More. More Power.

Discussion in 'Strength & Conditioning Discussion' started by Richmond_Hrvat, Mar 21, 2008.

  1. Richmond_Hrvat

    Richmond_Hrvat Seauxthern Dead

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    So first off, hello. I've been away plotting.

    Second, give yourselves a big round of applause. While away whipping my sad batch of bitches into some type of shape in order to lay conquest to my division of college rugby, the advice and information this board has provided me have been invaluable. Thank you very much.

    However, while swept up in my obsession of "the game they play in heaven," I have also become obsessed with power: brutal hits and blinding speed.

    Though it may surprise you, a 475 deadlift and 375 squat makes you one of the stronger athletes on a rugby pitch at the American collegiate level. Please note I'm not claiming I'm strong, it's just a fact. And while that's true, sometimes the little assholes can juke me, or they start from far away and pick up momentum before I have to tackle them, or I have to chase them down to do it first. As competition rises, the opportunities to grab ahold of some jabrony and hoist him screaming into the air starts to dwindle.

    Thus, I become fascinated with a lightning fast first step, a swift 40yard time, a fast 100meter time, and the ability to accelerate my body angrily from 20 feet out into a sternum.

    I have begun working olympic lifts into my sessions, but ugly snatching my bodyweight isn't enough. I want to be a missile. So my questions are these:

    Has anyone worked with olympic lifts specifically to improve off-the-line and sustained quickness? If so, what were the most effective ways you did this? Who has experience with using explosive weight training not just to improve slams from no distance, but to build momentous, rib-breaking tackles? I know the standard o-lifts and why they work. I'm looking for experience, nuance, and application here.

    Fix me.
     
  2. Wild Dan Hibiki

    Wild Dan Hibiki Black Belt

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    plyometrics my friend
     
  3. Halical

    Halical White Belt

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    delete
     
  4. Richmond_Hrvat

    Richmond_Hrvat Seauxthern Dead

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    @ Wild Dan: While I am familiar with them, can you give me some personal experiences with the specific translation or applications you used? I'm very curious.
     
  5. Cmart

    Cmart Aspiring Milo

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    I had a beautiful class in college called "speed improvement". Class lectures were on the theory and application of speed training, and our "labs" consisted of training to improve sprinting/launch speed.

    Among other things, we did:

    Uphill sprints
    Downhill sprints
    Weighted-vest stair climbs
    Parachute and bungee sprints

    The idea was that there are several factors limiting (or conversely, creating) one's sprinting speed. The bad news: the major one - 90+% of your capability - is genetic. But all other things being the same, training will give you an edge, and it's certainly worth pursuing.

    The major things you can train for speed are:

    Strength - strength being part of the equation in power
    Flexibility - better stride length and less resistance to movement
    Form - even a small form correction can speed you up

    If you're serious about this, you will end up videoing your sprinting form and having it reviewed by a sprint coach. It's a good idea. The strength and flexibility are brilliant things to work on as they pay you dividends in whatever you do physically, and you don't need someone's help to train them, at least until you reach a rather high level.
     
  6. brian80

    brian80 White Belt

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    The O-lifts may not be the absolute best option for you here; I have always gained great ability in vertical movement from performing them, with much smaller gains to sprinting. I think that agility drills would definitely be of great benefit to you, but do not have any specific links to sites with drills.

    Also, while I do not own it, I have heard great things about this book: http://www.flexcart.com/members/elitefts/default.asp?m=PD&cid=114&pid=129
     
  7. JinKazama

    JinKazama Red Belt

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    i wonder if suicides would help

    just a thought
     
  8. Barut

    Barut Banned Banned

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    Richmond,

    I use to lift in a Uni gym while my wife finished her law degree. The rugby team at the school was extramural and they often lifted in the gym that I did. I was invited to play with them on numerous occasions based on my squat and dl. I was surprised to learn that many of the guys weren't very strong. I guess it's a common theme in rugby. (And all sports for that matter)

    On to explosiveness. I think that much of quickness is genetically determined. I did manage to increase my first step and vertical through a combination of powercleans and high (for me) box jumps. That being said I've always been fairly explosive and better at power movements than pure strength.

    Listen to Cmart. He's old and smart and if you don't he'll blow a gasket and get fucking pissed.
     
  9. Definitely plyometrics. We used to do them in HS and they truly help build explosiveness and quickness. The dot drill, box jump, circling the wrestling circles, it was fun. I wish I could do that now.
     
  10. ninjajesus

    ninjajesus Banned Banned

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    What genes determine that?
     
  11. Barut

    Barut Banned Banned

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    I would answer that question, but my dubs prevent it.
     
  12. ChaseT.

    ChaseT. Banned Banned

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    In your case, it's your pair of X chromosomes.
     
  13. Richmond_Hrvat

    Richmond_Hrvat Seauxthern Dead

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    @ Barut: Yeah, as far as power and strength go the football players I've met and know are leaps and bounds ahead of the rugby guys. However, they also gas after 10 minutes and we've got 70 more to go. I think that has something to do with the build of most players below very high levels of competition. Scholarships and "other" motivations certainly are also a factor. Nobody's going to can me at school if I don't play well.

    Also, let's not start a conversation on the obvious implications Barut's dubs have kindly hindered.

    However, Cmart, would you really say that 90% of my potential quickness is completely genetic? If it's that drastic why even work at it? Why can I deadlift 300 more pounds than I could 8 months ago but I can only improve my quickness 10% in a lifetime?
     
  14. Richmond_Hrvat

    Richmond_Hrvat Seauxthern Dead

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    Here are my goals to improving quickness and speed.


    Uphill sprints
    Sled sprints
    Continue Snatching/Cleaning
    Cone/Dot running
    BODYWEIGHT LOSS (I bet you I'd be faster and more agile at 185 than at 205)
     
  15. encore_

    encore_ Banned Banned

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    Rugby is an awesome game.
     
  16. Barut

    Barut Banned Banned

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    Is your BF% above 12 now? If not I wouldn't try to drop 20lbs.
     
  17. Richmond_Hrvat

    Richmond_Hrvat Seauxthern Dead

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    I'm not sure about the exact percentage, and 185 was a throwaway number really, but I could lose some fat to be sure. Shin splints have limited my ability to run in the last two months so I've got some bf.
     
  18. SteMc

    SteMc White Belt

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    yup, plyometrics and pray to god you have fast twitch muscle fibers
     
  19. Richmond_Hrvat

    Richmond_Hrvat Seauxthern Dead

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    Can fast twitch muscle fibers not be built through specific exercise?
     
  20. the_harbinger

    the_harbinger Orange Belt

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    As in...make more? I don't think it has been proven if that is possible yet. However, you can definately develop the fast-twitch fibers you already possess. That is why some people say sprinters are born, not made. They're fast-twitch freaks...and most of their muscle make-up are fast-twitch muscle fibers. To make more, hyperplasmia would have to exist. And, as far as I know, it's still a theory.
     

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