Pepper spray, OC spray, capsicum spray, mace etc.

[Adamant]

I carried a can of pepper spray for a while, until it expired. Never had to use it. Never bought another one because the expiration date seems to come and go super quick. I think it's like 2 years. But from what I've heard you always want to choose pepper spray over mace. It's more effective and works better. I guess there's some people out there who are totally impervious to mace.

 

[Safton]

I carried a can of pepper spray for a while, until it expired. Never had to use it. Never bought another one because the expiration date seems to come and go super quick. I think it's like 2 years. But from what I've heard you always want to choose pepper spray over mace. It's more effective and works better. I guess there's some people out there who are totally impervious to mace.

When it comes to expiration dates, most reputable brands last a good bit longer than two years these days. The little canister of POM that I carry on my own time I bought back in January of 2024 and has a listed expiration date of December 2027. I don't know when it was manufactured, but I assume it was probably not too long after I bought it... so about four years of shelf life. The can of Sabre Red I'm issued for work helpfully shows the manufacturing and expiration date on the bottom of the label -- it's good for five years.

As for the Mace vs. Pepper Spray thing... this is one of those things that's impossible to explain without sounds like an absolute pedant, but here goes. Basically:

Pepper Spray's "technical" abbreviation is OC.

Conversely, Mace is actually CS, aka tear gas. Yes, Mace is just a liquid/aerosol stream version of what's usually dispersed in the grenades used by SWAT teams and riot police. Also worth noting that Mace is the name of a company who manufactures these types of products and -- counterintuitively -- some of their sprays are actually just OC. Not to mention the fact that "mace" has become a generic term for any kind of defensive spray in the public lexicon... so no hard-and-fast rules.

Both OC and CS are severe irritants when introduced to the eyes and/or the sensitive skin of the face, mucous membranes, etc. They have broadly similar effects, with some minor exceptions. CS is more likely to induce nausea/vomiting than OC, for instance. However, OC is generally recommended over pure CS because it has some useful involuntary physiological effects, most notably forcing the target's eyes to shut for potentially minutes at a time. CS's effects are theoretically easier to "tough out" across the spectrum and some people build up a tolerance to them or start off with an exceptional level of resistance.

Most people who have experienced both say OC is more painful than CS, but opinions vary. Some say it's different types of pain. Some say CS is worse. I personally haven't experienced CS yet, so I can't comment. It's worth noting that there are blended formulations of chemical spray that combine OC and CS into one package and they are renowned as basically hellfire in bottled form because they essentially check all the boxes.

 

[jesusisangry]

 

[TRYHARD 2001]

I've been in the military for a long time now, and every couple years we have to do CBRN training; this means gas hut and CS gas exposure. That stuff absolutely sucks, but the level of suck varies wildly based on the concentration the staff chooses to use in the hut (they come in these little tablets they throw on a burner and it's up to them how many they use). I've never seen anyone this didn't affect, but it is unquestionably worse for some than others and again how concentrated the environment is.

My guess is that a liquid CS spray would be pretty damn incapacitating, although I don't know what the concentrations look like in the States; we don't have this stuff up North for civilian use.

 

[Adamant]

When it comes to expiration dates, most reputable brands last a good bit longer than two years these days. The little canister of POM that I carry on my own time I bought back in January of 2024 and has a listed expiration date of December 2027. I don't know when it was manufactured, but I assume it was probably not too long after I bought it... so about four years of shelf life. The can of Sabre Red I'm issued for work helpfully shows the manufacturing and expiration date on the bottom of the label -- it's good for five years.

As for the Mace vs. Pepper Spray thing... this is one of those things that's impossible to explain without sounds like an absolute pedant, but here goes. Basically:

Pepper Spray's "technical" abbreviation is OC.

