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Even so, its the ammount of corruption in the Russian MOD is super fucking disgusting. i mean then again every general needs a samurai house,
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International Russia/Ukraine Megathread V7
- Thread starter Strychnine
- Start date
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Even so, its the ammount of corruption in the Russian MOD is super fucking disgusting. i mean then again every general needs a samurai house,
T-80 and it's versions or T-64?
Beauty...
I once had asked guy who had served in East Germany....
Were you able to dirve tank if driver had been ( theoretically ) injured...
He answered: if they had to hit tank normally....good if our mates had collected something to put in coffin...
While in some cases: tank appreared to be able to bear hit with tandem cummulative charge and crew was in good shape.
One idiot had launched on them combat charge.
It was T-80 & with reactive armour...
It depends...
Beauty...
I once had asked guy who had served in East Germany....
Were you able to dirve tank if driver had been ( theoretically ) injured...
He answered: if they had to hit tank normally....good if our mates had collected something to put in coffin...
While in some cases: tank appreared to be able to bear hit with tandem cummulative charge and crew was in good shape.
One idiot had launched on them combat charge.
It was T-80 & with reactive armour...
It depends...
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These are the same trolls that pushed "Zelensky 3% approval rating" and "Ukrainian troops will just lay down their arms before shootin' a bro", "Kharkiv 90% russian speaking, liberators gon walk right in" before the war.
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"By MARIA GRAZIA MURRU and OLEKSANDR STASHEVSKYI
KYIV, Ukraine (AP) — Foreign analysts say Russia may be temporarily easing its offensive in eastern Ukraine as the Russian military attempts to reassemble its forces for a significant — and what it hopes could prove decisive — new assault on its neighbor. Russian President Vladimir Putin warned menacingly on Thursday that his forces “haven’t even started” to fight.
Russian forces made no claimed or assessed territorial gains in Ukraine on Wednesday “for the first time in 133 days of war,” according to the Institute for the Study of War. The Washington-based think tank suggested Moscow may be taking an “operational pause,” but said that does not entail “the complete cessation of active hostilities.”
“Russian forces will likely confine themselves to relatively small-scale offensive actions as they attempt to set conditions for more significant offensive operations” and rebuild the necessary combat power, the institute said.
“The units that performed combat missions … are taking measures to recover their combat capabilities. The servicemen are given the opportunity to rest, receive letters and parcels from home,” read the statement, quoted by Russian state news agency Tass.
Putin warned Kyiv it should quickly accept Moscow’s terms to end the fighting or brace for the worst.
“Everybody should know that largely speaking, we haven’t even yet started anything in earnest,” he said in a menacing note.
Shelling continued in Ukraine’s east, where at least nine civilians were killed and six wounded in the past 24 hours, Ukrainian officials said early Thursday.
https://www.mercurynews.com/2022/07/07/russia-taking-operational-pause-in-ukraine-analysts-say/
KYIV, Ukraine (AP) — Foreign analysts say Russia may be temporarily easing its offensive in eastern Ukraine as the Russian military attempts to reassemble its forces for a significant — and what it hopes could prove decisive — new assault on its neighbor. Russian President Vladimir Putin warned menacingly on Thursday that his forces “haven’t even started” to fight.
Russian forces made no claimed or assessed territorial gains in Ukraine on Wednesday “for the first time in 133 days of war,” according to the Institute for the Study of War. The Washington-based think tank suggested Moscow may be taking an “operational pause,” but said that does not entail “the complete cessation of active hostilities.”
“Russian forces will likely confine themselves to relatively small-scale offensive actions as they attempt to set conditions for more significant offensive operations” and rebuild the necessary combat power, the institute said.
“The units that performed combat missions … are taking measures to recover their combat capabilities. The servicemen are given the opportunity to rest, receive letters and parcels from home,” read the statement, quoted by Russian state news agency Tass.
Putin warned Kyiv it should quickly accept Moscow’s terms to end the fighting or brace for the worst.
“Everybody should know that largely speaking, we haven’t even yet started anything in earnest,” he said in a menacing note.
Shelling continued in Ukraine’s east, where at least nine civilians were killed and six wounded in the past 24 hours, Ukrainian officials said early Thursday.
https://www.mercurynews.com/2022/07/07/russia-taking-operational-pause-in-ukraine-analysts-say/
Good armour for glacis + front of turret...
Good steell and combo armour + for these times really good active armour.
Good ballistic calc and fast autoloader.
While autoloader more vulnerable than in T-72 or T-90...
