Official Women's Division Discussion #25

Rizz said:
My thoughts on 145.

Overall it's talent level is trash. With that being the case you can still have exciting fights if you match make well. Sign girls like Charmain Tweet, Amanda Bell and Felicia Spencer. They are known for exciting fights. While it won't be the best division you can have some entertaining fights. You have an blue chip prospect we all know is coming in the future in Kayla. I can't believe I am saying this but I have changed my mind and want the UFC to keep 145. They must stay away from fighters like Cindy Dandois. She can fight but can also be an embarrassment due to her pre school level striking. This division can't afford that right now. Stay away from lay and pray or wall and stall fighters. You wont have a high talent level for while but exciting fights can build this division in the eyes of MMA fans.
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I'm still not over how idiotically they handled Dandois.

I would rather advise against signing Tweet tbh. She has a kinda awkward style and is already quite old.
 
Felis said:
So her only losses are to the ex-GOAT and the current GOAT - that's not exactly a strong argument for her being a terrible fighter.
From what I've seen of her, she sure seems to be terribly boring to watch, but that's not the same as being a bad fighter. Except from the entertainment aspect, I don't think she's worse than Megan.
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Megan is no good either. I can judge a fighter based on the skill level they display.
 
Felis said:
I'm still not over how idiotically they handled Dandois.

I would rather advise against signing Tweet tbh. She has a kinda awkward style and is already quite old.
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Yes, Tweet is awkward and old but she is always in exciting fights. Her and Amanda Bell are kill or be killed fighters. I consider them the female Lando Vannata. They are not great but will put on a show every fight if matched up well. My plan to building 145 would not reliant on talent level because we all know it not going to be there for a long time. People will warm up to 145 if we get consistent exciting fights.
 
Rizz said:
Yes, Tweet is awkward and old but she is always in exciting fights. Her and Amanda Bell are kill or be killed fighters. I consider them the female Lando Vannata. They are not great but will put on a show every fight if matched up well. My plan to building 145 would not reliant on talent level because we all know it not going to be there for a long time. People will warm up to 145 if we get consistent exciting fights.
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No thanks. Leave them in Invicta. Women fighters get a lot of shit as is. Purposely bringing in subpar fighters hoping that they'll be exciting and change peoples' minds is just a recipe for disaster, which the 145lb division already is, spread across multiple promotions.
 
lukeuidswords said:
Didnt Seo Hee Ham go the distance with a sub .500 can in her last bout
Why dont you tell the class about that
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Maybe Kanna should go train with that "can." She might actually learn how to strike.

Also, maybe you should actually watch some fights instead of talking out of your ass.
 
leto1776 said:
No thanks. Leave them in Invicta. Women fighters get a lot of shit as is. Purposely bringing in subpar fighters hoping that they'll be exciting and change peoples' minds is just a recipe for disaster, which the 145lb division already is, spread across multiple promotions.
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I can definitely respect your opinion on this topic but if we use that same logic across all the female divisions the only viable one is 115 and maybe 125 depending on how things play out. Men's 125, 205 and HW would also not be viable. The HW division for as long as I can remember has always been extremely top heavy and the rest is subpar.
 
Rizz said:
I can definitely respect your opinion on this topic but if we use that same logic across all the female divisions the only viable one is 115 and maybe 125 depending on how things play out. Men's 125, 205 and HW would also not be viable. The HW division for as long as I can remember has always been extremely top heavy and the rest is subpar.
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Difference is, those divisions all have more than 2 fighters in them. Featherweight has two fighters in UFC. The only reason for having the division in the first place just got besmirched in 51 seconds by the 135lb champ. Let her go, dissolve the division, let her and the division be someone else's headache.
 
Imagine being such a biased moron that while you watch Hamasaki dominate Kanna your take away is this:
leto1776 said:
It should be. However, this is an over the hill fighter former champ vs a prospect with no real name wins to her credit.
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This guy is delusional, and full of shit.
 
I used to hate at Hamasaki, most here know that, mostly because of the Tiburcio fight where she didn't engage much, and coasted at every opportunity, but since the last year she has grown on me with her excellent performances on RIZIN. She's not even a big atomweight so trying strawweight just to make it into UFC made no sense. I'm glad she gave up on that.
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Makes absolutely no sense to say she's over the hill, there is no evidence whatsoever pointing at that. Alyssa Garcia gave her a tough fight because of how good Garcia is, specially on the ground. Hell, she might even beat that Korean can that was cut from UFC if they eventually fight.
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Hamasaki was fantastic against Kanna, and proved once again that she's not only the best atomweight on the world but also one of the best female fighters ever.
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leto1776 said:
Difference is, those divisions all have more than 2 fighters in them. Featherweight has two fighters in UFC. The only reason for having the division in the first place just got besmirched in 51 seconds by the 135lb champ. Let her go, dissolve the division, let her and the division be someone else's headache.
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Most of what you said is correct. The UFC has had 3 dedicated 145ers for about a year now. It's not a big deal but it seems like no one knew that Leah Letson has had a normal UFC contract for a year. Leah Letson was signed last January. She is not like the fighters who were signed just to be on TUF. She is more like Lauren Murphy who had a contract and joined TUF.