Conversely, Mace is actually CS, aka tear gas. Yes, Mace is just a liquid stream version of what's usually an aerosol in grenades used by SWAT teams and riot police. Also worth noting that Mace is the name of a company who manufactures these types of products these days and some of their sprays are actually just OC, not to mention "mace" became a genericized term for any kind of defensive spray... so no hard-and-fast rules.

Both OC and CS are irritants when introduced to eyes and the sensitive skin of the face, mucous membranes, etc. They had broadly similar effects, with some minor exceptions. CS is more likely to induce nausea/vomiting than OC, for instance. However, OC is generally recommended over pure CS because it has some useful involuntary physiological effects, most notably causing the target's eyes to shut for potentially minutes at a time. CS's effects are theoretically easier to "tough out" across the spectrum and some people build up a tolerance to them or start off with an exceptional level of resistance.

Most people who have experienced both say OC is worse than CS, but opinions vary. Some say it's different types of pain. Some say CS is worse. I personally haven't experienced CS yet, so I can't comment. It's worth noting that there are blended formulations of chemical spray that combine OC and CS into one package and they are renowned as basically hellfire in bottled form because it basically checks all the boxes.

Thanks for the writeup. I was about to ask why they don't mix OC and CS. Since they do, is it something the public can buy? I asked a cop once what he carried and he said pepper spray. He said mace was oldschool (my point being it was "OC" spray, not the OC/CS spray you mentioned).

The one I had was the gel version of Sabre Red Pepper Spray. Maybe the expiration date was 3 years (I thought it was 2) but the time seemed to come and go pretty quick and I never had to even think about using it once.

If I can get a can of the OC/CS spray I'll probably do that just to say I did.

 

[Adamant]

I've been in the military for a long time now, and every couple years we have to do CBRN training; this means gas hut and CS gas exposure. That stuff absolutely sucks, but the level of suck varies wildly based on the concentration the staff chooses to use in the hut (they come in these little tablets they throw on a burner and it's up to them how many they use). I've never seen anyone this didn't affect, but it is unquestionably worse for some than others and again how concentrated the environment is.

My guess is that a liquid CS spray would be pretty damn incapacitating, although I don't know what the concentrations look like in the States; we don't have this stuff up North for civilian use.

Do the instructors ever choose to not go full strength in the hut?

 

[Safton]

Thanks for the writeup. I was about to ask why they don't mix OC and CS. Since they do, is it something the public can buy? I asked a cop once what he carried and he said pepper spray. He said mace was oldschool (my point being it was "OC" spray, not the OC/CS spray you mentioned).

The one I had was the gel version of Sabre Red Pepper Spray. Maybe the expiration date was 3 years (I thought it was 2) but the time seemed to come and go pretty quick and I never had to even think about using it once.

If I can get a can of the OC/CS spray I'll probably do that just to say I did.

Yeah you can get your hands on it. They actually sell it on Amazon. For starters I would look at a brand called "Freeze +P". They aren't the household name that Sabre or Fox Labs is, but they are well-established within law enforcement and especially correctional circles for making some of the nastiest blended OC/CS formulations around.

You can also find them online from other brands like Sabre, Defense Technology, Redd, etc. I would stick toward the former two or the aforementioned Freeze, or at least try to find a spray with a minimum OC/MC of 1%. Forgot to mention this earlier, but also bear in mind that OC/CS formulations are a bitch to decontaminate. They take longer and are more difficult after exposure to properly clean off of yourself or whatever you sprayed (purposefully or otherwise).

 

[TRYHARD 2001]

Do the instructors ever choose to not go full strength in the hut?

Again, full strength varies based on the staff running the serial, so full strength to some is a pansy standard to others. When you get a right psychopath running the hut it gets extremely nasty. Like, we're talking when you come out of the hut and start taking off your gear it feels like you're covered in fire ants. If you don't get your mask on quickly enough your eyes don't just leak tears, they actually start swelling up like you got socked in the mouth. People vomiting outside the hut on the regular; I remember one unfortunate young man puking in his gas mask!

