowns is going to be the best base - tying it to a specific wrestling style feels difficult to me. Historically many of the best grapplers have gravitated to the sports with Olympic medal potential (FS, greco, judo). A reasonable expectation would be that a more sub-specific grappling discipline (guessing something similar to no-gi BJJ) emerges as an Olympic sport in the future and that discipline serves as the dominant pipeline just because of the athletes it winds up pulling into its orbit.

It's tough to pinpoint the exact calculus of it - but the compression of Olympic weights for FS/Greco (along with more opportunity for $ in MMA) has definitely pulled guys out of Olympic cycles way way earlier than in the past.

 

[Kertol]

Combat Sambo Athletes are the future of mma.

 

[D 1 Wrestler]

I think having a grappling background with a focus on takedowns is going to be the best base - tying it to a specific wrestling style feels difficult to me. Historically many of the best grapplers have gravitated to the sports with Olympic medal potential (FS, greco, judo). A reasonable expectation would be that a more sub-specific grappling discipline (guessing something similar to no-gi BJJ) emerges as an Olympic sport in the future and that discipline serves as the dominant pipeline just because of the athletes it winds up pulling into its orbit.

It's tough to pinpoint the exact calculus of it - but the compression of Olympic weights for FS/Greco (along with more opportunity for $ in MMA) has definitely pulled guys out of Olympic cycles way way earlier than in the past.

You don't have to be olympic level tho. An OK college wrestler with competent striking can get you to title contention if they have other intangibles like solid chin and decent cardio

 

[Call-of-Cthulhu]

Sambo = MMA ... before "Gracie Jiu-Jitsu" ... and before the UFC.

Period,

 

[Call-of-Cthulhu]

Wrestling is a joke compared to Sambo.

American television likes to promote wrestling, but any pure Sambo fighter From Russia will beat any pure wrestler from America (barring freak accidents) 100% of the time.

I also believe that, in the future, Khabib (as a coach) will not only "follow" his father's footsteps, but will elevate them ... and be turning out the best new MMA prospects going forward. Those Dagestanis have their craft down to a science.

American wrestling is a sham compared to Dagestani Sambo/judo/wrestling. Just ask Justin Gaethje.

 

[TJ177]

You don't have to be olympic level tho. An OK college wrestler with competent striking can get you to title contention if they have other intangibles like solid chin and decent cardio

Oh for sure - I just meant globally. I definitely don't think that folkstyle is going to supplant other disciplines outside the US, but I often wonder if FS/Greco starts to lose athletes over time in other regions. Not overnight, but over time.

 

[BoTyson]

Sambos great its just a russian exclusive thing, there is people teaching BJJ and wrestling everywhere.

 

[BoTyson]

Wrestling is a joke compared to Sambo.

American television likes to promote wrestling, but any pure Sambo fighter From Russia will beat any pure wrestler from America (barring freak accidents) 100% of the time.

I also believe that, in the future, Khabib (as a coach) will not only "follow" his father's footsteps, but will elevate them ... and be turning out the best new MMA prospects going forward. Those Dagestanis have their craft down to a science.

American wrestling is a sham compared to Dagestani Sambo/judo/wrestling. Just ask Justin Gaethje.

To be honest that was more AKA's way than Khabib being from Russia, they basically combined the relentless assault of DC, CV and put it on a guy that already had top grappling of a different sort.

Any AKA cardio grappler would have put the same beating on any NCAA guy who rarely grapples.

Brock was a much better Wrestler than Cain on paper, but cain kicked his ass, stuffign takedowns and clinching and even taking Brock down.

 

[Call-of-Cthulhu]

Nah ... Khabib and his father have developed their own specialization.

 

[kflo]

Neither fedor or khabib were sambo specialists. They brought their specialties to combat sambo. Fedor without judo and khabib without wrestling are not dominant mma champions.

 

[kflo]

Wrestling is a joke compared to Sambo.

American television likes to promote wrestling, but any pure Sambo fighter From Russia will beat any pure wrestler from America (barring freak accidents) 100% of the time.

I also believe that, in the future, Khabib (as a coach) will not only "follow" his father's footsteps, but will elevate them ... and be turning out the best new MMA prospects going forward. Those Dagestanis have their craft down to a science.

American wrestling is a sham compared to Dagestani Sambo/judo/wrestling. Just ask Justin Gaethje.

That’s a stupid analogy. Wrestling is a specialty sport in and of itself. It’s not meant to compete AGAINST sambo.

 

[Call-of-Cthulhu]

Neither fedor or khabib were sambo specialists. They brought their specialties to combat sambo. Fedor without judo and khabib without wrestling are not dominant mma champions.

You're an idiot. Khabib is a Sambo gold medalist.

 

[Call-of-Cthulhu]

That’s a stupid analogy. Wrestling is a specialty sport in and of itself. It’s not meant to compete AGAINST sambo.

You're a double idiot. The debate is what's best for MMA.

Sambo is clearly best for MMA; wrestling doesn't even have finishing holds.

Please sit down and shut up.

Thanks.