Everything else you said is correct. The problem however is that the whole premise of what I was saying is that this would be the start of them actually trying to build a division. This is why I was stating on who they should sign if they were to start actually trying to building one. To use a lack of fighters signed as a reason not to start one would not be fair. When the UFC opened 135 it had Ronda, Tate, Cat, Alexis Davis ,McMann and Liz. They pretty much started the division with 3 main people. 145's main fighters would be Cyborg, Megan with Kayla coming after a few more fights. I do admit that if Cyborg leaves then things get a lot harder to justify.
 
Letson has a grand 2 official fights at 145, one a late notice fight against another 1335lber, and one against someone who has gone back and forth between the two divisions. She's better off fighting in the established 135 division.

Cyborg's mystique is gone, no point in building a division now that the reason for building the division just lost to her title (to a 135lber, no less).
 
Rizz said:
I can definitely respect your opinion on this topic but if we use that same logic across all the female divisions the only viable one is 115 and maybe 125 depending on how things play out. Men's 125, 205 and HW would also not be viable. The HW division for as long as I can remember has always been extremely top heavy and the rest is subpar.
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The problem with the UFC is they've always sucked donkey balls at building new divisions from scratch. Not just the women's divisions, all divisions.

What they're good at is poaching fighters or even entire divisions from other organizations. The UFC had a dogshit LW division and no lower weight classes until they imported everyone from WEC. Women's 135 was inherited from Strikeforce and filled out with fighters who were poached from various other organizations. 115 started as mostly Invicta vets with a few fighters from elsewhere, it was later filled out with a bunch of signings from other orgs.

They would fail badly at trying to build women's 145 unless they're willing to spend the money to poach Bellator and Invicta's entire 145 rosters, and even that's a short term solution since you still need to figure out a way to get the talent pipeline flowing at the amateur and early pro levels. Those fighters ain't gonna be around forever and unless you can produce new talent to replace them as they retire the division is still dead in the long run.

IMO, let another organization build 145, and if it gets to a healthy level one day the UFC can do its usual poaching routine.
 
aerius said:
The problem with the UFC is they've always sucked donkey balls at building new divisions from scratch. Not just the women's divisions, all divisions.

What they're good at is poaching fighters or even entire divisions from other organizations. The UFC had a dogshit LW division and no lower weight classes until they imported everyone from WEC. Women's 135 was inherited from Strikeforce and filled out with fighters who were poached from various other organizations. 115 started as mostly Invicta vets with a few fighters from elsewhere, it was later filled out with a bunch of signings from other orgs.

They would fail badly at trying to build women's 145 unless they're willing to spend the money to poach Bellator and Invicta's entire 145 rosters, and even that's a short term solution since you still need to figure out a way to get the talent pipeline flowing at the amateur and early pro levels. Those fighters ain't gonna be around forever and unless you can produce new talent to replace them as they retire the division is still dead in the long run.

IMO, let another organization build 145, and if it gets to a healthy level one day the UFC can do its usual poaching routine.
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You make some very good points about how the UFC only gets building divisions correctly when they poach talent from other organizations. I never thought about it like that.
 
Happy new year everybody!

I started a new women's division thread. Hopefully everyone will start posting there.

And someone sticky that one please.

This one was getting a bit long in the tooth.
 
PurpleStorm said:
Happy new year everybody!

I started a new women's division thread. Hopefully everyone will start posting there.

And someone sticky that one please.

This one was getting a bit long in the tooth.
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I was hoping we could make it to 10k in here this year :(
 
leto1776 said:
Maybe Kanna should go train with that "can." She might actually learn how to strike.

Also, maybe you should actually watch some fights instead of talking out of your ass.
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That can lost to Kurobe, who Hamasaki flushed even easier than she did Kanna
Hamasaki is the unquestionable #1 at Atomweight
 
MajorTB said:
I’d almost rather see them trade Cyborg and Anderson to Bellator for some of the Male stars. You would then potentially have a division with Cyborg, Julia Budd, Megan Anderson, Amber Leibrock, Olga Rubin, Cindy Dandois, Talita Nogueira, Sinnead Kavanagh, Arlene Belncowe, Janay Harding, and Amanda Bell.

If Bellator was the only money place, it’d then be easier for them to sign Kayla Harrison, Felicia Spencer, Pam Sorenson, Zarah Dos Santos, Zamzagul Fayzallonva, Larissa Pacheco, Bobbi Jo Dalziel, and Zamzagul Fayzallanova. (Throw Danyelle Wolfe in there if she ever actually takes a fight)

Another advantage to keeping the division in Bellator would be their lack of a 135 pound division. They could sign larger 135ers too, like Morgan Frier and Norma Dumont, and fill out the division that way... and since there’s no 135, those fighters take their fights at 145.
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I don’t want to bag on you for a simple mistake, I’m just impressed that you typed out Zamzagul Fayzallanova twice!
 
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