And woe be unto them who rub their eyes even a little before decontaminating!

 

[Adamant]

Again, full strength varies based on the staff running the serial, so full strength to some is a pansy standard to others. When you get a right psychopath running the hut it gets extremely nasty. Like, we're talking when you come out of the hut and start taking off your gear it feels like you're covered in fire ants. If you don't get your mask on quickly enough your eyes don't just leak tears, they actually start swelling up like you got socked in the mouth. People vomiting outside the hut on the regular; I remember one unfortunate young man puking in his gas mask!

And woe be unto them who rub their eyes even a little before decontaminating!

But what I mean is I feel like this is something that would be a game for the staff. Trying to outdo each other and see who can make the students suffer worse. "How much did so-and-so use? Ok, let's do more." ..... "What's the record? Let's double it!" It seems like it would be massively underwhelming to just be like "let's go easy today."


I would love to see the staff's reaction if ever the day came where they opened the door and the last guy out was like:

Yeah you can get your hands on it. They actually sell it on Amazon. For starters I would look at a brand called "Freeze +P". They aren't the household name that Sabre or Fox Labs is, but they are well-established within law enforcement and especially correctional circles for making some of the nastiest blended OC/CS formulations around.

You can also find them online from other brands like Sabre, Defense Technology, Redd, etc. I would stick toward the former two or the aforementioned Freeze, or at least try to find a spray with at least 1% OC.

Thanks. I think I'll go ahead and pick up a can. I just looked into all of them and it seems like Fox One Point Four is the best. At least it seemed like people were freaking out more with that one than the others, and it came on within a couple of seconds while others took a few extra seconds (also 5.3 million SHU vs 2 million SHU of Sabre Red Pepper Gel - and one guy was complaining about it burning the shit out of his skin). The only other one that seems to come close is the DPS Black Label. Do you have any thoughts on that one?

(This isn't even the "One Point Four" version, this is their less hot version)
- Skip to 4:45

 

[Safton]

I would love to see the staff's reaction if ever the day came where they opened the door and the last guy out was like:

This happens.

My best friend, may he rest in peace, had a guy in his OSUT cycle who was good-natured albeit... not intelligent. The cadre quickly took to calling him "Forrest Gump" and the name stuck because the guy's mannerisms and behavior were just on-point. Immediately following the gas chamber exposure, all of the students were suffering. Tears, snot, vomiting, the whole nine yards... all of them except Forrest. Guy was standing there, stoic, unfazed, maybe even a bit bemused by the scene before him.

One of the cadre approached Forrest and demanded to know why he wasn't crying like the rest of his classmates.

Gump gave the instructor a perplexed look and calmly said, "I didn't know I was allowed to, Drill Sergeant."

The instructor didn't have an answer for that. He just sorta shook his head and walked away.

Thanks. I think I'll go ahead and pick up a can. I just looked into all of them and it seems like Fox One Point Four is the best. At least it seemed like people were freaking out more with that one than the others, and it came on within a couple of seconds while others took a few extra seconds (also 5.3 million SHU vs 2 million SHU of Sabre Red Pepper Gel - and one guy was complaining about it burning the shit out of his skin). The only other one that seems to come close is the DPS Black Label. Do you have any thoughts on that one?

(This isn't even the "One Point Four" version, this is their less hot version)
- Skip to 4:45

The Fox doesn't have any CS in it if that's specifically what you're looking for.

However, in the realm of "pure" OC sprays then it's hard to go wrong with Fox. It is probably one of the most famous names in the business alongside Sabre and has a reputation for being the hottest out there. Supposedly it's because of one of the oils or solvents that they use in their mix, which allows the spray to rapidly absorb through the skin's fatty lipid layer far more readily than most sprays. This in turn makes for a far faster and more intense burning sensation... but a lot of this is anecdotal and some out there say it's hot, but a tad overrated. I've never been sprayed with it so can't say either way.

