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Official Women's Division Discussion #26

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You're definitely wrong here Cyborg vs yana drew more buys then the card with Holm vs Anderson, even though it had 2 title fights, and cm punk drawing power as well. Holm was clearly not the bigger draw there. As for Anderson Silva 234 is coming up and I doubt it sells more then Cyborg v yana again so that will prove it wasn't him either.

OK, I can agree on a Holm part. She indeed drew ratings every time she was on free TV but apparently it did not land well on PPV.
Maybe indeed the combination of Cyborg-Holm was something that indeed boosted the viewership.
However, I really doubt that will somehow transform to Cyborg-Nunes. If anything, THIS is an example of something that happened one time.

You realize that things can change right? This notion that things happened one way one time therefore no one will ever support amanda isnt real life, and it's hard to account for public interest.

"Things can change" is really a weak argument, especially when talking about Nunes deserving a raise for her next fight having some chance to be marketable. Because when UFC decides what to do with her salary, they more likely will look at ther previous accomplishments in that area, than on "things can change" factor.
Saying Cyborg vs amanda 2 will draw less than Cyborg vs yana is beyond silly, with a strong undercard it definitely will be around 400k.

DEFINITELY? Sorry, I see no "definitely" here. I don't see any reason for it.
Even at her finest alone Cyborg did not do 400K. With Holm she did less. And Holm fight is something that actually might be a fluke.
But to say "definitely 400K" about fight with an opponent who is known for the past of being a viewers' repellent, is .... too bold of a statement, to say the list.

And "strong undercard" is NEVER a factor to determine Nunes' marketability (I assume you meant a remainder of a main card here).
 
Paige Van Zant vs. Rachel Ostovich Post Fight Study
The MMA Rundown
Published on Jan 20, 2019

Notes from the channel:
"After dominating the first 6 minutes of the fight, Rachel Ostovich found herself with PVZ on her back. Though she couldn't finish Paige VanZant when she had her back, PVZ was able to finish her. I break down the final sequence and discuss where this puts PVZ in the rankings. Do you think Paige is on the verge of cracking the top 10?"

 
Paige Van Zant vs. Rachel Ostovich Post Fight Study
The MMA Rundown
Published on Jan 20, 2019

Notes from the channel:
"After dominating the first 6 minutes of the fight, Rachel Ostovich found herself with PVZ on her back. Though she couldn't finish Paige VanZant when she had her back, PVZ was able to finish her. I break down the final sequence and discuss where this puts PVZ in the rankings. Do you think Paige is on the verge of cracking the top 10?"


PVZ is never going to be more than a gatekeeper at best. but yeah, maybe she'll crack into top 10 for a little while, since the division is still so young
 
Paige Van Zant vs. Rachel Ostovich Post Fight Study
The MMA Rundown
Published on Jan 20, 2019

Notes from the channel:
"After dominating the first 6 minutes of the fight, Rachel Ostovich found herself with PVZ on her back. Though she couldn't finish Paige VanZant when she had her back, PVZ was able to finish her. I break down the final sequence and discuss where this puts PVZ in the rankings. Do you think Paige is on the verge of cracking the top 10?"



PVZ is never going to be more than a gatekeeper at best. but yeah, maybe she'll crack into top 10 for a little while, since the division is still so young

Knowing the UFC rankings, she’s probably in the 11-15 range now, and they’ll continue to push her up. Amazing how a win over .500 Ostovich can inspire someone to make a video even discussing something so silly.
 
Hope this turned out pretty good. I put off making it and putting it out for a few weeks now.



Okay, commenting here because it seems like the thing to do. My points in order as I listen to it.
(reminder, I agree that they should have 105)

1. I find the music at the start annoying. Probably a personal thing, so fuck my opinion.
2. Strange lighting effect. Something to do with bright light against your pale complexion. Distracting. (actually being serious here and trying not to be an ass. People that do professional videos often discuss the importance of lighting, but since I know next to nothing I am of no help with this).
3. Notes never hurt. You do not need to write everything out ahead of time, but sometimes you are struggling for words - we all do this - and having a few prepared notes/phrases helps improve the flow of your presentation. It is difficult to find your precise line between speaking to people and reading from a script, and this is something that all of us who have done a great deal of public speaking have had to take time to develop. When I was first teaching classes, my presentation was all technical and not at all engaging, the opposite of yours. Writing a script out helps cement what you are going to say, but you do not need to actually read from it. The act of writing helps cement your words via task-oriented pattern establishment. Also repeating the same phrase such as "lightning" hurts your presentation. I cannot remember why I was taught to do this, but I can look it up if you want.
4. Good job on the speed argument combining both striking and grappling as a basis for support.
5. Nice bringing women from multiple orgs up. This helps show that outside of the UFC there are a lot of 105'ers.
6. If you are going to mention statistics, show them. (I have no idea how to do this on Youtube, so there is that to consider). If you are going to quote data, people like to see it. They have been shown to trust data more when they see it in writing, people like pictures and it helps with retention.
7. Aesthetics was a good word choice for what we all know you meant. Well done. I do not know that I would have singled people out here, though. Some people may pull the "sexist" or "demeaning" bullshit.
8. Great job on showing the competitive nature of the division. This is an argument that I had not thought of.
 
