Karate blackbelts in MMA

Does Raymond Daniels count?

Raymond Daniels, 6th degree American Kenpo and 6th degree Shotokan, 0-1 in MMA

Kizaemon Saiga, Shin-Karate, 2-2 in MMA
 
Hagelslag2 said:
Does Raymond Daniels count?

Raymond Daniels, 6th degree American Kenpo and 6th degree Shotokan, 0-1 in MMA

Kizaemon Saiga, Shin-Karate, 2-2 in MMA
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Thanks, I do know Raymond Daniels and I watched his MMA debut (and was disappointed). However, for this list I wanted to focus on fighters with at least a few MMA fights on their record and more wins than losses...

I mean, there's a ton of Karate guys with 0-1 or 1-1 MMA records who just gave it a try for fun but what's the point of listing them when there's already a 100+ guys who actually did pretty well? :D

Yes, I am biased! :p
 
Hotora86 said:
Thanks, I do know Raymond Daniels and I watched his MMA debut (and was disappointed). However, for this list I wanted to focus on fighters with at least a few MMA fights on their record and more wins than losses...

I mean, there's a ton of Karate guys with 0-1 or 1-1 MMA records who just gave it a try for fun but what's the point of listing them when there's already a 100+ guys who actually did pretty well? :D

Yes, I am biased! :p
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It barely was MMA what he was doing. Maybe the term 'ragdoll' was more applicable.
 
Hagelslag2 said:
It barely was MMA what he was doing. Maybe the term 'ragdoll' was more applicable.
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Well... yes. More or less my point - he doesn't belong on this list, blackbelt or no blackbelt.
 
Hotora86 said:
Hi Azam, glad to be back and glad to speak to you again. :)

Thanks for that, never heard about Hisaki Kato before but looks like he's at the very least super entertaining - 8 fights / 8 KOs! :D



Dude knows how to punch for sure!
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I think Kato just got KO'd in the last Bellator. Check my claim, I thought he lost recently. But still Kudo is an up and coming style that is more complete than Kyokushin because it trains and utilizes in FC sparring all aspects of striking throwing and grappling.
 
Hotora86 said:
Why so?
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Because of the sheer level of dedication needed to attain one. You have to achieved the age of 5 years old and at least 6 months of training 4 hours per week.
 
MrJak said:
Because of the sheer level of dedication needed to attain one. You have to achieved the age of 5 years old and at least 6 months of training 4 hours per week.
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ok... sounds like the pinnacle of McDojoism.
Besides, we're talking Karate here, not TKD.
 
Hotora86 said:
Looking at Wiki and Sherdog, he WON his last bout in October by TKO!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hisaki_Kato#Mixed_martial_arts_record
http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Hisaki-Kato-125695
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Hotora86 said:
Looking at Wiki and Sherdog, he WON his last bout in October by TKO!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hisaki_Kato#Mixed_martial_arts_record
http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Hisaki-Kato-125695
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The loss Jak is probably talking about is the one against Manhoef.

I watched the fight - Kato was pretty much dominating against Manhoef until he got KO'd.

He made a mistake - got to overconfident & aggressive because he had the beating of Manhoef and opened himself up to a cornered manhoef which is like leaving yourself open to a cornered bear.

9 times out of 10 I think if Kato fights smart he wins that fight. Sometimes he has a really bad habit of getting over-aggressive when he's got the beating of someone - I think that it's a side effect from Kudo competition because the round format is 3 mins - and it encourages you to finish an opponent (so you don't go for extensions). Great for self-defence - not so great in MMA against other trained fighters because it will leave you open - especially against seasoned guys like Manhoef who's probably been put in that situation many times before and knows what to do.
 
CFGroup said:
I think Kato just got KO'd in the last Bellator. Check my claim, I thought he lost recently. But still Kudo is an up and coming style that is more complete than Kyokushin because it trains and utilizes in FC sparring all aspects of striking throwing and grappling.
Click to expand...

The thing I really like about Kudo since starting it nearly a year ago is that there's a lot of different techniques floating about - there's this misconception that Kudo is Kyokushin & Judo. In reality though it isn't - it's dependent on the background of the instructor. Most instructors aren't from Kyokushin backgrounds (at least in the UK though they do have connections with other Kyokushin instructors)- a lot of instructors have varying backgrounds though - some have Shotokan, Goju, TKD or Muay Thai backgrounds. The only thing that is true for Kudo is that the grappling is mainly Judo and the core of the techniques are from Karate.

It's great though because you have so many styles influences in Kudo - you learn different ways of doing things and especially in sparring it's really beneficial because you have such a wide mix of people of different striking backgrounds to spar with. I mean I don't have to say what a benefit that is to spar with people from different backgrounds on a regular basis. Sparring is a bit different though - it's not a technical back/forth because Kudo rounds are 3mins & scored on putting down an opponent, so it's geared towards self defence more than competition.

I heard one of our instructors say that during a competition a while back Takashi Azuma was present and both of the competitors went straight for the submissions - apparently he stopped the fight & had both of them disqualified and told them that Kudo was 75% standup, 25% ground - and the ideal was to be realistic & self defence orientated - to compound the self defence aspect of Kudo.