Worth noting that there isn't a ton of hard science behind an objective numerical method to rate the efficacy of OC spray. No one really agrees on the best way to do it. Some swear by the major capsaiscinoid (MC) number, some swear by SHU, etc.

SHU makes for good marketing because it lets companies like Fox print big numbers on their product (5.3 MILLION, etc.) to appeal to the masses, but again SHU is a bit... I won't say it's pseudoscience by any means, but at the end of the day it's the same way they rate hot sauce lol. It's a bit subjective and vague.

But I digress. Fox is good stuff and you can't go wrong with it. I would recommend a Stream, as a general rule, over a Gel/Foam or Cone/Fogger unless your use case is fairly specific.

 

[SandisLL]

I searched for a thread on this topic, last one I found was from 2009 so I decided to start a new one.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pepper_spray

I've started carrying Pepper spray last year and I do feel safer having it with me. Luckily I haven't had to really spray anyone but I did use it once to persuade a dog owner to recall his large dog when it ran toward my kid with possible bad intentions (it had no leash or muzzle). I aimed at the dog, not the owner.

I looked into legality (see wiki above) and was surprised to find that my country (Poland) had the most liberal approach to Pepper spray in the world! Sprays are not considered a weapon here and they can be carried by anyone without registration or permission.

The European Union does not regulate Pepper spray, leaving member countries free to regulate it themselves. Pepper sprays are illegal for civilians in: Belgium, Greece, Iceland, Ireland, Netherlands, Norway. Pepper spray requires a license in Finland and many other non-EU countries.

In the United Kingdom Pepper spray is illegal under Section 5(1)(b) of the Firearms Act 1968: "A person commits an offence if [...] he has in his possession [...] any weapon of whatever description designed or adapted for the discharge of any noxious liquid, gas or other thing."

In the USA Pepper spray can be legally purchased and carried in all 50 states. Some states regulate the maximum allowed strength of the pepper spray, age restriction, content and use.

In Canada Pepper spray designed to be used against people is considered a prohibited weapon. Any similar canister with the labels reading "dog spray" or "bear spray", while legal to be carried by anyone, is against the law if its use causes "a risk of imminent death or serious bodily harm to another person".

All that being said - what is Your experience with Pepper spray?

• Is it legal where you live?
• Do you carry it around?
• Ever had to use it?
• Was it effective?

Thanks for your answers, looking forward to expanding my knowledge in this thread.

U.K is in reality safespace for gangs.
Law abiding citizens are prihibited everything while criminals does gave f***** about laws on paper and always will laugh. Especially fun is so called knife control. Despite loud talks relity proved that paper isn't real life and situation now is worse despite Brexit and promises it now is worse than years ago.

 

[SandisLL]

I never had used spray on human. For dog sometimes cos I had considered this more human than to use CCW or beating.

I went sceptical about sprays vs humans after I once had used service grade stuff instead of supposed light dezo spray. Effect was huge but with delay approx 4 sec.
So ofc enough time to roll someone in coffin.

Against dogs pepper spray does works well , however there are also things called ultrasound devices.... these are very effective vs dogs for first usage attempts...

 

[Adamant]

This happens.

My best friend, may he rest in peace, had a guy in his OSUT cycle who was good-natured albeit... not intelligent. The cadre quickly took to calling him "Forrest Gump" and the name stuck because the guy's mannerisms and behavior were just on-point. Immediately following the gas chamber exposure, all of the students were suffering. Tears, snot, vomiting, the whole nine yards... all of them except Forrest. Guy was standing there, stoic, unfazed, maybe even a bit bemused by the scene before him.

One of the cadre approached Forrest and demanded to know why he wasn't crying like the rest of his classmates.

Gump gave the instructor a perplexed look and calmly said, "I didn't know I was allowed to, Drill Sergeant."

The instructor didn't have an answer for that. He just sorta shook his head and walked away.




