Mayberry-toned MMA Hall of Fame discussion (is it possible here?)

Dan, Don, Ken, Frank, Rand, Roy, Mark, Sak, Fed, Matt

and I'm talking about the beast
 
PolishHeadlock said:
I'll get called a Noob but for me Jones is the GOAT.

I think Fedor having a close fight with Arona is worse than Jones having a close fight with Gus.
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I'm fine with that. My personal disdain for Jones makes me sweat. He's a horrible human being. But his resume is disturbingly good. No one could possibly list Jones outside the top 4 at least.
 
PolishHeadlock said:
I'll get called a Noob but for me Jones is the GOAT.

I think Fedor having a close fight with Arona is worse than Jones having a close fight with Gus.
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in most ppls eyes he lost that fight relative to todays rules but the rules were different for that fight (i think submission attempts> positioning for that fight)
 
is that still around? i thought it died out with boxing
 
HWs:
Fedor
Minotauro
Werdum
Randy
Velasquez
Cigano

OWs:
Sakuraba
Funaki
Ken
Igor
Royce
Rickson
Marco Ruas
Frank Shamrock

LHWs:
Hendo
Wanderlei
Chuck
Tito
Shogun
Machida
Rampage
Jones

MW(s):
Anderson

WWs:
GSP
Hughes

LWs:
BJ
Gomi
Aoki

FWs:
Aldo
Frankie

BWs:
Cruz
Urijah

FLWs:
Mamoru
Urushitani
DJ
BJ
Benavidez


Chicks:
Megumi Fugii
Marloes Coenen
Cris Cyborg
Ronda



work in progress...
 
CoffeeAndBeer said:
HWs:
Fedor
Minotauro
Werdum
Randy
Velasquez
Cigano

OWs:
Sakuraba
Funaki
Ken
Igor
Royce
Rickson
Marco Ruas
Frank Shamrock

LHWs:
Hendo
Wanderlei
Chuck
Tito
Shogun
Machida
Rampage
Jones

MW(s):
Anderson

WWs:
GSP
Hughes

LWs:
BJ
Gomi
Aoki

FWs:
Aldo
Frankie

BWs:
Cruz
Urijah

FLWs:
Mamoru
Urushitani
DJ
BJ
Benavidez


Chicks:
Megumi Fugii
Marloes Coenen
Cris Cyborg
Ronda



work in progress...
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Lol this is an abortion already
 
One thing I find critical in a HOF is a good time delay between retirement and induction. Even just a few years can give fans a better appreciation of whether a fighter was good or great.

Also, it is easy to clutter a HOF with very good athletes. I'm thinking like Andre Reed making the NFL HOF. Only the true greats ought to get in.
 
fluffball said:
Not sure how many people are going to want to debate who the 4th best fly weight of all time is...

Best of all time in any weight class gathers interest....
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That's fair.
I get caught up in the 'if this guy is in, then so is this guy' mindset. But I definitely I can't leave out Mamoru Yamaguchi (1999 debut).
 
IngaVovchanchyn said:
One thing I find critical in a HOF is a good time delay between retirement and induction. Even just a few years can give fans a better appreciation of whether a fighter was good or great.

Also, it is easy to clutter a HOF with very good athletes. I'm thinking like Andre Reed making the NFL HOF. Only the true greats ought to get in.
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That's fine --the delay-- in terms of how the process would actually take place (if there was an MMA HOF).

But it's a bit of a cop-out when it come to simply DECIDING who does/doesn't belong in an MMA HOF based on everything up until THIS POINT in time.

Chris Weidman.... if it's too early to say, then that's a No. If you can't leave him out, then that's a Yes. Forces ya to make the call, as of "today".


P.S.
There is no such thing as the "NFL" HOF. The Pro Football Hall of Fame, however, does exist and it's a non-profit organization, independent of the "NFL."
 
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A lot of you are leaving out Mir at HW and I don't know why. He's an all time great.

Personally I'd put Nick Diaz in at WW too. But I can see the argument against.

Rich Franklin definitely gets in at MW. No doubt about that one.
 
I guess it makes me That Guy, but I pretty much judge a person's depth and longevity of knowledge by where they place Saku on their GOATs list whenever the topic comes up.

People who came after Saku's prime and just see the numbers don't appreciate what it was as like to watch the man fight.

To put this in perspective, Saku was smaller than GSP, and a chubby one at that. In modern terms, he had a LW/WW frame. Saku could nearly have made WW weigh-ins without cutting by refraining from his steady diet of beer and cigarettes and taking a shit before stepping on the scales. Modern LWs walk around and the weight Saku did when he was fighting LHWs and HWs and not just mooks, but LHW and HW champs, former champs, future champs and contenders. Saku regularly gave up 30-50 pounds come fight night and still found ways to win or in the very least, was able to make a competitive match out against top trim fighters 2-3, sometime four weight classes above him.

And that's not even mentioning that Saku is the guy who singlehandedly destroyed the Gracie mystique of unbeatability. It seems funny to think about now, but in the late 90s and early 2000s, Gracies had a virtually unpiercable aura of invincibility. Maybe, if you were incredibly lucky, you could take a decision or knock one out, but submit one or break one? Couldn't be done.

Saku is Saku, and then there is everyone else.
 
Weidman > AS, especially if he wins against Rockhold. So many non-elite fighters on his record making it look better, inc Cot
 
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CoffeeAndBeer said:
That's find --the delay-- in terms of how the process would actually take place (if there was an MMA HOF).

But it's a bit of a cop-out when it come to simply DECIDING who does/doesn't belong in an MMA HOF based on everything up until THIS POINT in time.

Chris Weidman.... if it's too early to say, then that's a No. If you can't leave him out, then that's a Yes. Forces ya to make the call, as of "today".


P.S.
There is no such thing as the "NFL" HOF. The Pro Football Hall of Fame, however, does exist and it's a non-profit organization, independent of the "NFL."
Click to expand...

I've been to the pro football hall of fame many times. It is pretty much the NFL HoF, but yes, having a measure of independence is a good thing.

I'm not sure why it matters that it is a non-profit. The NFL itself is a non-profit as well and has been for decades, though I think they may be dropping that status this year.
 
I'm not listening to anyone under the age of 40, nor should anyone.

You have to take into account the old days of the sport. Not knowing who they were going to fight, unable to gameplan for months. Fighting multiple times in 1 day. Large weight differences. Etc.

Now we have Dana throwing scrubs at champs and calling them a star. If there's not enough time to prepare, the champ might just back out (talking to you JJ). Everyone on that Silva list was billed as a serious threat, but most are scrubs that he had months to prepare for.

I just have more respect for the Sakurabas of the world, who would take all comers. The guy fought 90 minutes against the legend, and in the same night stepped into the ring against Vovchanchyn, a top 3 HW at the time and someone who would put your lights out. And he competed valiantly. Oh yeah and he debunked the Gracie dominance all by himself. Lots of guys could have done it, but he actually managed to get them in the ring.

But noooo he's not on anyone's list. Maybe if Pride manufactured a rivalry between him and Macias, and made 3 more fights, his record would look better.

In general I just hate the weight classes, and the lack of challenges outside of them. The greatest champs are also some of the greatest cutters. They are NEVER the smaller guy, ever. It's just a huge element of fighting that no longer exists outside the HW division anymore.

So for the most part... screw these lists. Screw them in a gentle, loving, Mayberry kind of way. Respect bare knuckle, respect bravery, respect 3 fights in a night, respect not gameplanning for months.
 
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