Josh koscheck vs colby convington

[dipstickjimmy]

Ass kicked by Tony? 48-47 is an ass kicking now?

And you just named all grapplers, and Edwards who is significantly better than all of them, that beat him at WW. Now please tell me which one of those WW's from 2010 are going to out grapple RDA?

And if you don't know what a big win is, then I don't know what to tell you. Paulo Thiago has the biggest win against a guy who is severely overrated himself. The other 3 beat nobody of relevance at that point in their careers.

Again subjective responses.
"If you don't know then I won't tell you."
That biggest win is a guy who is over rated.
Dismissive statements don't prove your point. Kampmann may not out grapple RDA because he would KO him or keep it standing. Not sure you realize Kampmann was a MW where as RDA was a LW. All of those guys are big enough to keep RDA standing.

Tony outstruck him 200-126.
RDA won the 1st and 3rd which were two close rounds where he outstruck Tony in the 1st 25-22 and was outstruck 44-30 in the 3rd.

Tony won the 2nd outstriking him 50-19, the 4th 40-21 & the 5th 43-26. That is as dominating as a 48-47 can get.

When you say they beat nobody of relevance that is subjective but they didn't have Twitter and the Gram and followers back then. Fighters are measured by their records and those guys were fighting the top comp available. You have also picked the 3 or 4 lowest ranked guys and yet Masvidal is the number 1 contender, Nate Diaz is ranked #9 (and a LW). having a bias is OK but having no ability to make any reasonable argument to back it up is tired.

 

[dipstickjimmy]

True but when these guys were knocking for a title shot ... GSP ran and retired.


GSP could have fought them. He choose not to after Hendricks and USADA.

Fought who??? Who was on the cusp of a title shot in 2013 when GSP left that is a top WW today? Was Usman or Colby even fighting yet? Edwards would have been a baby almost. Who in the current UFC top 10 did GSP not give a deserved title shot?

 

[Mike]

Fought who??? Who was on the cusp of a title shot in 2013 when GSP left that is a top WW today? Was Usman or Colby even fighting yet? Edwards would have been a baby almost. Who in the current UFC top 10 did GSP not give a deserved title shot?

Absolutely nobody. People bring up these names but as you said many of them like Woodley couldn't earn a shot at the time. So instead gsp beat the guys that beat them.

 

[Mamou]

It's funny that of the four you mentioned, only Hardy got to fight GSP. The others couldn't cut it. They were good, but gatekeepers.

Hardy had his title shot based on GSP going through everybody else in the division. It's like Silva fighting Leites or Mighty Mouse having to get a TUF winner to fight.

You just proved my point. WW has so many competitors thats theres a constant influx of new peoples in the rankings. Thanks.

So Jon Fitch held that #2 by beating unranked guys then, correct?

 

[Mamou]

Again subjective responses.
"If you don't know then I won't tell you."
That biggest win is a guy who is over rated.
Dismissive statements don't prove your point. Kampmann may not out grapple RDA because he would KO him or keep it standing. Not sure you realize Kampmann was a MW where as RDA was a LW. All of those guys are big enough to keep RDA standing.

Tony outstruck him 200-126.
RDA won the 1st and 3rd which were two close rounds where he outstruck Tony in the 1st 25-22 and was outstruck 44-30 in the 3rd.

Tony won the 2nd outstriking him 50-19, the 4th 40-21 & the 5th 43-26. That is as dominating as a 48-47 can get.

When you say they beat nobody of relevance that is subjective but they didn't have Twitter and the Gram and followers back then. Fighters are measured by their records and those guys were fighting the top comp available. You have also picked the 3 or 4 lowest ranked guys and yet Masvidal is the number 1 contender, Nate Diaz is ranked #9 (and a LW). having a bias is OK but having no ability to make any reasonable argument to back it up is tired.

I picked 4, which is 40% of the top 10.

Lmao Kampmann ain't KOing RDA. That fight would look identical to Kampmann vs Alves without the hail mary sub at the end.

And I never said this current WW division was good. I said the early GSP division was severely overrated. So you can stop bringing up Masvidal.

And again 48-47...