The Fox doesn't have any CS in it if that's specifically what you're looking for.

However, in the realm of "pure" OC sprays then it's hard to go wrong with Fox. It is probably one of the most famous names in the business alongside Sabre and has a reputation for being the hottest out there. Supposedly it's because of one of the oils or solvents that they use in their mix, which allows the spray to rapidly absorb through the skin's fatty lipid layer far more readily than most sprays. This in turn makes for a far faster and more intense burning sensation... but a lot of this is anecdotal and some out there say it's hot, but a tad overrated. I've never been sprayed with it so can't say either way.

Worth noting that there isn't a ton of hard science behind an objective numerical method to rate the efficacy of OC spray. No one really agrees on the best way to do it. Some swear by the major capsaicinoid (MC) number, some swear by SHU, etc.

SHU makes for good marketing because it lets companies like Fox print big numbers on their product (5.3 MILLION, etc.) to appeal to the masses, but again SHU is a bit... I won't say it's pseudoscience by any means, but at the end of the day it's the same way they rate hot sauce lol. It's a bit subjective and vague.

But I digress. Fox is good stuff and you can't go wrong with it. I would recommend a Stream, as a general rule, over a Gel/Foam or Cone/Fogger unless your use case is fairly specific.

The reason I decided to go with the FOX over the Freeze is pretty much purely because of the that guy's video I posted. He did the Fox in one and the Freeze in another and it took him a good bit longer to feel the full bite of the Freeze. So I thought, eh, I'll go for the Fox. But I'm still intrigued by the CS/OC mixture so I'll probably go ahead get the Freeze either as a backup or when the next time rolls around.

lol, Forrest Gump. Too stupid to feel the gas...

 

[Peteyandjia]

Pros:
- non lethal
- non toxic (pepper/OC, not mace/CS)
- instant effect on most people
- cheap

Cons:
- non lethal
- tricky to use
- useless in wind
- useless in rain
- weak to useless against attacker wearing mask, glasses or sunglasses
- effective range is basically right in your face, arm's length plus a few feet at best
- some people it just has basically no effect on for various reasons

It's a good option to have when lethal force is uncalled for, under the right circumstances, however it has severe limitations with regard to effectiveness & is no substitute for a true weapon against a certain level of serious threat

If you get some on you, don't rub the shit out of your eyes in which your overzealous friction can damage them, just rinse gently with warm water, then suck it up mentally & just wait for it to wear off. 15-30 minutes or so give or take. If you have access to it, milk clears it up & counters the effects much better & faster than water.

 

[SandisLL]

When it comes to expiration dates, most reputable brands last a good bit longer than two years these days. The little canister of POM that I carry on my own time I bought back in January of 2024 and has a listed expiration date of December 2027. I don't know when it was manufactured, but I assume it was probably not too long after I bought it... so about four years of shelf life. The can of Sabre Red I'm issued for work helpfully shows the manufacturing and expiration date on the bottom of the label -- it's good for five years.

As for the Mace vs. Pepper Spray thing... this is one of those things that's impossible to explain without sounds like an absolute pedant, but here goes. Basically:

Pepper Spray's "technical" abbreviation is OC.

Conversely, Mace is actually CS, aka tear gas. Yes, Mace is just a liquid/aerosol stream version of what's usually dispersed in the grenades used by SWAT teams and riot police. Also worth noting that Mace is the name of a company who manufactures these types of products and -- counterintuitively -- some of their sprays are actually just OC. Not to mention the fact that "mace" has become a generic term for any kind of defensive spray in the public lexicon... so no hard-and-fast rules.

Both OC and CS are severe irritants when introduced to the eyes and/or the sensitive skin of the face, mucous membranes, etc. They have broadly similar effects, with some minor exceptions. CS is more likely to induce nausea/vomiting than OC, for instance. However, OC is generally recommended over pure CS because it has some useful involuntary physiological effects, most notably forcing the target's eyes to shut for potentially minutes at a time. CS's effects are theoretically easier to "tough out" across the spectrum and some people build up a tolerance to them or start off with an exceptional level of resistance.