Cost for speed...
From sides might be had ....damaged with 30 mm autocannon.
From front in glacis and turret's front?
105 mm NATO round in 90%+ cases was...useless...
Vunlreable stuff they too did had.
+ small size lads were often picked for tank units for a reason....
Iraq had in best case T-72 aka in 1973-1975 souce + munition too....
It wasn't the same.
T-80 in some cases was capable to bear hit with anti tank stuff capable to penterate 850 mm RHA after ERA...
On some cases...some devices will not work after hits with 12,7 mm bullets. Optics, openings for laser probe etc...
On some cases...some devices will not work after hits with 12,7 mm bullets. Optics, openings for laser probe etc...
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King Ting was actually shit. It looked cool, but most late war German tanks were impressive on paper but under performed in reality. Logistics alone it was a huge waste. It was too fucking big and standard roads and bridges at the time in most of Europe couldn't support it. It also used way too much fuel which they were already basically out of by the time they started rolling out. It was actually part of the operational plan for the Battle of the Bulge to rely on captured allied fuel to support their advance because they didn't have enough to fuel their big dumb tanks and many were abandoned before even getting to the frontline.
Germany's best tank was the Pz. IV and the variants. I think their best performers overall in terms of KDR for Germany wasn't even their tanks, but their propelled guns. The Hetzer based off captured Czech Pz 38(t) and StuG III based off the Pz. III chasis. Also the Marder II based off the Pz. II and Marder III based off the Pz 38(t) as well.
Last edited:
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Lol & this copy paste.
Jesus Christ
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Lol what? I actually know this stuff.
Only thing I had to look up whether it was Pzt 38 or Pz 38(t)
Not everyone has a surface level pop culture knowledge of history.
Surface level in ballistics is different thing ofc...
Tiger II latest versions had top notch 88 mm cannons ever made...
While due to problems with metallrugy in end of war and...nice old stuff gasoline engines they were heavy and slow......not agile.
( still had for these times normal optics )...
1943 end and till 1945 th...
Tiger II latest versions had top notch 88 mm cannons ever made...
While due to problems with metallrugy in end of war and...nice old stuff gasoline engines they were heavy and slow......not agile.
( still had for these times normal optics )...
1943 end and till 1945 th...
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Caught a fox you did...
12ga.
Gold Belt
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Col. Dan Davis has produced some of the clearest views of the Ukraine War since its start. Here he discusses something many have long known: most generals are clueless fools.
-------------------
U.S. Generals Have Been Wrong on Ukraine. We Shouldn’t Be Shocked
https://www.19fortyfive.com/2022/07/u-s-generals-have-been-wrong-on-ukraine-we-shouldnt-be-shocked/
By
Daniel Davis
Published
5 days ago
Russian tank firing. Image Credit: Creative Commons.
Frederick B. Hodges, former commanding general of U.S. Army-Europe, claimed last month that Ukraine’s forces would soon slow Russia’s advance and, the New York Times reported, begin “to roll back its gains by late summer.” Hodges said his confidence was based on his belief that “the Ukrainian logistical situation getting better each week while the Russian logistical situation will slowly degrade.”
Such claims, however, are in contradiction to observable reality on the battlefield – and continue a disturbing, decades-long trend of poor and misleading advice given by America’s top military officers.
Listening over the past four months to what America’s retired generals and admirals have said on TV, one would be forgiven for believing that Ukraine is winning its war with Russia, that Putin’s troops and leaders are incompetent, and that soon Ukrainian troops will begin rolling the Russians back.
Such belief, however, would be badly misplaced, as substantial evidence indicates virtually the opposite.
A Rosy Look at the Brutal Battle in Ukraine
Rosy, optimistic – and inaccurate – assessments from U.S. flag officers have unfortunately become the norm over the past few decades. While some current and former generals give excellent and accurate assessments, there are far too many that don’t. The consequence to American policy has often been severe. It is time to reassess how much credibility we should place with American generals and admirals.
As I have chronicled on these pages, the conditions and military fundamentals clearly evident for years have strongly suggested that Ukraine could not win a war with Russia, and that both Kyiv and Washington should have made different policy choices based on that reality, both before and since Russia’s illegal invasion. But as graphically detailed below, active and retired flag officers have continually claimed that – ignoring clear evidence to the contrary – Ukraine has a chance to win the war.