 

[Ether13]

It’s 2020, and this guy keeps making Josh Koscheck threads

 

[k1ngjester]

So Jon Fitch held that #2 by beating unranked guys then, correct?

Learn to read, just because they’re ranked in the top 10 doesn’t mean they’re not gatekeepers. Bisping was a gatekeeper throughout Silva’s reign and he was usually lower top 5. Sometimes a gatekeeper catches a break and gets a chance. But most of the time, they’re just gatekeepers to the real contenders.

You bring up the lower top 10, that usually lose to the top 5. That doesn’t make them unranked.

 

[k1ngjester]

Fought who??? Who was on the cusp of a title shot in 2013 when GSP left that is a top WW today? Was Usman or Colby even fighting yet? Edwards would have been a baby almost. Who in the current UFC top 10 did GSP not give a deserved title shot?

The only ones I can think of are Wonderboy and Lawler. Rory was never fighting GSP and he was so much like him skill wise without his IQ (not saying he had a low fighting IQ, just that everyone did compared to GSP).

Lawler would probably be his toughest matchup, due to Robbie’s TDD and GSP’s knees taking away from his explosiveness. Wonderboy would possibly be smothered and beaten.

 

[grimballer]

Fought who??? Who was on the cusp of a title shot in 2013 when GSP left that is a top WW today? Was Usman or Colby even fighting yet? Edwards would have been a baby almost. Who in the current UFC top 10 did GSP not give a deserved title shot?

It’s been 7 years since...

At that time Robbie came back to ufc as ww n was ko ppl left n right

Maia was on an impressive run as a ww

Lombard n woodley too.

they were beating gsp top wins n did it way more impressively.

there was Hendricks rematch as well that gsp wanted no part of

 

[dipstickjimmy]

I picked 4, which is 40% of the top 10.

Lmao Kampmann ain't KOing RDA. That fight would look identical to Kampmann vs Alves without the hail mary sub at the end.

And I never said this current WW division was good. I said the early GSP division was severely overrated. So you can stop bringing up Masvidal.

And again 48-47...

We will have to agree to disagree but IMO and it has been Undisputed for years that WW was the deepest division in the UFC and the UFC WW division had all of the best WWs in the world at the time during GSP's Reign.

Current WW top 10 has a lot of guys with 70% win rates.

 

[Mamou]

We will have to agree to disagree but IMO and it has been Undisputed for years that WW was the deepest division in the UFC and the UFC WW division had all of the best WWs in the world at the time during GSP's Reign.

Current WW top 10 has a lot of guys with 70% win rates.

After the SF merger they had the best WW's, but GSP had like 4 fights after the merger.

A lot of the current WW's have losses from different divisions, fighters rarely switched division back then.

 

[dipstickjimmy]

It’s been 7 years since...

At that time Robbie came back to ufc as ww n was ko ppl left n right

Maia was on an impressive run as a ww

Lombard n woodley too.

they were beating gsp top wins n did it way more impressively.

there was Hendricks rematch as well that gsp wanted no part of

Why would GSP want to fight a ROIDED up Pre USADA Hendricks again? He beat him and didn't want to fight any more drug cheats. The guy's career went straight downhill after he couldn't get away with anything due to USADA.

Robbie was just back in the UFC at WW so not like some Force GSP ran from.

Maia only had 4 WW fights by the time GSP walked away and he lost his 4th so a 3-1 record.

Woodley was 2-2 in his last 4 by the time GSP walked away. Lost to Marquart beat Jay Heiron, lost to Sheilds, beat Koscheck

Lombard made his WW debut in Oct and GSP left in Nov. He had just gone 1-2 at MW.

Not sure if you intended to use revisionist history or didn't look back but not one of those names was a title contender at the time.

Again to be clear look at who Hendricks turned out to be with a modest drug testing program? He is a UFC wash out who couldn't make WW and couldn't win and even lost at BKFC to a LW.

GSP became MW UFC champion post USADA.

 

[Intellidamus]

Why would GSP want to fight a ROIDED up Pre USADA Hendricks again? He beat him and didn't want to fight any more drug cheats. The guy's career went straight downhill after he couldn't get away with anything due to USADA.