Most people who have experienced both say OC is more painful than CS, but opinions vary. Some say it's different types of pain. Some say CS is worse. I personally haven't experienced CS yet, so I can't comment. It's worth noting that there are blended formulations of chemical spray that combine OC and CS into one package and they are renowned as basically hellfire in bottled form because they essentially check all the boxes.

There are for certain customers awailable stuff with higher pressure and higher contentration ( than allowed for civies )of CS and mixed with OC.

However these too aren't panacea to use against opponent who had excepted you to do this.

Most common countermeasure is to shell up, close distance ASAP and to kick, grab and punch, headbutt area where you might be located. Ofc dirtywrestle and throws, to stomp etc....this if unarmed attacker.

After some seconds you might appear client for ICU room.

Therefore sparys should be not used as threat and best chance if until to start use them to ensure that possibility of usage pepper spray will not get noticed by attacker.
Additonally also in case if you don't want to engage in very close range fight...then after usage you should retreat and run away properly... so this means to increase distance vs assiliant without turning back and only after this to run away.

Otherwise attacker might manage to grab you from behind and fun will start.

 

[Safton]

There are for certain customers awailable stuff with higher pressure and higher contentration ( than allowed for civies )of CS and mixed with OC.

However these too aren't panacea to use against opponent who had excepted you to do this.

Most common countermeasure is to shell up, close distance ASAP and to kick, grab and punch, headbutt area where you might be located. Ofc dirtywrestle and throws, to stomp etc....this if unarmed attacker.

After some seconds you might appear client for ICU room.

Therefore sparys should be not used as threat and best chance if until to start use them to ensure that possibility of usage pepper spray will not get noticed by attacker.
Additonally also in case if you don't want to engage in very close range fight...then after usage you should retreat and run away properly... so this means to increase distance vs assiliant without turning back and only after this to run away.

Otherwise attacker might manage to grab you from behind and fun will start.

See my other account. I already had some experiences with this. This sounds good in principle, but sometimes you've got to be ready to spray someone first and fight them after and then deal with what comes regardless. It's a judgment call whether fighting a non-sprayed version of them is preferable.

 

[SandisLL]

See my other account. I already had some experiences with this. This sounds good in principle, but sometimes you've got to be ready to spray someone first and fight them after and then deal with what comes regardless. It's a judgment call whether fighting a non-sprayed version of them is preferable.

There is normal real life that first thing you should do is to be ready and without showing signs before this to spray properly. This is more difficult task than ppl does imagine.

For example to notice situation when you might get attacked, morally and physically to be ready to use stuff.. Ofc if dressing outdoors is like autumn / winter in Northern europe there are other places besides pockets and special holsters where to have spray.

While there I might have question why instead of spray potential opponent or victim doesn't have nice knifes or other tools? It is funny to process meat like tomato if unnoticed...


___
As for court IMHO if you will spray someone and run away, he most likely will get medical assistance somewhere while will not get disability benefits for long term or sick leave.
While if after fight vs you opponent will stay in hospital for longer term or / and get sick leave ...then there risk that might be MBH or in worst case GBH. Maybe with compensations etc on top ...of other stuff.

So if attacker is one and you managed to debilitate him and have opportunity to run away ...it is best choice...if to think about possible court sessions.

Ofc from brutal approach opponent should be finished till end. Life is life.

 

[Safton]

There is normal real life that first thing you should do is to be ready and without showing signs before this to spray properly. This is more difficult task than ppl does imagine.

When I'm using OC I don't want it to be a surprise in my niche most of the time. I'm typically going to be delivering verbal warnings. Again, my niche isn't the same as everyone else's but that's the point. It's hard to make these sorts of blanket statements.