Encouraging Ukraine to Keep Up the Fight
Such unwarranted assertions have led policymakers and the American public to believe, improperly, that we should continue encouraging Ukraine to maintain its fight against Russia. American official policy has been to provide Kyiv with substantial armaments to defend itself and overwhelming emotional support.
If the generals were right, if Ukraine were indeed close to winning the war, and if the aid we have offered could tip the scales in Kyiv’s favor, then our policy might make sense. But it doesn’t. Ukraine isn’t winning the war and isn’t even close to parity, much less superiority, to Russian forces.
In my most recent piece at 19FortyFive, I detail many of the practical, military reasons Ukraine is losing the war and is likely to continue losing. In my assessment, if Kyiv continues refusing to seek a negotiated settlement with Russia – something that is understandably repugnant to many Ukrainian citizens and government – they are in danger not merely of sliding into a long-term stalemate, but of outright losing the war.
I do not hesitate to admit that I can’t guarantee an outcome in this war. There are too many variables and information I don’t have, and do not have access to the secret council of either the Russian or Ukrainian general staff, or that of the western NATO leaders. A number of things could change the dynamics and trajectory of the war, which are not publicly known. Of course events that have yet to happen could result in major course changes.
But as I have laid out in detail, the current trends and military fundamentals reveal Ukraine is unquestionably losing this war. For the conditions to change dramatically enough to make an eventual Ukrainian military victory possible, as many generals continue to claim, would require a radical shift from today’s realities. Beyond mere rhetoric, there is no evidence such a radical shift is forthcoming. It is therefore irresponsible, I argue, to tell the American people that the desired outcome is possible when all evidence screams that it’s not – and downright cruel to the Ukrainian Armed Forces and civilian population, to foster a belief that they have a chance.
Should Washington Change Course?
To have the best chance to protect America’s vital national interests and save as many Ukrainian people as possible from being killed, Washington must change course and begin to form policy based on a frank and honest assessment of the combat, economic, and diplomatic realities of this war. It will be hard to get to that rational place, however, unless we first recognize the consistently rosy pictures painted by America’s flag officers over the past few decades have been atrocious.
My 21 years of active service in the U.S. Army, including four combat deployments, has put me in a position to personally observe many of the mistakes and bad judgments of both active and retired generals. The cumulative result of their frequently flawed advice has been uniformly bad for our country, resulting in some of the worst military and foreign policy decisions our country has made.
Whether it was routine claims, made over a 20-year period, of success in the Afghan War when events conclusively proved it was always a disastrous failure, or perpetual claims of success during and after the 2003 Iraq war – before the Iraqi Security Forces the U.S. trained melted away at the first contact with the Islamic State – senior American military leaders have consistently misled the American public on the true state of affairs.
Since virtually the beginning of the Ukraine-Russian war, American active and retired generals have consistently claimed that Russian troops were incompetent, that their troops were ill-disciplined, arrogant, unmotivated, and sometimes rebelled against their leaders and refused to fight. The Russians, many generals claimed, could not win, with Gen. Hodges claiming that Ukraine would begin rolling back Putin’s troops before the end of this summer.
Yet Russia controls more than 20 percent of Ukrainian territory and continues conquering urban center after urban center in the Donbas, killing upwards of 200 troops per day, wounding another 500 in the process.
Russia outguns Ukraine 20-1 in howitzers, 40-1 in artillery shells and Rockets, and has a significant advantage in air power. There is no rational basis upon which to claim that Ukraine can stop the Russians, much less roll them back.
Joined @JesseBWatters last night on @FoxNews‘ @jesseprimetime exposing reality of Ru/UKR war: there is no viable military path thru which Kyiv can win. It’s time to elevate diplomacy & negotiate war’s end before yet more territory is lost. @defpriorities https://t.co/j3arfmE3Yv
— Daniel L. Davis (@DanielLDavis1) June 23, 2022
It is appropriate, in light of the awful record active and retired general officers have amassed over the past few decades, that both the media and public should give more scrutiny to future claims made by generals. It is understandable why many would give blanket trust to the word of a senior commander: they typically have 30-plus years of experience and have served at the highest levels. But evidence confirms that this trust has been misplaced and it is up to the generals to earn that trust back. Telling the truth and giving honest assessments would be a good place to start.
Now a 1945 Contributing Editor, Daniel L. Davis is a Senior Fellow for Defense Priorities and a former Lt. Col. in the U.S. Army who deployed into combat zones four times. He is the author of “The Eleventh Hour in 2020 America.” Follow him @DanielLDavis.