Robbie was just back in the UFC at WW so not like some Force GSP ran from.

Maia only had 4 WW fights by the time GSP walked away and he lost his 4th so a 3-1 record.

Woodley was 2-2 in his last 4 by the time GSP walked away. Lost to Marquart beat Jay Heiron, lost to Sheilds, beat Koscheck

Lombard made his WW debut in Oct and GSP left in Nov. He had just gone 1-2 at MW.

Not sure if you intended to use revisionist history or didn't look back but not one of those names was a title contender at the time.

Again to be clear look at who Hendricks turned out to be with a modest drug testing program? He is a UFC wash out who couldn't make WW and couldn't win and even lost at BKFC to a LW.

GSP became MW UFC champion post USADA.

These guys don’t care about facts.
They like their little bedtime stories.
Besides, you’re debating a guy who likes to use “n” in every other sentence.

 

[King of Fists]

The WW division of GSP's day was much deeper.

2020 UFC WW Top 10
Champion Usman age 32
1.Tyron Woodley age 37
2. Colby Covington age 32
3. Jorge Masvidal age 35
4. Leon Edwards age 28
5. Demian Maia age 42
6. Stephen Thompson age 37
7. Michael Chiesa age 32
8. Rafael Dos Anjos age 35
9. Nate Diaz age 34

UFC 2010 WW Top 10

Champion GEORGES ST. PIERRE (19-2)
1. JON FITCH (21-3, 1 NC)
2. THIAGO ALVES (16-6)
3. DAN HARDY (23-6)
4. JOSH KOSCHECK (14-4)
5. PAULO THIAGO (12-1)
6. MIKE SWICK (14-3)
7. PAUL DALEY (23-8-2)
6. MARTIN KAMPMANN (16-3)
9. CARLOS CONDIT (24-5)

Thanks for posting, I forgot how shitty the WW division used to be. 8/10 in that top 10 were one trick ponies/gimmick fighters.

Today's top 10 only has a few one dimensional fighters, and zero gimmick fighters like Swick and Thiago, I mean c'mon man the sport has evolved.

 

[OmegaRugal]

Fought who??? Who was on the cusp of a title shot in 2013 when GSP left that is a top WW today? Was Usman or Colby even fighting yet? Edwards would have been a baby almost. Who in the current UFC top 10 did GSP not give a deserved title shot?

Hendricks rematch.
Robbie Lawyer
Woodley

 

[dipstickjimmy]

Thanks for posting, I forgot how shitty the WW division used to be. 8/10 in that top 10 were one trick ponies/gimmick fighters.

Today's top 10 only has a few one dimensional fighters, and zero gimmick fighters like Swick and Thiago, I mean c'mon man the sport has evolved.

Yeah woodley at 37, Maia at 42, Lawler at 37, Stephen Thompson at 37 have evolved so much that a 38 year old GSP would be lost. GTFO!

 

[dipstickjimmy]

Hendricks rematch.
Robbie Lawyer
Woodley

Hendricks didn’t deserve a rematch. He was clearly on PEDs as after USADA he couldn’t even make weight let alone win a fight.

Woodley was not in line for a shot. He was 2-2 in his last 4 at the time GSP left.

Robbie was 3-1 in his last 4 at the time GSP left. I love Robbie but I don’t see anything for GSP to fear. Robbie may have been a good next contender but it’s not like GSP left for fear of losing to Robbie.

today’s WW top 10 has more guys over 30 then not. Not like some big evolution happened as some like to think.

 

[OmegaRugal]

Hendricks didn’t deserve a rematch. He was clearly on PEDs as after USADA he couldn’t even make weight let alone win a fight.

Woodley was not in line for a shot. He was 2-2 in his last 4 at the time GSP left.

Robbie was 3-1 in his last 4 at the time GSP left. I love Robbie but I don’t see anything for GSP to fear. Robbie may have been a good next contender but it’s not like GSP left for fear of losing to Robbie.

today’s WW top 10 has more guys over 30 then not. Not like some big evolution happened as some like to think.

Hendricks is hindsight. You cant use that.