I made a decent amount of money betting on VanZant to win, as stated, but that had much to do with VanZant always fighting hard to the bitter end, no matter the situation, while Ostovich quits whenever things get tough. Which is precisely what happened.

Watching the fight, I had the unsettling thought that VanZant compares poorly to Ashley Yoder in every aspect except cardio and heart.

When a 115 pound journeywoman who should probably be 0-4 in the UFC right now is better than you, that's a worrying sign.

Worse, there were many signs against Ostovich that VanZant has actually REGRESSED as a fighter. I have no clue who they're going to match her against that won't completely expose her yet again.
 
Okay, commenting here because it seems like the thing to do. My points in order as I listen to it.
(reminder, I agree that they should have 105)

1. I find the music at the start annoying. Probably a personal thing, so fuck my opinion.
2. Strange lighting effect. Something to do with bright light against your pale complexion. Distracting. (actually being serious here and trying not to be an ass. People that do professional videos often discuss the importance of lighting, but since I know next to nothing I am of no help with this).
3. Notes never hurt. You do not need to write everything out ahead of time, but sometimes you are struggling for words - we all do this - and having a few prepared notes/phrases helps improve the flow of your presentation. It is difficult to find your precise line between speaking to people and reading from a script, and this is something that all of us who have done a great deal of public speaking have had to take time to develop. When I was first teaching classes, my presentation was all technical and not at all engaging, the opposite of yours. Writing a script out helps cement what you are going to say, but you do not need to actually read from it. The act of writing helps cement your words via task-oriented pattern establishment. Also repeating the same phrase such as "lightning" hurts your presentation. I cannot remember why I was taught to do this, but I can look it up if you want.
4. Good job on the speed argument combining both striking and grappling as a basis for support.
5. Nice bringing women from multiple orgs up. This helps show that outside of the UFC there are a lot of 105'ers.
6. If you are going to mention statistics, show them. (I have no idea how to do this on Youtube, so there is that to consider). If you are going to quote data, people like to see it. They have been shown to trust data more when they see it in writing, people like pictures and it helps with retention.
7. Aesthetics was a good word choice for what we all know you meant. Well done. I do not know that I would have singled people out here, though. Some people may pull the "sexist" or "demeaning" bullshit.
8. Great job on showing the competitive nature of the division. This is an argument that I had not thought of.
Tanks for the Review.

1. Regarding the music, like you said, some like it, some don't. That's a bit of stock music that has sort of become the theme for my videos. I sometimes skip it on short videos, but like to keep it regular.
2. Lighting is probably the hardest thing for me. There was an overhead light right above me, that I couldn't use because it just made my head glow. Being bald is a bitch when it comes to lighting. I'm experimenting with indirect spotlighting for the next video, instead of the LED light I used for this one.
3. I've used notes in the past, and they definitely help. I had everything I wanted to say in mind, and wnet off a set list I had written (the 8 points, the example fighters, but tried to wing the fleshing out of each point.I think my goal was to not sound too scripted, as some of my vids have sounded in the past.
4. Thanks. I focused more on Penn vs Watersons scrambles more last year, but wanted to give more examples this year.
5. Again, thanks.I definitely thought it important to mention that there are fighters out there besides those in Invicta.
6. I had thought about that, and might try to do it in later videos. My editing skills are very rudimentary, and still learning how to use the software I use. adding the titles for each of the points I used was something I had forgotten I know how to do before this video.
7. Yeah, I'm fancy like that. I wanted to dive home the point without being too overt, although I was also that. I feel like the less attractive or petty fighters might not like it, but I'm not worried about being labled a sexist when I'm covering the women exclusively and almost never bring up looks otherwise. If people get offended, that's their problem as much as mine.
8. Thanks. I thought it was important to show the dnagers of Joanna, Ronda, or Mighty Mouse syndrome, and how it's not a problem in this division.
 
I made a decent amount of money betting on VanZant to win, as stated, but that had much to do with VanZant always fighting hard to the bitter end, no matter the situation, while Ostovich quits whenever things get tough. Which is precisely what happened.

Watching the fight, I had the unsettling thought that VanZant compares poorly to Ashley Yoder in every aspect except cardio and heart.

When a 115 pound journeywoman who should probably be 0-4 in the UFC right now is better than you, that's a worrying sign.

Worse, there were many signs against Ostovich that VanZant has actually REGRESSED as a fighter. I have no clue who they're going to match her against that won't completely expose her yet again.

Paige has regressed, her standup has gone from poor to I don't even want to talk about it. It's sad to say that Paige with a broken arm has better standup than when she's fully healthy. Ground game seems about the same as usual, just keep moving and scrambling until something happens.

As for Ostovich, she seems to have poor positional awareness along with very questionable decision making. She actually has pretty decent timing in her striking and takedown entries and her technique in those areas isn't bad. Problem is once she gets it on the ground she starts making mistakes all over the place. She was easily stalled out in full guard and when she was in half guard she had no base and left her hips & legs in bad positions that even Paige could sweep out of.

