Mueller's Patton the back (investigation thread v. 22)

[Joe]

Never he says

 

[hillelslovak87]

Never he says

You would think that if one would call someone retarded, they would do so in English better than a 1st grader.

 

[Andy Capp]

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2018/09/ex-trump-lawyer-told-mueller-trump-is-too-dumb-to-testify

[Dowd then explained to Mueller and Quarles why he was trying to keep the president from testifying: “I’m not going to sit there and let him look like an idiot. And you publish that transcript, because everything leaks in Washington, and the guys overseas are going to say, ‘I told you he was an idiot. I told you he was a goddamn dumbbell. What are we dealing with this idiot for?’ ”

“John, I understand,” Mueller replied, according to Woodward.



President cant answer Muellers questions in fear of displaying how inept he is. This is scary : (

I think the cat is long out of the bag about how dumb he is, though. I'm sure that's why the Russians recruited him in the first place. But good excuse by the law talking guy.

"“I’ll be a real good witness,” Trump told Dowd, according to Woodward.

“You are not a good witness,” Dowd replied. “Mr. President, I’m afraid I just can’t help you.”

The next morning, Dowd resigned."

So sad, so pathetic, so dangerously immune to criticism, yet so hilariously funny. He will need to be out of office for a bit before I can really enjoy the entertainment, I think.

 

[Andy Capp]

What I take from this, they must already have evidence that either implicates or exonerates tRUmp regarding conspiring with Russia. Evidence likely in form of emails and/or internal memos.

What this says they won't accept written to obstruction of justice

I'd say it's the first option; "Later that month, Dowd told Trump: “Don’t testify. It’s either that or an orange jumpsuit."

 

[waiguoren]

Woodward's explosive book

 

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

Interesting but I'm tired of this already unless there's actually tapes to confirm.

 

[waiguoren]

do you have proof that Stormy "threatened to go public with her sex story" two weeks before the election?

In its initial report the Wall Street Journal elaborated that the payment was made through a private company, Essential Consultants LLC. The company was founded by Cohen on October 17, 2016, in Delaware. At the time, [Clifford] was reportedly in talks to tell her account to Good Morning America and Slate.The Daily Beast was also in talks with [Clifford] "after three sources—including fellow porn star Alana Evans—told The Daily Beast that [Clifford] and Trump were involved. [Clifford] ultimately backed out on November 3, just five days before the 2016 election."


Again, your case would be strengthened if Trump had turned down an earlier extortion attempt of Clifford's two or more years prior, when Trump was not involved in politics. Do you have any evidence of that? Otherwise, you're in the very dicey territory of inferring motivations. The mere appearance of misconduct is not sufficient to prove misconduct.

Also, you still haven't responded to this:

At least you're consistent. To me, it's ridiculous to interpret such payments as "campaign contributions". How far can we stretch this? If Trump pays for a nice massage during campaign season, should he be obligated to disclose to the FEC his payment to his masseuse as a "campaign contribution" on the grounds that it benefitted Trump on the campaign trail? @Rational Poster's position is "yes", as I understand it. I'm guessing you'll say "no".

As for Cohen flipping and testifying to the obvious, no I am not defeating my own case. Trump defenders can bemoan the use of snitches when it comes to their boy, but snitches and flippers have been an essential part of law enforcement for generations, including the testimony of stone cold killers and career criminals who make Cohen look like an angel in comparison. Furthermore, it's not like Cohen is making this stuff up out of nowhere, Avenatti was making this case for months before the FBI raided Cohen's house, hotel, and office, and Cohen held out with bullshit for as long as he could, waiting for Trump's help. Plus, the FBI has documents and tapes from their raids on Cohen, and Cohen cooperating to help them put the pieces of the puzzle together, so it would not just come down to a he said vs. he said decision for jurors. So yeah, the case against Trump is much stronger than was the case against Edwards, who again, I think was guilty.

To me, this looks like you're being tribalistic. You haven't seen all the evidence yet, but you're pre-judging guilt/innocence. I think the most likely outcome is that this comes down to he-said/he-said with Trump/Cohen. As part of what I believe is an implicit plea agreement, Cohen wants to claim that Trump (1) directed him to make the payment (2) for the sole purpose of impacting the campaign. Trump will probably argue that (1) he himself made the payment via Cohen and (2) it was made to protect his reputation and family, not to influence the campaign. In the absence of further tapes or documents (no, I'm not making any assumptions) this should result in acquittal.

Now let's zoom out and look at the political landscape. Mueller's primary goal is to investigate coordination between the Russian government and the Trump campaign. Weissman/Mueller view Trump as the target of the investigation. In my view and particularly in light of the news that Mueller will accept written responses on Russia-related questions, Mueller/Weissman's best chance to implicate their target now is on charges not related to their primary goal---possible "in-kind campaign contributions" from Trump to a former alleged mistress. Even if Mueller explicitly names Trump as an unindicted co-conspirator in a scheme to pay Clifford, the non-partisan elements of the public will yawn. Put simply, people don't care about Trump "paying some whores", especially when the mainstream media and the Democrats spent two years trying to convince them that "Russia collusion" was a serious threat to the Trump presidency.

 

[waiguoren]

How much does Dershowitz pay his publicist now a days?