Robbie would have KO'd post surgery GSP.

 

[dipstickjimmy]

Hendricks is hindsight. You cant use that.

Robbie would have KO'd post surgery GSP.

Hendricks wasn't hindsight for GSP. There is a reason he wanted extra testing. He and Hendricks agreed to go thru the VADA program and Hendricks backed out.

Hendricks babbled about WADA being better than VADA for testing. Came off as an idiot. WADA sets standards for testing and procedures. Athletic commissions use WADA accredited labs to do their testing.

He attempted to muddy the waters as if WADA & VADA were two different testing companies and that WADA did more. Not remotely correct.

ABOUT VADA
The Voluntary Anti-Doping Association (VADA) is an organization that will offer and promote effective anti-doping practices and programs in boxing and mixed martial arts. Boxing and mixed martial arts are state regulated. Currently, few athletic commissions perform drug testing for performance enhancing substances. When conducted, testing is not comprehensive, rarely unannounced and not a deterrent. Sports regulators do not have the man-power, time and funds to thoroughly carry out the task. VADA will be an opportunity for athletes to demonstrate their commitment to clean sport.

Professional athletes will volunteer to be subject to unannounced testing at any time during the eight weeks prior to a scheduled fight. As in the Olympic program, an agreement to participate will require fighters to officially inform us of their daily whereabouts, so that they can be tested per the program. Athletes will agree that all results are immediately released to the appropriate adjudicating commission overseeing their upcoming contest. VADA has arranged for a World Anti-Doping Agency approved laboratory to conduct the tests and an internationally-recognized anti-doping group to collect the specimens and maintain the chain of custody.

more can be read here: https://vada-testing.org/about-vada/

There is no question in my mind that Hendricks was using and VADA would have either uncovered that or forced him to fight clean. Either way he lost while IMO juiced to the gills. He still couldn't win dirty so why should he get a 2nd crack. Maybe he should have fought to win the 5th?

 

[OmegaRugal]

Hendricks wasn't hindsight for GSP. There is a reason he wanted extra testing. He and Hendricks agreed to go thru the VADA program and Hendricks backed out.

Hendricks babbled about WADA being better than VADA for testing. Came off as an idiot. WADA sets standards for testing and procedures. Athletic commissions use WADA accredited labs to do their testing.

He attempted to muddy the waters as if WADA & VADA were two different testing companies and that WADA did more. Not remotely correct.

ABOUT VADA
The Voluntary Anti-Doping Association (VADA) is an organization that will offer and promote effective anti-doping practices and programs in boxing and mixed martial arts. Boxing and mixed martial arts are state regulated. Currently, few athletic commissions perform drug testing for performance enhancing substances. When conducted, testing is not comprehensive, rarely unannounced and not a deterrent. Sports regulators do not have the man-power, time and funds to thoroughly carry out the task. VADA will be an opportunity for athletes to demonstrate their commitment to clean sport.

Professional athletes will volunteer to be subject to unannounced testing at any time during the eight weeks prior to a scheduled fight. As in the Olympic program, an agreement to participate will require fighters to officially inform us of their daily whereabouts, so that they can be tested per the program. Athletes will agree that all results are immediately released to the appropriate adjudicating commission overseeing their upcoming contest. VADA has arranged for a World Anti-Doping Agency approved laboratory to conduct the tests and an internationally-recognized anti-doping group to collect the specimens and maintain the chain of custody.

more can be read here: https://vada-testing.org/about-vada/

There is no question in my mind that Hendricks was using and VADA would have either uncovered that or forced him to fight clean. Either way he lost while IMO juiced to the gills. He still couldn't win dirty so why should he get a 2nd crack. Maybe he should have fought to win the 5th?

"A week later, GSP's attorney asked 15 or 20 questions about how WADA is going to test for this and that, how are they going to move the tests, how are they going to do this, a ton of questions," Ehrhardt said. "He wanted to have predetermined times. It's not random if you know when they're coming. He had questions about what they test for, and that's another red flag. Why do you care what they test for? If you're clean, you're clean. We didn't ask one question ... We were just ready to test WADA, that's what we wanted to do, and he didn't want to."