Social Main purpose of humans is to work

[pugilistico]

A lot of what I'v seen more recently tends to suggest a big factor which drives social evolution isnt how good it is for the lives of those involved(beyond perhaps those at the very top), rather its whether it will be able to sustain a larger population with more power to wage war. People didn't stop being hunter gathers or even nomadic headers because settled agriculture made their lives better, rather agriculture made for larger more powerful cultures which could force the former out or force them to convert themselves.

Yes I do tend to think even if you look at outward traits rather than the underlying dog eat dog nature of our society it is actually very masculine even today. The US culturally I think really remains wedded to the idea of the frontier like hands on man, still really a nation of cowboys and it obviously has a massive influence across the world. I'd say its part of the reason for example why massive SUV's are so popular.

You could look back a bit further and a western gent looked more like...

Totally agree.

I don't think calling for a hypermasculine society is the answer. Some people look at islamic societies as the answer but I found a lot of men from these places to be emotional and child-like because since they never had to be held accountable. They're men so they're automatically treated with more respect. Also remember who colonized who and who still for the most part have more powerful economies and militaries.

I believe societies, just like individuals, need to seek a balance of the masculine and feminine. This another topic, but personally I found that being more attuned to my inner feminine actually gives my masculine side more space to grow.

 

[Vampire life]

“No man is an island “

Ancient Japanese proverb

 

[badascan]

where are they? In the US? I understand some states like texas don't require permits to build.

In the US, yes. There are probably a few places in Montana that don't require permits but most places considered pockets of freedom are just less strict or restrictive.

Looks like this map is outdated but look into the idea

Pockets of Freedom - Pangea Biotecture

pangeabuilders.com

 

[Deleted member 110072]

Purpose is a lie. Do drugs and bang hookers every day.

Which was really Dawkins argument(maybe minus the drugs and the hookers, maybe not) with the selfish gene, the difference between the needs of a biological imperative and a self aware intelligence.

 

[tonil]

Sebastian Junger recently wrote a book on the topic, Freedom, where he states that "if you are alone you die". But life is made so bad by multitudes of people that either death or misery is inexcapable anyways. Just look at how many millions of each other we kill or just how many enemies we make just trying to live our lives, everything from the rivals at work to the neighbors fighting over a foot of space.

Anyway, as proof of his point that "alone=death" he mentions the hermit, Christopher Knight, who lived for a couple decades without human contact. He mentions that the guy had to steal food the whole time to survive. Anyway, I'm so sick of humanity that I hope he's wrong about that.

interesting

 

[tonil]

the overall feminization of men, (not the trannies) is an issue and a problem. Men being raised to be hysterical and go with emotions, be loud, irrational and "bitchy" is the cause of a lot of problems.

very good point

 

[Jackonfire]

“No man is an island “

Ancient Japanese proverb

"He's a peninsula"

Jefferson Airplane 1967.

 

[Vampire life]

I would like to add that war is a necessary part of nature
Even the wildflowers in the fields are at war, for space, sunshine and rain

 

[Thepaintbucket]

You know that fantasy where you can get an average job, work a few years and put a down payment on a piece of land a little outside of the city? Well that's not possible anymore. The cost of land and housing has exponentially increased over the past 20 years and before that, in the 1980s, prices skyrocketed too. That's why there's that 1960s meme where you can find a random job and be able to support a whole family plus a payment on a house.

In the modern age, if you work a corporate job and have a life, you basically silent agree to work for the rest of your life until you can retire with full benefits. The only way around this is to go to the extreme or social media influence

 

[mozfonky]

You know that fantasy where you can get an average job, work a few years and put a down payment on a piece of land a little outside of the city? Well that's not possible anymore. The cost of land and housing has exponentially increased over the past 20 years and before that, in the 1980s, prices skyrocketed too. That's why there's that 1960s meme where you can find a random job and be able to support a whole family plus a payment on a house.

In the modern age, if you work a corporate job and have a life, you basically silent agree to work for the rest of your life until you can retire with full benefits. The only way around this is to go to the extreme or social media influence

that's what they say, I don't know, i've always gotten shitty, low paying jobs. But I do know in the 80's, it was still possible to get 40 hours a week at a factory and some benefits, now, that's less likely. I can only get service type jobs where they give you 20 hours a week because they are worried about you getting benefits. It's totally backwards really. I have a friend who has a pretty cushy job at a local college and he's taken care of pretty much but he's rarely been happy there. I told him it's not worse than my situation but boy is he miserable when I see him.
Some people are really lucky or really smart or really privileged, I can't even tell. I've seen some, on the surface, seemingly unremarkable people get some breaks, and I also know of a guy who was convicted of selling crack, did 14 years in prison, got out, scraped around until he was a millionaire. For whatever reason, I never had a way I could see that could put me in a better position. Part of that is because I threw tons of time away in ventures that really have little shot of success, now, I feel too damned old to do anything. More power to the common man I guess.

 

[mozfonky]

Getting back to our idea of manhood, yes, we do have a lot of macho bullshit in our culture but it's just that, bullshit. Most of the swagger and posturing and the cantankerousness isn't real. If it were, people wouldn't be able to survive in this shit. Sure, you got hotheads in traffic, maybe people that bully their underlings but most people have to suck it up and kiss a lot of ass just to survive. That's not masculine, and in marriages, the docile men I see aren't masculine. The young definitely aren't masculine with their phones glued to their faces all day. My buddy said it best awhile ago, "you think we were retarded, these kids are fucked". And it's true, compared to earlier generations, we were delusional, entitled screwups, that trend has just went way further. Our schools and athletics have done the everyone gets a trophy thing and these kids can't handle it when they find out the real world doesn't work like that. Personally, I don't even know how a lot of people, not just kids, function away from their phones. If they look at their phones like they do in traffic or at the store at work, they'd be fired.