Are you the guy who is convinced Trump will be convicted of money laundering by January 2019?

yet you made that ridiculous bet with me knowing full well the above. Your disingenuous nature continues to melt your brain.

You actually think your are going to win that bet?

Tribalism rears its ugly head...

 

[waiguoren]

Yes it is. Willfully making excuses for a known pathological liar.

You used to be better than this.

What "excuses" did I make for Trump?

Is it that you think offering legal defense to reprehensible people is the same as "supporting" those people?

 

[waiguoren]

Hold your horses there Chief. Mueller's first priority is to investigate whether Russia meddled, hacked, or attempted to otherwise interfere with our election process. And if so, to what extent. That is priority number one and always has been. Next would be to investigate if any Americans assisted. Any Trump team relations that get revealed is a result of that main priority, but it is not the sole reason for the investigation. And that goes beyond just Trump and his campaign team. If ANYONE assisted the Russians with influencing or compromising our electoral process ( u know, that thing that is the backbone of our republic) then I, and every America has the right to know.

Thanks for your comment. I think that you and I basically agree. I have a few questions for you:

1) Do you think Mueller has provided any strong evidence that the Trump campaign coordinated with the Russian government to influence the 2016 election?

2) Do you think that the Democratic National Committee is an essential part of our "electoral process"?

3) Do you think it's reasonable to expect Mueller, with limited resources (time, funds, manpower), to discover if "ANYONE" assisted the Russian government in influencing/compromising our elections or only a relatively small group of people?

 

[waiguoren]

Mattis calls Woodward's reporting on him 'fiction'

Defense Secretary James Mattis on Tuesday pushed back against a passage concerning him in journalist Bob Woodward’s forthcoming book, calling it “fiction” and “a product of someone's rich imagination."

The Watergate reporter wrote that Mattis once described President Trump as having the understanding of “a fifth- or sixth-grader” when it comes to the Korean Peninsula, according to The Washington Post.

“The contemptuous words about the President attributed to me in Woodward's book were never uttered by me or in my presence,” Mattis said in a statement. “While I generally enjoy reading fiction, this is a uniquely Washington brand of literature, and his anonymous sources do not lend credibility.”

http://thehill.com/policy/defense/405056-mattis-calls-woodwards-reporting-on-him-fiction

 

[waiguoren]

John Kelly defends himself from Woodward book claims, calls it 'total BS'

"The idea I ever called the President an idiot is not true," Kelly said in a statement Tuesday afternoon. "As I stated back in May and still firmly stand behind: 'I spend more time with the President than anyone else, and we have an incredibly candid and strong relationship. He always knows where I stand, and he and I both know this story is total BS.'"

"I'm committed to the President, his agenda, and our country," Kelly added. "This is another pathetic attempt to smear people close to President Trump and distract from the administration’s many successes."

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/white-house/john-kelly-defends-himself-from-woodward-book-claims-calls-it-total-bs

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/...f-from-woodward-book-claims-calls-it-total-bs

 

[waiguoren]

Dershowitz: You hear on television now, people are calling Trump an unindicted co-conspirator. Totally false. First, there's been no indictment that even mentions or refers to Trump. Second, what Cohen has said in his allocution is inadmissible in any court. It's hearsay.

 

[andnowweknow]

Are you the guy who is convinced Trump will be convicted of money laundering by January 2019?



You actually think your are going to win that bet?

Tribalism rears its ugly head...

Nobody will win it moron, you ensured that with your stupid stipulations.

 

[andnowweknow]

John Kelly defends himself from Woodward book claims, calls it 'total BS'

"The idea I ever called the President an idiot is not true," Kelly said in a statement Tuesday afternoon. "As I stated back in May and still firmly stand behind: 'I spend more time with the President than anyone else, and we have an incredibly candid and strong relationship. He always knows where I stand, and he and I both know this story is total BS.'"

"I'm committed to the President, his agenda, and our country," Kelly added. "This is another pathetic attempt to smear people close to President Trump and distract from the administration’s many successes."

https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/...f-from-woodward-book-claims-calls-it-total-bs
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/...f-from-woodward-book-claims-calls-it-total-bs

Trumpers vs Bob Woodward...

A credibility war for the ages.

 

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

Trumpers vs Bob Woodward...

A credibility war for the ages.

It's a pointless battle since both sides can assert whatever they want and can't be gainsaid.

I put the allegations in Woodward's book in the likely-to-very-likely category. I'm sure everything he said sounds quite believable about this clown. But it's all so much pissing in the wind like any book of allegations no matter how well researched.

 

[Fanu]

american politics have turned into an absolute shitshow with trump as president

his policies arent even reported anymore, its all about he said she said bullshit

draining the swamp my ass - terrible administration

 

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

american politics have turned into an absolute shitshow with trump as president

his policies arent even reported anymore, its all about he said she said bullshit

draining the swamp my ass - terrible administration

... If even a quarter of the reported chaoswamp is true, holy shitballs.

Without question the worst WH in several categories.

 

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

Lads, I suggest someone start a thread about the book and what the most believable stories are.

Number one for me is that his staff were worried that Trump was a National security risk. That has verisimilitude.

 

[Bobby 3 Sticks]

Lol @ trying to say the Woodward stories are false because they're denied.

If someone said you bashed your employer whether you did or not of course you'd deny it .

I'm much more inclined to believe Woodward than anyone in the administration