-------------------
U.S. Generals Have Been Wrong on Ukraine. We Shouldn’t Be Shocked
https://www.19fortyfive.com/2022/07/u-s-generals-have-been-wrong-on-ukraine-we-shouldnt-be-shocked/
By
Daniel Davis
Published
5 days ago
Russian tank firing. Image Credit: Creative Commons.
Frederick B. Hodges, former commanding general of U.S. Army-Europe, claimed last month that Ukraine’s forces would soon slow Russia’s advance and, the New York Times reported, begin “to roll back its gains by late summer.” Hodges said his confidence was based on his belief that “the Ukrainian logistical situation getting better each week while the Russian logistical situation will slowly degrade.”
Such claims, however, are in contradiction to observable reality on the battlefield – and continue a disturbing, decades-long trend of poor and misleading advice given by America’s top military officers.
Listening over the past four months to what America’s retired generals and admirals have said on TV, one would be forgiven for believing that Ukraine is winning its war with Russia, that Putin’s troops and leaders are incompetent, and that soon Ukrainian troops will begin rolling the Russians back.
Such belief, however, would be badly misplaced, as substantial evidence indicates virtually the opposite.
A Rosy Look at the Brutal Battle in Ukraine
Rosy, optimistic – and inaccurate – assessments from U.S. flag officers have unfortunately become the norm over the past few decades. While some current and former generals give excellent and accurate assessments, there are far too many that don’t. The consequence to American policy has often been severe. It is time to reassess how much credibility we should place with American generals and admirals.
As I have chronicled on these pages, the conditions and military fundamentals clearly evident for years have strongly suggested that Ukraine could not win a war with Russia, and that both Kyiv and Washington should have made different policy choices based on that reality, both before and since Russia’s illegal invasion. But as graphically detailed below, active and retired flag officers have continually claimed that – ignoring clear evidence to the contrary – Ukraine has a chance to win the war.
Encouraging Ukraine to Keep Up the Fight
Such unwarranted assertions have led policymakers and the American public to believe, improperly, that we should continue encouraging Ukraine to maintain its fight against Russia. American official policy has been to provide Kyiv with substantial armaments to defend itself and overwhelming emotional support.
If the generals were right, if Ukraine were indeed close to winning the war, and if the aid we have offered could tip the scales in Kyiv’s favor, then our policy might make sense. But it doesn’t. Ukraine isn’t winning the war and isn’t even close to parity, much less superiority, to Russian forces.
In my most recent piece at 19FortyFive, I detail many of the practical, military reasons Ukraine is losing the war and is likely to continue losing. In my assessment, if Kyiv continues refusing to seek a negotiated settlement with Russia – something that is understandably repugnant to many Ukrainian citizens and government – they are in danger not merely of sliding into a long-term stalemate, but of outright losing the war.
I do not hesitate to admit that I can’t guarantee an outcome in this war. There are too many variables and information I don’t have, and do not have access to the secret council of either the Russian or Ukrainian general staff, or that of the western NATO leaders. A number of things could change the dynamics and trajectory of the war, which are not publicly known. Of course events that have yet to happen could result in major course changes.
But as I have laid out in detail, the current trends and military fundamentals reveal Ukraine is unquestionably losing this war. For the conditions to change dramatically enough to make an eventual Ukrainian military victory possible, as many generals continue to claim, would require a radical shift from today’s realities. Beyond mere rhetoric, there is no evidence such a radical shift is forthcoming. It is therefore irresponsible, I argue, to tell the American people that the desired outcome is possible when all evidence screams that it’s not – and downright cruel to the Ukrainian Armed Forces and civilian population, to foster a belief that they have a chance.
Should Washington Change Course?
To have the best chance to protect America’s vital national interests and save as many Ukrainian people as possible from being killed, Washington must change course and begin to form policy based on a frank and honest assessment of the combat, economic, and diplomatic realities of this war. It will be hard to get to that rational place, however, unless we first recognize the consistently rosy pictures painted by America’s flag officers over the past few decades have been atrocious.
My 21 years of active service in the U.S. Army, including four combat deployments, has put me in a position to personally observe many of the mistakes and bad judgments of both active and retired generals. The cumulative result of their frequently flawed advice has been uniformly bad for our country, resulting in some of the worst military and foreign policy decisions our country has made.
Whether it was routine claims, made over a 20-year period, of success in the Afghan War when events conclusively proved it was always a disastrous failure, or perpetual claims of success during and after the 2003 Iraq war – before the Iraqi Security Forces the U.S. trained melted away at the first contact with the Islamic State – senior American military leaders have consistently misled the American public on the true state of affairs.
