Mahailya Reeves, a 15 year old girl, benched 335 lbs RAW {IMPRESSIVE]

[No Skill Gap]

1. Steroids help you get bigger and stronger, faster.
2. Both observational evidence (comparing records in powerlifters and weightlifters) and experimental evidence suggest that the advantage you get from steroids is quite large in terms of absolute measures (total muscle and strength gained), but that they only confer a ~10% advantage in terms of how competitive you’ll be in strength sports. As you gain more muscle mass, you’re expected to lift more to be equally competitive in your sport. When taking into account both gains in strength and muscle mass, the performance edge they give you is about 10%.
3. Higher doses for longer periods of time don’t seem to provide an increasingly larger advantage. The relative performance improvement in Bashin’s 20-week study was identical to the performance improvement in his 10-week study. Additionally, in his 20-week study, the group using 300mg of Test per week actually improved their Wilks Score more than the group using 600mg of Test per week. Furthermore, in Yu’s study comparing drug-free lifters to lifters who had been using much higher doses for 5+ years, the advantage of steroid use for improving relative performance disappeared entirely, though there were some important drawbacks to that study.
4. The advantage steroids give you is likely larger for tests of upper body strength, such as the bench press. Though Bashin’s 1996 study actually found a larger advantage in the squat than the bench press, the world records in powerlifting, Yu’s study, and insights into the muscle groups most affected by steroid use all seem to suggest that the bench is the lift that benefits the most from steroid use.

10% is pretty massive though. When the margins become thin, razor thin, at the highest levels of competition.

Also just as a tangent, are we counting bodybuilding as a "strength sport"? If so, I would disagree with this notion and say that steroids/PEDs clearly play far more than a ~10% role in increasing "performance" or in this case...aesthetics/size.

The difference between a natural bodybuilder and a juiced/insulin/HGH'd to the gills bodybuilder is stark.

 

[dissectingaorticaneurysm]

10% is pretty massive though. When the margins become thin, razor thin, at the highest levels of competition.

Also just as a tangent, are we counting bodybuilding as a "strength sport"? If so, I would disagree with this notion and say that steroids/PEDs clearly play far more than a ~10% role in increasing "performance" or in this case...aesthetics/size.

The difference between a natural bodybuilder and a juiced/insulin/HGH'd to the gills bodybuilder is stark.

oh, without question natty guys can not hope to compete against enhanced monsters in bodybuilding. Clearly much bigger advantages to roids there. But the gap in powerlifting is smaller than the general public assumes. You've got guys on this forum who think the only thing keeping them from a 700+ lb squat is their compunction to stay natural when they have sub 500 squats.

Gifted natties will always outlift juiced dudes with mediocre genetics- anyone with enough time in gyms can see that.

 

[deadshot138]

oh, without question natty guys can not hope to compete against enhanced monsters in bodybuilding. Clearly much bigger advantages to roids there. But the gap in powerlifting is smaller than the general public assumes. You've got guys on this forum who think the only thing keeping them from a 700+ lb squat is their compunction to stay natural when they have sub 500 squats.

Gifted natties will always outlift juiced dudes with mediocre genetics- anyone with enough time in gyms can see that.

Had this happen at the gym. Was doing max effort floor press and hit 385lbs. This obviously roided dude asked me for a spot on the bench press and I was like "shit he's about to put me to shame." He went on to fail 365lbs and put the weights away dejectedly.

 

[DEVILsSON]

I have witnessed bigger guys on steroids not being particularly strong but that's only because steroids are not a magic pill that makes one world class strong and big overnight.

Records from the 1940s and 1950s are a good indicator of natural strength possibilities.

https://www.neckberg.com/power-lifting-1940

 

[saffo]

oh, without question natty guys can not hope to compete against enhanced monsters in bodybuilding. Clearly much bigger advantages to roids there. But the gap in powerlifting is smaller than the general public assumes. You've got guys on this forum who think the only thing keeping them from a 700+ lb squat is their compunction to stay natural when they have sub 500 squats.

Gifted natties will always outlift juiced dudes with mediocre genetics- anyone with enough time in gyms can see that.

What about some 22 year old that does 300~kg DL 300~kg squat and 200~kg bench? Does a natty need time or did some mythical being put you on this planet for this purpose to be able to lift those weigths at that age?

 

[dissectingaorticaneurysm]

What about some 22 year old that does 300~kg DL 300~kg squat and 200~kg bench? Does a natty need time or did some mythical being put you on this planet for this purpose to be able to lift those weigths at that age?

If they're big enough I don't see why it's suspect. Carl Yngvar Christensen had an 1175 total at a younger age than that in a drugtested fed.

 

[saffo]

If they're big enough I don't see why it's suspect. Carl Yngvar Christensen had an 1175 total at a younger age than that in a drugtested fed.

I dont suspect fast but if you are pulling numbers close to franco columbo at a young age then i do. Beating a powerlift drugtest is not a big deal i have heard of actual roiders competing in tested competitions in holland. Sometimes you only need to fill out a paper that you are a natty king and then you are set.

Look up candito he is natural and very strong with very good genes.

 

[JimRussel]

If they're big enough I don't see why it's suspect. Carl Yngvar Christensen had an 1175 total at a younger age than that in a drugtested fed.

CYC was an incredible talent, but you have to mention that that total was single ply.

 

[dissectingaorticaneurysm]

CYC was an incredible talent, but you have to mention that that total was single ply.

still would have destroyed those hypothetical numbers proposed in that post regardless of equipment.

 

[boingyman]

What about some 22 year old that does 300~kg DL 300~kg squat and 200~kg bench? Does a natty need time or did some mythical being put you on this planet for this purpose to be able to lift those weigths at that age?

There are some freaks that can pull it off that have been training since a young age. Look at Ashton Rouska. He put up bigger numbers then that at age 21 in a USAPL meet. I truly believe he is natty. He is basically a Jesse Norris 2.0.

 

[dissectingaorticaneurysm]

There are some freaks that can pull it off that have been training since a young age. Look at Ashton Rouska. He put up bigger numbers then that at age 21 in a USAPL meet. I truly believe he is natty. He is basically a Jesse Norris 2.0.

lol, pulls 8 plates at 18 at 205. Ridiculous. And he's even stronger now. I don't share your belief in his natty status, but he's a monster talent regardless.

 

[JimRussel]

still would have destroyed those hypothetical numbers proposed in that post regardless of equipment.

Yes, as a 375 lb elite level powerlifter, I’d hope so.