But I would call Kudo - predominantly Karate & Judo because the structure of the training, spirit, discipline and the most stylistic influence is Karate - I mean we wear a gi and most of the stand up techniques are. Most of the people I've come across have shotokan/goju backgrounds/influences in the UK - I think the same can be said for Europe.
 
Azam said:
The thing I really like about Kudo since starting it nearly a year ago is that there's a lot of different techniques floating about - there's this misconception that Kudo is Kyokushin & Judo. In reality though it isn't - it's dependent on the background of the instructor. Most instructors aren't from Kyokushin backgrounds (at least in the UK though they do have connections with other Kyokushin instructors)- a lot of instructors have varying backgrounds though - some have Shotokan, Goju, TKD or Muay Thai backgrounds. The only thing that is true for Kudo is that the grappling is mainly Judo and the core of the techniques are from Karate.

It's great though because you have so many styles influences in Kudo - you learn different ways of doing things and especially in sparring it's really beneficial because you have such a wide mix of people of different striking backgrounds to spar with. I mean I don't have to say what a benefit that is to spar with people from different backgrounds on a regular basis. Sparring is a bit different though - it's not a technical back/forth because Kudo rounds are 3mins & scored on putting down an opponent, so it's geared towards self defence more than competition.

I heard one of our instructors say that during a competition a while back Takashi Azuma was present and both of the competitors went straight for the submissions - apparently he stopped the fight & had both of them disqualified and told them that Kudo was 75% standup, 25% ground - and the ideal was to be realistic & self defence orientated - to compound the self defence aspect of Kudo.

But I would call Kudo - predominantly Karate & Judo because the structure of the training, spirit, discipline and the most stylistic influence is Karate - I mean we wear a gi and most of the stand up techniques are. Most of the people I've come across have shotokan/goju backgrounds/influences in the UK - I think the same can be said for Europe.
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Thanks for this interesting insight, Azam! Are there any videos of Kudo guys from a Shotokan background competing? I am very curious as to how that looks like.
 
Azam said:
The thing I really like about Kudo since starting it nearly a year ago is that there's a lot of different techniques floating about - there's this misconception that Kudo is Kyokushin & Judo. In reality though it isn't - it's dependent on the background of the instructor. Most instructors aren't from Kyokushin backgrounds (at least in the UK though they do have connections with other Kyokushin instructors)- a lot of instructors have varying backgrounds though - some have Shotokan, Goju, TKD or Muay Thai backgrounds. The only thing that is true for Kudo is that the grappling is mainly Judo and the core of the techniques are from Karate.

It's great though because you have so many styles influences in Kudo - you learn different ways of doing things and especially in sparring it's really beneficial because you have such a wide mix of people of different striking backgrounds to spar with. I mean I don't have to say what a benefit that is to spar with people from different backgrounds on a regular basis. Sparring is a bit different though - it's not a technical back/forth because Kudo rounds are 3mins & scored on putting down an opponent, so it's geared towards self defence more than competition.

I heard one of our instructors say that during a competition a while back Takashi Azuma was present and both of the competitors went straight for the submissions - apparently he stopped the fight & had both of them disqualified and told them that Kudo was 75% standup, 25% ground - and the ideal was to be realistic & self defence orientated - to compound the self defence aspect of Kudo.

But I would call Kudo - predominantly Karate & Judo because the structure of the training, spirit, discipline and the most stylistic influence is Karate - I mean we wear a gi and most of the stand up techniques are. Most of the people I've come across have shotokan/goju backgrounds/influences in the UK - I think the same can be said for Europe.
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I trained with a 13 year USMC vet who was stationed in Okinawa for 8 years. He has 7 years of GoJu and Okinawan Kempo which I guess you would call Karate but looks nothing like the "western" Karate. The drills Dave emphasis along with the forms and short solo combination drills is 2 person Bunkai standing grappling. Short waist high front kicks to displace balance and attack vitals, while finding forearm grip to lock or pull your partner into a strike. Kinda sparring in a phone booth.

From that perspective Kudo seems much more fluid and open because if I'm not mistaken the majority of training is geared to be utilized in sparring? Seems like it more closely replicates the full spectrum of techniques from Martial tradition in as you said above Azuma Sensei told those competitors it's 75% standing which seems like the effective balance in a well rounded discipline.

I wish there was a Kudo Dojo near me(closest is 3hrs away), cause it seems like it has it all.
 
Azam said:
The loss Jak is probably talking about is the one against Manhoef.

I watched the fight - Kato was pretty much dominating against Manhoef until he got KO'd.

He made a mistake - got to overconfident & aggressive because he had the beating of Manhoef and opened himself up to a cornered manhoef which is like leaving yourself open to a cornered bear.