Since virtually the beginning of the Ukraine-Russian war, American active and retired generals have consistently claimed that Russian troops were incompetent, that their troops were ill-disciplined, arrogant, unmotivated, and sometimes rebelled against their leaders and refused to fight. The Russians, many generals claimed, could not win, with Gen. Hodges claiming that Ukraine would begin rolling back Putin’s troops before the end of this summer.
Yet Russia controls more than 20 percent of Ukrainian territory and continues conquering urban center after urban center in the Donbas, killing upwards of 200 troops per day, wounding another 500 in the process.
Russia outguns Ukraine 20-1 in howitzers, 40-1 in artillery shells and Rockets, and has a significant advantage in air power. There is no rational basis upon which to claim that Ukraine can stop the Russians, much less roll them back.
Joined @JesseBWatters last night on @FoxNews‘ @jesseprimetime exposing reality of Ru/UKR war: there is no viable military path thru which Kyiv can win. It’s time to elevate diplomacy & negotiate war’s end before yet more territory is lost. @defpriorities https://t.co/j3arfmE3Yv
— Daniel L. Davis (@DanielLDavis1) June 23, 2022
It is appropriate, in light of the awful record active and retired general officers have amassed over the past few decades, that both the media and public should give more scrutiny to future claims made by generals. It is understandable why many would give blanket trust to the word of a senior commander: they typically have 30-plus years of experience and have served at the highest levels. But evidence confirms that this trust has been misplaced and it is up to the generals to earn that trust back. Telling the truth and giving honest assessments would be a good place to start.
Now a 1945 Contributing Editor, Daniel L. Davis is a Senior Fellow for Defense Priorities and a former Lt. Col. in the U.S. Army who deployed into combat zones four times. He is the author of “The Eleventh Hour in 2020 America.” Follow him @DanielLDavis.
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Saw a good report on how Russia using foreign media to spread continuous and questionable claims about how well they are doing on the war. Funny how we cannot get to Russia any information about Ukraine successes and the brutality of Russian fighting units. I do not know why we continue to provide a free platform for them to confuse the public while they keep a locked box in Russia.
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It’s just that one weirdo who does this shit in every thread. I don’t understand how he hasn’t been banned yet
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So whath thing slave in his soul and mind 12ga might adivese for americans if Russia will invade U.S and actually why not?
In order to avoid possible WW3 U.S just should agree to be Ukraine No2.
Why not if there aren't balls even in mind.
U.S just will be only colony for China or Russia if they will have pussy attitude and be clowns like Trump doll clown or ....Stoltenberg...
While Reagan with threats alone most likely already had put in coffin Putin and Patrushev....with his yelling alone.
Pussies living in cocky comfort still doesn't have brains to get reality: Russia is like HS bully....
He will push you in 1 st day and if you will be like modern pussy and will not at least push him back...
Next day he will push you twice and punch you.
Till, yeah, later you maybe will be even in intensive care unit...
Dreamers.
U.S now is looked up as pussy and living in fears WEAK country with money hungry nice talking guys....
Calm down.
If U.S can't act like Reagan did, maybe is even time to be incorporated in Russia or China.
Painful reality....
Open silos, prepare to act.
Sent subs in sea and have alret in highest level + only after this any talk with Kremlin....
Otherwise...
U.S is weak and soft today...
Obama was 10X better than Biden....
Trump; Russia's doll.
In order to avoid possible WW3 U.S just should agree to be Ukraine No2.
Why not if there aren't balls even in mind.
U.S just will be only colony for China or Russia if they will have pussy attitude and be clowns like Trump doll clown or ....Stoltenberg...
While Reagan with threats alone most likely already had put in coffin Putin and Patrushev....with his yelling alone.
Pussies living in cocky comfort still doesn't have brains to get reality: Russia is like HS bully....
He will push you in 1 st day and if you will be like modern pussy and will not at least push him back...
Next day he will push you twice and punch you.
Till, yeah, later you maybe will be even in intensive care unit...
Dreamers.
U.S now is looked up as pussy and living in fears WEAK country with money hungry nice talking guys....
Calm down.
If U.S can't act like Reagan did, maybe is even time to be incorporated in Russia or China.
Painful reality....
Open silos, prepare to act.
Sent subs in sea and have alret in highest level + only after this any talk with Kremlin....
Otherwise...
U.S is weak and soft today...
Obama was 10X better than Biden....
Trump; Russia's doll.
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