Kyokushin Influences in Dutch Kickboxing

Bang Rachan said:
Hearing him say that is interesting and makes a lot of sense. I'd like to train at all of the gyms especailly FFC, Mikes and Vos.

I had a friend that trained in Mejiro gym for a bit and he said it was really good and the standards are high
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I was originally looking for Golden Glory, however it made (what I think is a bad) decision of changing its name to Hemmers Gym, which I thought was kind of bad marketing, seeing as I couldn't even find it for the longest of times until it got mentioned during a Glory PPV (if I remember rightly).

So in that time I settled for Mejiro because... Rob Kaman and Andy Souwer.
I would like to train with Lucien Carbin for sure though, and ideally I'd like to do a lot of training in Thailand (I feel confident enough in my boxing that now I'm training kicks and clinch work far more, I've got a real liking for the traditional Thai style, I've been trying to emulate that to encourage myself to throwing more kicks)
 
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Not a dutch kickboxer but he is a kyokushin guy and I like his combinations
 
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Interesting breakdown by AcumenAthletics.

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This fight, while a little lacklustre in my opinion shows similar knees on display to what we see in the video, quicker and less driving than Muay Thai knees strikes.

Any other examples of kickers throwing these "cheerleader kick" as this video humorously puts it. It doesn't seem to be the default manner of kicking for them but it is certainly an interesting variation worth considering.

-EDITED THIS AFTER NIDNOI DECIDED TO NOT USE HIS BRAIN AND POST ANOTHER RESPONSE-
Admittedly though with this being said, despite our resident troll coming and spouting his mongoloid dribble every now and again, I think its important to note that just because dutch kickboxing is influenced by kyokushin, it's really not kyokushin, there are lots of things taken from it and there is very clear influence, but the style does have as much in common with muay thai as it does with kyokushin, and this should be pretty obvious.
 
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LOL Thai never claims that dutch kickboxing is muay thai.
 
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i see Dutch kickboxing more of a hybrid of boxing stance and muay thai techniques. what infuences did karate take?

Look at modern dutch muay thai fighters like nieky holzken or robin van roosmalen. They all started in muay thai and dont use any karate techniques nor did they do any karate. look up their first fights,. And what about ramon dekkers? He never did anything else but muay thai.
 
Jubin Alikhanian said:
i see Dutch kickboxing more of a hybrid of boxing stance and muay thai techniques. what infuences did karate take?

Look at modern dutch muay thai fighters like nieky holzken or robin van roosmalen. They all started in muay thai and dont use any karate techniques nor did they do any karate. look up their first fights,. And what about ramon dekkers? He never did anything else but muay thai.
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Well the origin of dutch KB were originally Kyokushin practitioners that eventually took up MT and boxing; Regardless Kyokushin was still their base. Its similar to guys that are BJJers that take up wrestling.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramon_Dekkers

After half a year Dekkers started practicing Muay Thai under Cor Hemmers
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cor_Hemmers

Hemmers began his martial arts training in judo at the age of 6, which he studied until the age of 15 when he switched to Kyokushin Karate. In 1976, Hemmers began competing in full contact karate. During the 1980s, however, kickboxing became more popular in the Netherlands and Hemmers took this up. His professional kickboxing record was 25 wins, 3 losses and 1 draw.[1]

In 1984, he opened his own gym called Maeng Ho and he later became the head trainer at the Golden Glory gym. He has trained numerous world champions and contenders in both kickboxing and mixed martial artsincluding Ramon Dekkers, Heath Herring, Stefan Leko, Alistair Overeem, Bas Rutten, Gökhan Saki and Semmy Schilt
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Sounds similar to what I mentioned above.

Also, plenty of people compete under Muay Thai rules (more open) and can still win, but doesn't mean their style is MT. We see this all the time when MMA competitors compete in MT tournaments/fights on the side to get exp. in striking. Sometimes the techniques from some of those fights, I can't really say is MT.

If you are in a Muay Thai gym and do not have advanced knowledge on clinching, do not use teeps as a jab/measuring stick, its not MT, the gym is MT in name, but not stylistically. Also, the DKB stance is more similar to the Kyokushin one than a MT one (heavy lead leg 80:20 ratio)
 
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j123 said:
Well the origin of dutch KB were originally Kyokushin practitioners that eventually took up MT and boxing; Regardless Kyokushin was still their base. Its similar to guys that are BJJers that take up wrestling.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramon_Dekkers



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cor_Hemmers



Sounds similar to what I mentioned above.