9 times out of 10 I think if Kato fights smart he wins that fight. Sometimes he has a really bad habit of getting over-aggressive when he's got the beating of someone - I think that it's a side effect from Kudo competition because the round format is 3 mins - and it encourages you to finish an opponent (so you don't go for extensions). Great for self-defence - not so great in MMA against other trained fighters because it will leave you open - especially against seasoned guys like Manhoef who's probably been put in that situation many times before and knows what to do.
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Yeah, I had the wrong fight....Wow Kato got rocked in the Matthews fight early. Matthews did what you said Kato should have done in the Manhoef fight and backed off instead of swarming when he had Kato hurt. The eye poke stoppage definitely helped Kato regroup cause he came back sharp. That was great how he kept going for the rib left RH pattern, to get Matthews to instinctively defend and then came over the top.

I was almost wishing Kato would use some grappling, but I'm watching to much MMA and remembered all he has to do is control him on the ground to maintain dominant position. It would be cool to see Kato against a opponent who's primarily a grappler, to see how he uses control against someone who's adept at snarling strikers up.
 
Hotora86 said:
Thanks for this interesting insight, Azam! Are there any videos of Kudo guys from a Shotokan background competing? I am very curious as to how that looks like.
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I've seen a few guys with a shotokan background - can't recall names of the top of my head though some have competed in our dojo with shotokan backgrounds. My instructor was a shotokan national champ (so a lot of his original students are very shotokan-ish) - so I've seen what it's like first hand.

Tkd & Sambo are also quite prevalent in Kudo especially in Russia - most of the successful competitors have backgrounds in either sambo or tkd or sanshou. I can give names here of the top of my head because I can recall them - Adam Khaliev who is a Kudo 2x world champ and currently with the UFC actually has a tkd background prior to joining Kudo and the way he fights in Kudo you can see the tkd influences:




A sambo guy in Kudo of the top of my head is Alexei Kononenko - who I know off because I'm suscribed to his youtube channel where he demonstrates his kudo/sambo techniques. He was a very successful kudo fighter as well - multiple all japan champ & world tournament runner-up twice. You can check out his stuff on his channel - I really like it:

 
CFGroup said:
I trained with a 13 year USMC vet who was stationed in Okinawa for 8 years. He has 7 years of GoJu and Okinawan Kempo which I guess you would call Karate but looks nothing like the "western" Karate. The drills Dave emphasis along with the forms and short solo combination drills is 2 person Bunkai standing grappling. Short waist high front kicks to displace balance and attack vitals, while finding forearm grip to lock or pull your partner into a strike. Kinda sparring in a phone booth.

From that perspective Kudo seems much more fluid and open because if I'm not mistaken the majority of training is geared to be utilized in sparring? Seems like it more closely replicates the full spectrum of techniques from Martial tradition in as you said above Azuma Sensei told those competitors it's 75% standing which seems like the effective balance in a well rounded discipline.

I wish there was a Kudo Dojo near me(closest is 3hrs away), cause it seems like it has it all.
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From what I've seen in multiple documentaries and heard in stories this is often the case - "western" Karate blackbelts travel to Okinawa and are shocked by how different Okinawan Karate is, with its standup grappling and no-BS approach to self defense.

I think Iain Abernethy is one of the very few western Karate teachers who actually embraces these traditional concepts but trains them in a modern way (drills, pads, bags etc.) to ensure effectiveness. Wish I could train with him.
 
Azam said:
I've seen a few guys with a shotokan background - can't recall names of the top of my head though some have competed in our dojo with shotokan backgrounds. My instructor was a shotokan national champ (so a lot of his original students are very shotokan-ish) - so I've seen what it's like first hand.

Tkd & Sambo are also quite prevalent in Kudo especially in Russia - most of the successful competitors have backgrounds in either sambo or tkd or sanshou. I can give names here of the top of my head because I can recall them - Adam Khaliev who is a Kudo 2x world champ and currently with the UFC actually has a tkd background prior to joining Kudo and the way he fights in Kudo you can see the tkd influences:




A sambo guy in Kudo of the top of my head is Alexei Kononenko - who I know off because I'm suscribed to his youtube channel where he demonstrates his kudo/sambo techniques. He was a very successful kudo fighter as well - multiple all japan champ & world tournament runner-up twice. You can check out his stuff on his channel - I really like it:

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Wow, this is awesome stuff, Azam!
Love the Adam Khaliev highlight, hope he does as spectacular in the UFC. I'll add him to the list too. :)

WIKI (ru): https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/Халиев,_Адам_Сираждиевич

UFC: http://www.ufc.com/fighter/Adam-Khaliev?id=

SD: http://www.sherdog.com/fighter/Adam-Khaliev-85510
 
NEW FIGHTER ADDED !!!

Jerome Le Banner - black belt in Kyokushin Karate. He may not have the most impressive MMA record but it would be a shame to leave out such a magnificent striker!

NAME: Jerome Le Banner
COUNTRY: France
STYLE: Kyokushin Karate
RANK: Black belt
RECORD: 3-2
WIKI: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jérôme_Le_Banner

 
JLB has never trained for his black belt in kyokushin. He was given it by Bluming, who handed black belts out as candy to anyone he knew who was successful in combat sports. It is a honorary belt in all but name.
 
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