For example to notice situation when you might get attacked, morally and physically to be ready to use stuff.. Ofc if dressing outdoors is like autumn / winter in Northern europe there are other places besides pockets and special holsters where to have spray.

Obviously situational awareness is step one. That goes without saying.

While there I might have question why instead of spray potential opponent or victim doesn't have nice knifes or other tools? It is funny to process meat like tomato if unnoticed...

Knives are IMO, oftentimes overrated as defensive tools. They are also sometimes criminalized and subject to poor optics. I think there's a place for them, but they are in no way a substitute for OC.

___
As for court IMHO if you will spray someone and run away, he most likely will get medical assistance somewhere while will not get disability benefits for long term or sick leave.
While if after fight vs you opponent will stay in hospital for longer term or / and get sick leave ...then there risk that might be MBH or in worst case GBH. Maybe with compensations etc on top ...of other stuff.

So if attacker is one and you managed to debilitate him and have opportunity to run away ...it is best choice...if to think about possible court sessions.

Ofc from brutal approach opponent should be finished till end. Life is life.

I honestly don't know what you're getting at here.

 

[SandisLL]

I honestly don't know what you're getting at here.

It is simple. Of course now is era with CCTV almost everywhere in public places : often this is cos insurance companies demands, also as additional installation when you have contract with security company etc...also are used to monitor employees and landlords does want to have some evidence if their property will be damaged.
Then add here that here now in world are damn a lot of ppl with phones with video recording options.

☆
However when I was young guy this wasn't like this... I'm older than 40...

☆
So then...if you were in situation where someone does threat you and you don't have evidence about this...I mean in form of witnesses willing to communicate with police and investigators or video records ( not edited )....
You for example get some threats and used spray and after this had punched opponent or even also kicked him or on top of this had drity wrestled etc.
Offender might ofc lie and deny that he had expressed threats...and tell police that you had sprayed him and applied beating after this and he was not dangerous for you when you did this. offenders does knows how to lie properly if they are not only evil but also does have sense of reality...vs now according to his statements you might appear as aggressor...
Ofc I do know that now is different era on da tech street.... I was young cat in late 1990 ies and early 2000 ies. Young cat for da tech streetZ.

 

[SandisLL]

I honestly don't know what you're getting at here.

It is simple. Of course now is era with CCTV almost everywhere in public places : often this is cos insurance companies demands, also as additional installation when you have contract with security company etc...also are used to monitor employees and landlords does want to have some evidence if their property will be damaged.
Then add here that here now in world are damn a lot of ppl with phones with video recording options.

☆
However when I was young guy this wasn't like this... I'm older than 40...

☆
So then...if you were in situation where someone does threat you and you don't have evidence about this...I mean in form of witnesses willing to communicate with police and investigators or video records ( not edited )....
You for example get some threats and used spray and after this had punched opponent or even also kicked him or on top of this had drity wrestled etc.
Offender might ofc lie and deny that he had expressed threats...and tell police that you had sprayed him and applied beating after this and he was not dangerous for you when you did this. offenders does knows how to lie properly if they are not only evil but also does have sense of reality...vs now according to his statements you might appear as aggressor...
Ofc I do know that now is different era on da tech street.... I was young cat in late 1990 ies and early 2000 ies. Young cat for da tech streetZ.

Obviously situational awareness is step one. That goes without saying.//= yes. I AGREE.

yes. I AGREE here.

However exactly this is overlooked by majority of trainees for self def or other kind of training for stuff like this...
Another stuff are requirements for S/C conditioning and other things...
Ppl paying for SD training often doesn't want to keep their body in shape and to do exercises cycles at least 2 x each day. They better will agree to learn 100 techniques rather than to bring shape and agility and power in order to use maybe 10 techniques.
For example to start learn throw or disbalancing ...it is usually assumed that after 600+ drill episodes guy is starting to automatize movements more normally.