Also, plenty of people compete under Muay Thai rules (more open) and can still win, but doesn't mean their style is MT. We see this all the time when MMA competitors compete in MT tournaments/fights on the side to get exp. in striking. Sometimes the techniques from some of those fights, I can't really say iss MT.

If you are in a Muay Thai gym and do not have advanced knowledge on clinching, do not use teeps as a jab/measuring stick, its not MT, the gym is MT in name, but not stylistically. Also, the DKB stance is more similar to the Kyokushin one than a MT one (heavy lead leg 80:20 ratio)
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do you know any karate techniques used in modern dutch kickboxing? because to it honestly looks like muay thai mixed with the stance and rhythm from boxing. And again nieky holzken for example has a base of muay thai. his first fights were actually muay thai fights.
 
Jubin Alikhanian said:
do you know any karate techniques used in modern dutch kickboxing? because to it honestly looks like muay thai mixed with the stance and rhythm from boxing. And again nieky holzken for example has a base of muay thai. his first fights were actually muay thai fights.
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Bas told me he got all his kicks from kyokushin.
 
Jimmy H said:
Bas told me he got all his kicks from kyokushin.
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i believe you. he did karate for a while before he began kickboxing i think . but dont you think he is more of an exception as far as classic dutch kickboxers go? because the most of the dutch fighters i know (Nieky holzken, murthel groenhart, van roosmalen) started in muay thai and even their first fights were in thaiboxing...
iam curious though did you ask him (Bas) personally?
 
Jubin Alikhanian said:
i believe you. he did karate for a while before he began kickboxing i think . but dont you think he is more of an exception as far as classic dutch kickboxers go? because the most of the dutch fighters i know (Nieky holzken, murthel groenhart, van roosmalen) started in muay thai and even their first fights were in thaiboxing...
iam curious though did you ask him (Bas) personally?
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yeah it was a while ago on his facebook or twitter. I dont know you could be right. I dont see many thais leg kick so much like dutch or kyokushin guys do.
 
Jimmy H said:
yeah it was a while ago on his facebook or twitter. I dont know you could be right. I dont see many thais leg kick so much like dutch or kyokushin guys do.
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cool :) i just thought of something guys like joe schilling, simon marcus, joseph valtelini, Aleksandr Stetcuerenko are not dutch but all did muay thai but fight very similary to the dutch kickboxers in glory (please correct me if iam wrong). i guess you can call that "western muay thai" or something because in most of the western muay thai gyms in the west they teach you a different stance than the traditional one and put more emphasis on boxing. Even in my gym in germany.
 
Jubin Alikhanian said:
cool :) i just thought of something guys like joe schilling, simon marcus, joseph valtelini, Aleksandr Stetcuerenko are not dutch but all did muay thai but fight very similary to the dutch kickboxers in glory (please correct me if iam wrong). i guess you can call that "western muay thai" or something because in most of the western muay thai gyms in the west they teach you a different stance than the traditional one and put more emphasis on boxing. Even in my gym in germany.
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lol yeah I know man, Bas is the man! yeah I wonder how many of those western muay thai guys are doing dutch style kickboxing or the traditional thai style. like you said, they stance differently. Maybe it is the rule set. Its hard for me to describe the traditional thai style. They seem less forward and less weight on their feet.
 
Jimmy H said:
lol yeah I know man, Bas is the man! yeah I wonder how many of those western muay thai guys are doing dutch style kickboxing or the traditional thai style. like you said, they stance differently. Maybe it is the rule set. Its hard for me to describe the traditional thai style. They seem less forward and less weight on their feet.
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http://www.muaythaischolar.com/best-muay-thai-stance/

apparently muay thai has much more stances than i thought XD i think that the western muay thai guys and maybe even the dutch guys use something close to the "balanced (Narrow)" stance. i have seen a few thais use it too when they are on the attack. have you heard of "caged muay thai" ? the thing is it is a full muay thai ruleset , yet the fighters often are in the "balanced" stance and not in the typical one where they bounce the front foot. the traditional style has about 30% in the front and 70% in the back. but even the article mentioned that the stance is fading since boxing is becoming more relevant in muay thai and the direction is going towards the balanced stance
 
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