Let's talk about Corporal Upham from Saving Private Ryan

[IIIIIIII]

upham was a bit of everything described by the threadstarter. he did not have the same mindset as most of the soldiers. or he at least did not react in the same manner as most of the soldiers. his occupation was a translator, if i remember correctly.

it seemed that he retained innocence when he argued against not killing the german who they initially had digging his own grave. i don't think he quite understood the gravity of war at that time. when his fellow solider was hand-fighting for his life, i think he simply froze by the shock of witnessing death up close and personal, and in having to actually kill someone. so he did nothing. it was not until he felt betrayed by the german solider he convinced the captain to help save, that he finally understood the morality of war, and how there are no morals in war. it is utter hell, and you have to set aside your personal morals, and he shot the german who had betrayed his kindness.

it's a great movie. it's EXTREMELY one-sided, but it's an american film directed by steven spielberg. i'm not surprised.

a great world war II movie that i recommend to everyone is called generation war: our mothers, our fathers. it's from the perspective of the germans on eastern front as they march towards the soviet union. you don't get a chance to see the war from a german's perspective often, and i think it was fair on the russians as well.

 

[Hyperglide]

He represents the fear that soldiers go through during shellshock. Not all soldiers were brave, upstanding, moral and ethical. They were humans with real life flaws. Upham was just one of many archetypes represented in the movie. At least he had an arc though. Dude finally nutted up at the end. It's a shame he didn't do it earlier but then he wouldn't be as memorable. He didn't act when he needed to at the guy getting stabbed but he acted in the end. Good character arc.

Not every soldier is going to be a cold blooded killer like Joker in Saving Private Ryan. A good movie but pretty cliched in it's own right about how soldiers are perceived in war.

 

[Dsingleton7]

I know I am super late, but op is wrong they were the same guy, the SS soldier calls upham by name right before he is killed by him. How else would he know his name...

 

[J. Bernie Cunningham]

He was probably worried about finding the island and his mom.

 

[SoberAwakening]

I hate him. I hate that scene.

However, I've been reading a lot of military history books told by guys who were actually in wars. Being a coward was not uncommon when bullets started flying. A common theme I've noticed in the books I'm reading is that usually the loudest most alpha guy on the team is the one who does the most cowardly acts. It's not the quiet, low key guy like in this movie. I found that to be very interesting. It honestly makes one think. What did the guy writing this book really do to survive?

 

[Stargazer Rex]

If he was Marine he would of did his damn job.

 

[mushishi]

Bitch made.

 

[Easy The Great]

He deserved to die too. Fuck that guy

 

[Aegon Spengler]

I was the same. I think I lost a 'Gentleman's bet' when debating a friend about Upham and I thought that knife guy was the same person. Its not and im not sure if the confusion was on purpose. Both actors look similar, both have scenes with Upham, both have shaved heads and no helmet.

The guy knew uphams name and said it before he shot him

 

[TheRuthlessOne]

I would have killed upham myself

Fuck that guy

 

[FyrFytr998]

So I guess guys in this thread won't be seeing Hacksaw Ridge?

 

[mushishi]

So I guess guys in this thread won't be seeing Hacksaw Ridge?

Not going to pay for it, but I'll watch it on netflix or something. Different motivation. One was cowardly, the other based on principle.

 

[Aegon Spengler]

I liked him. He spoke German and chatted with the captain.

 

[Pugilistic]

Upham is you. The regular viewer. The masses who are used to seeing war tidy and clean on TV. Seeing war and death from a distance and getting all uppity and trying to take the moral highground when it's easy. Trying to be the voice of reason when real soldiers are angry and emotional over their buddy who got killed.
I think Spielberg was trying to make a point in the machine scene (where the medic got killed and Willie got captured) by shooting the action sequence entirely from Upham's point of view, which was from a distance with the scope, which also made the action much less impersonal. His first experience with combat, and he sees it from a distance, engaged by combatants he just met and had no real personal connection with yet, so of course it's easier for him to take the moral high ground and not get pissed at the German who just killed one of their team members.

 

[Jermei]

Upham is you. The regular viewer. The masses who are used to seeing war tidy and clean on TV. Seeing war and death from a distance and getting all uppity and trying to take the moral highground when it's easy. Trying to be the voice of reason when real soldiers are angry and emotional over their buddy who got killed.
I think Spielberg was trying to make a point in the machine scene (where the medic got killed and Willie got captured) by shooting the action sequence entirely from Upham's point of view, which was from a distance with the scope, which also made the action much less impersonal. His first experience with combat, and he sees it from a distance, engaged by combatants he just met and had no real personal connection with yet, so of course it's easier for him to take the moral high ground and not get pissed at the German who just killed one of their team members.

I never really thought about that fight scene like that... as in viewing war from a distance from his first pov... the audience already went up the beach in the first 30 mins so we're almost ready for anything after that. Had Upham fought up the beach he may not have hesitated to allow Willie to die but he didn't, and even after his first witness to war from a distance he hadn't really experienced war or how brutal it is. Even the battle of the bridge he's protected and sheltered from war up until the knife guy kills his friend in cold blood. Upham wasn't ready and perhaps a coward in that moment frozen with fear.

 

[Jermei]

This thread:

Replies: 75
Views: 8,783

Interesting. Buncha lurkers been reading this one.

 

[gspieler]

I always considered him a coward, and maybe he was. But he was also unwillingly thrust into a situation that was clearly beyond his capabilities and comprehension. It's also worth noting that he was a desk jockey and that this was his first combat experience, while the others were already war-hardened men. Ultimately, I think he was just meant to be a symbol of the ambiguity of war, but idk.

 

[The Echo]

I know I am super late, but op is wrong they were the same guy, the SS soldier calls upham by name right before he is killed by him. How else would he know his name...

It's not the same guy. The guy that killed Mellish was SS. Steamboat Willie was Wehrmacht. Their uniforms are completely different. Their haircuts are different as well. They were two different Germans that happened to look similar.

It's a detail not noticed by the vast majority of viewers (unless you happen to be military history buff like myself) so it's a common misunderstanding about the movie.

 

[Jermei]

It's not the same guy. The guy that killed Mellish was SS. Steamboat Willie was Wehrmacht. Their uniforms are completely different. Their haircuts are different as well. They were two different Germans that happened to look similar.

It's a detail not noticed by the vast majority of viewers (unless you happen to be military history buff like myself) so it's a common misunderstanding about the movie.

Movie is 18 years old and people are still only learning this... it really is a tough one to spot and I found out my accident, wasn't even trying to figure that out.

 

[applesbananas]

Anyone who doesn't think hes a coward is basically a giant pussy