 

[KBE6EKCTAH_CCP]

The path to supporting less work for your average worker is to endorse workers rights, unions, increased minimum wage, paid time off, sick leave, etc. as much as possible. Fantasies about going off the grid are not realistic and do nothing for your fellow worker. Next time you're at the voting booth, vote for the working class candidate. The last 40 years have been nothing but neoliberal policy. It's time to take the workplace back.

Never gonna happen in USA. You have a 2 parties neoliberal duopoly.

 

[KBE6EKCTAH_CCP]

what it basically is, it seems, is giving up a whole lot of your personal choices in life for security. if you don't follow the standard course most do, you will likely end up not as secure as you'd like to feel.

This. Yes modern society is blander than it has ever been, soulless and we were better off 20-30 years ago. But this society affords us security and peace of mind as well as many other things we take for granted until we lose them.

 

[tonil]

I would like to add that war is a necessary part of nature
Even the wildflowers in the fields are at war, for space, sunshine and rain

Its a choice some people make,they dont have to but they do.
Animals do violence with other motives

 

[Thepaintbucket]

that's what they say, I don't know, i've always gotten shitty, low paying jobs. But I do know in the 80's, it was still possible to get 40 hours a week at a factory and some benefits, now, that's less likely. I can only get service type jobs where they give you 20 hours a week because they are worried about you getting benefits. It's totally backwards really. I have a friend who has a pretty cushy job at a local college and he's taken care of pretty much but he's rarely been happy there. I told him it's not worse than my situation but boy is he miserable when I see him.

Some people are really lucky or really smart or really privileged, I can't even tell. I've seen some, on the surface, seemingly unremarkable people get some breaks, and I also know of a guy who was convicted of selling crack, did 14 years in prison, got out, scraped around until he was a millionaire. For whatever reason, I never had a way I could see that could put me in a better position. Part of that is because I threw tons of time away in ventures that really have little shot of success, now, I feel too damned old to do anything. More power to the common man I guess.

Yeah, everything is about saving a penny these days. Prioritizing employee retention is at an all-time low. Nobody wants to train anymore. Nobody wants to offer extra benefits to keep people around. In fact they are hoping you stay merely based on how incredibly difficult it is to find another job. You got to jump through a million hoops for even the shittiest low paying role.

At this point in my life I'm going to have to agree with the notion that some people are born luckier than others. They know people. Their family knows people. Luck and timing is on their side. As far as my journey goes, it's been horrendous with future job prospects.

Right now I got a pretty bearable job. Pay isnt the best but I can breath a little if you guys know what I mean. My slave drivers aren't cracking a whip at me 24/7 under their watchful eye. Just like your friend I'm looking to make a break into the public sector. It's the very last hoorah I got in me. I honestly don't know how people can work in the private sector long term. Having to jump from one job to another every few years to command a bigger pay and role move is stressful

 

[mozfonky]

Yeah, everything is about saving a penny these days. Prioritizing employee retention is at an all-time low. Nobody wants to train anymore. Nobody wants to offer extra benefits to keep people around. In fact they are hoping you stay merely based on how incredibly difficult it is to find another job. You got to jump through a million hoops for even the shittiest low paying role.

At this point in my life I'm going to have to agree with the notion that some people are born luckier than others. They know people. Their family knows people. Luck and timing is on their side. As far as my journey goes, it's been horrendous with future job prospects.

Right now I got a pretty bearable job. Pay isnt the best but I can breath a little if you guys know what I mean. My slave drivers aren't cracking a whip at me 24/7 under their watchful eye. Just like your friend I'm looking to make a break into the public sector. It's the very last hoorah I got in me. I honestly don't know how people can work in the private sector long term. Having to jump from one job to another every few years to command a bigger pay and role move is stressful

we aren't alone, i know that much.

 

[Takes Two To Tango]

Just to survive or to in fact try to thrive in their environment. Our purpose is like any other animals but with more abilities to be more creative and productive.

 

[William Huggins]

Really what I'm talking about would be more the "cult of work", the idea that work in itself is virtuous not that the fruits of work are virtuous, that a farmer who works 50 hours a week but producers the same as a farmer who works 20 hours a week with the same resources is more virtuous.Thats something I think you could argue extends across a lot of the political sphere.

Perhaps more importantly in the modern world we have vast amounts of admin/middle management jobs were its very questionable whether they actually produce anything. The idea basically our economies are not nearly so efficient as we get told, the idea for example that "busy work" exists to keep the population political unengaged and less likely to revolt AND that you end up with a management culture really running things not one maximising profit. The idea of a manager/ceo class who like the idea of having lots of flunkies even if they don't really need them and that this actually becomes a massive part of how economies are organised rather than maximising efficiency.

Nothing like a bit of red tape to double the requirements........

Oh I've worked in industries that get an audit of one or another every month.

 

[Contempt]

In the US, you aren't free to do that. We're all tied to the system. The only way to be off grid without spending and paying is to do it totally under the radar, which probably isn't that easy.

There is literally nothing stopping you from walking off into the woods, hiking far away from other humans and figuring your shit out from there.

No-one can complain about you living in the middle of nowhere when they don't even know your location.

 

[Contempt]

In many parts of Europe it would be illegal to life in the woods outside of society.

Who cares if it's illegal when you are in a forest 100miles from cililisation and no-one knows you're there?

If people want to do it, there's nothing stopping them.