And then she just totally loses her patience & composure in the 2nd round and jumps herself right out of an easy back mount and proceeds to derp herself into an armbar. Her ground game is classic old school WMMA with an extra helping of potato. That fight was so easily winnable for Rachael, all she had to do was either keep it standing or just have some awareness on the ground and control Paige to lame it out for a win. Just have some patience, be more aware on the ground, and get the basics of the ground game down instead of trying to jump all over low percentage subs.

It's like a case of wasted potential for both fighters, they could be so much better if only they could get their shit together.
 
Look who is making a comeback. This streams on Facebook Sunday

upload_2019-1-23_23-11-23.jpeg
 
OK, I can agree on a Holm part. She indeed drew ratings every time she was on free TV but apparently it did not land well on PPV.
Maybe indeed the combination of Cyborg-Holm was something that indeed boosted the viewership.
However, I really doubt that will somehow transform to Cyborg-Nunes. If anything, THIS is an example of something that happened one time.



"Things can change" is really a weak argument, especially when talking about Nunes deserving a raise for her next fight having some chance to be marketable. Because when UFC decides what to do with her salary, they more likely will look at ther previous accomplishments in that area, than on "things can change" factor.


DEFINITELY? Sorry, I see no "definitely" here. I don't see any reason for it.
Even at her finest alone Cyborg did not do 400K. With Holm she did less. And Holm fight is something that actually might be a fluke.
But to say "definitely 400K" about fight with an opponent who is known for the past of being a viewers' repellent, is .... too bold of a statement, to say the list.

And "strong undercard" is NEVER a factor to determine Nunes' marketability (I assume you meant a remainder of a main card here).
It's not something that they can do right away Cyborg needs a win or two. Her coach already planted the seed of her getting caught because she abandoned the plan.

U mentioned earlier how the ufc tracks these things and pay accordingly that why Cyborg is the highest paid female her foxs cards did very well, and they added a title for her, and ever ppv with her is successful. It not guessing they know this.

And you are wrong ufc cards with multiple drawing fights (a strong undercard) do better than cards that have a title fight and no names underneath u even tried to say Anderson sold Cyborg v Holm. So why you're being picky here is silly trying to run down how this fight would draw.

Amanda is now the first women's champ, champ and the undisputed best female fighter right now. Her stock certainly didn't go down.

Pairings matter.
We can look at her horrible number vs Rocky a fake contender fed to her to save a card that was paper thin but that's not real either. VS Tate and Ronda and Cyborg 1 all sold well so Amanda vs (a draw) is a SUCCESSFUL PPV. If Holm wins her fight Amanda vs her will do well too, but if she has to fight Ketlen that's not likely to hit 150k.


In like late 2019 or 2020
Her having beaten Cyborg and this being a rematch (historically rematches draw more than 1st match) with Cyborg still the A side out to even the score, should do better than Cyborg vs Holm (with a similar undercard). And by around 400k I'm meaning 360k-400K based on the other 4 fights on the ppv.
 

quote from this:

While at official weighins, I spotted Katlyn Chookagian in the crowd. Our conversation went like this:

Me: Is that Katlyn?
Katlyn: Yeah! Hello! *shakes hands*
Me: How are you? *chat chat* Do you have a fight set yet?
Katlyn: No, not yet! :(
Me: Me, neither. Do you want to fight me?

Roxy bout dat thug life, trying to start brawls in the stalls now :eek:

roxy-vs-chookagian.jpg
 
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2. Lighting is probably the hardest thing for me. There was an overhead light right above me, that I couldn't use because it just made my head glow. Being bald is a bitch when it comes to lighting. I'm experimenting with indirect spotlighting for the next video, instead of the LED light I used for this one.

You want soft even lighting, so no spotlights unless you're bouncing them off the ceiling from way off-camera. Easiest setup is a couple bare compact fluorescent bulbs or soft white LED bulbs in a table lamp or other fixture that's angled off to the side outside of camera view. You'll probably want a lamp on each side so you don't get any harsh shadows, and try to keep them head level or a bit higher. Lights shining into your face from below looks really unnatural since all the shadows are in the wrong places, we're conditioned to seeing lighting coming in from above as normal since that's what we have almost everywhere.

Also, camera angle and distance. Putting the camera below face level gives you a godawful chin line and makes you look like a fat slob, and this is made worse by having the camera too close. Camera goes at face level which encourages you to sit upright with your chin up, and moving it back a few feet & zooming in gives a better perspective and more natural proportions to your face. When you watch studio news crews or portrait photographers, they don't stick a camera 2' in front of your face, the cameras are always a good distance back and zoomed in as needed to get the framing they want.
 
id like to see cyroid get beaten up again by nunes, hell, ill watch a trilogy...
 
Erin Toughill?! Wow! She was an important pioneer for the sport, but sadly she'll probably be remembered for two negative things. That Smackgirl bout when she got pissed that Megumi Y. kept grabbing her gloves (those big, weird Smackgirl gloves), so she delivered a spinebreaker elbow smash (and got DQed). I also remember her talking shit to Laila Ali before their fight, and then she got KOed. A little late for her to have a comeback fight, isn't it?

Jarl
 
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