Movies JOKER v.3 (Dragonlord's Review)

[Hades86]

It was good but I dont want to pity the joker. I want to fear him. They made him look like too much of a pussy knocked off 2 stars 8/10 for me.

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

Great performance by JP, he absolutely nailed it.

The score was awesome.

It was a stellar homage to the gritty loner movies of the 70's. Although it took a little too much parallels to King Of Comedy.

Overall I loved it

 

[Amerikuracana]

I see what you are saying, but is the same reason we dont see funny 60s Joker and Batman anymore, things are superseded as they go along to adapt to the times.

It works for this movie, it would not work if they wanted to continue this story with Batman, in fact it will be pretty bad if they bring superheros in to this world, just the hints at batman are enough.

1960s Batman show joker was pretty good.

 

[Amerikuracana]

Well, I can see why big wigs were so concerned.

In the right light, it’s nothing short of a call to action. Anyone can be a victim. Even those that society says can never be.

Great movie.

Dark movie.

Sad movie.

 

[Amerikuracana]

Took the nephew to see it.
I rated it a 5.

Here's my reason:
The movie is very slow paced. They really should have moved things along a lot faster. While sitting through it I wondered if the stories of people leaving the movie part way through was not due to its violence as reported but because their patience at its slow pace finally wore out.

Some news articles reported that people left because of the violence, but they must have been watching a different movie because Deadpool was far far more violent than this movie. Joker isn't even particularly violent.

Some critics seemed to be miffed that Joker has been humanized and portrayed in a way that elicits sympathy . While that is true for the first 3 killings, when he kills his mother, the sympathy was greatly diminished and it went totally out the window when he killed the psychiatrist.

The script needed some more work to make it believable. Are we supposed to believe that a high profile murder suspect, one whose killing started a riot and movement, is only transported in a cop car with no other back-up, while protests and rioting is going on ? This is a guy who is also blamed for the severe beat-down the 2 detectives received on the subway. The cops of Gotham in the movie are really really soft, which doesn't seem believable for a major city , one modeled on NYC.

The 2 detectives never thought to search the Joker's home for the gun, or search the Joker? The dwarf guy didn't run to the cops after witnessing the murder?

Things were moving very quickly. Almost real time. Your critiques are your opinion, and that's cool, but to me it sounds like somebody who grew up in the era of shit movies. Hell, I just turned 40 and it started when I was a teenager with crap like independence day that could have been serious and epic, but was instead something else; even if somewhat entertaining

It's pacing was perfect for a real movie, for me. It wasn't slow, but actually had the best natural flow of any movie I've seen in forever.

 

[MicroBrew]

Things were moving very quickly. Almost real time. Your critiques are your opinion, and that's cool, but to me it sounds like somebody who grew up in the era of shit movies. Hell, I just turned 40 and it started when I was a teenager with crap like independence day that could have been serious and epic, but was instead something else; even if somewhat entertaining

It's pacing was perfect for a real movie, for me. It wasn't slow, but actually had the best natural flow of any movie I've seen in forever.

I am slightly older than you. My opinion on pacing is relative to Nolan's movies or the first 2 Hellboys or Falling Down or Pulp Fiction.

Originally was entertained by Independence Day but later thought it was dumb brainless cgi entertainment. Never liked any of the Transformers movies or the Fast and Furious movies or any of the non Nolan Batman movies. I tend not to like most movies; I am picky I guess.

 

[ObamaPhoneLady]

You obviously aren’t aware of the subculture that lurks in the dark recesses of the web.

It’s just a matter of time and I doubt it will take long.

Uh-huh. Didn't you creeps say there would be theatre shootings too? None so far.

Stop hoping for the worst so you can say 'I told you so.' Goof.

 

[TheRuthlessOne]

Half in the bag is out

I know people care

 

[Streeter]

Did the end really happen or was that part just imagined by him?

 

[armbarforhire]

Took the nephew to see it.
Some news articles reported that people left because of the violence, but they must have been watching a different movie because Deadpool was far far more violent than this movie. Joker isn't even particularly violent.

I just want to add tone is more effective than graphic violence itself in the audience perception. Deadpool is a black comedy so the violence is innefective.

Temple of the doom has a scene were they remove the of heart out of a prisioner, thats scene is more graphic than many horror films but the way the scene is played and overall tone of the film no one considers the film violent, its pretty much a kid films.



TCM is pretty much goreless, but the way scenes are played they made people feel more uncomfortable, people remember the film to be much more violent and graphic than what it was because of the screams and suffering of the victims.



Heck Star Wars has more dismemberment than Halloween series .

 

[Streeter]

Things I liked

1. Phoenix has an Oscar like performance
2. The music n way it was shot was great
3. Perfect pacing wasnt to fast or slow


Didnt like

1. Knowing after i left there would never be a sequel to really see JPs Joker really be the Joker. Phoenix doesnt like anything big budget n Joker 2 would be.

I both liked an disliked the mind fuck ....... in regards to you never know what things actually happened or if any of it really happened or was just in his mind.

 

[SmilinDesperado]

I'm aware it's not a popcorn movie, I was saying it's not even a dumb but entertaining movie.

What was good about it other than Phoenix's performance? What was it trying to be?

I mean, Phoenix's performance was pretty much the entire movie. What scenes was he not in ?
From start to finish, the movie was about him.
The cinematography and tone were great. There were so many little details and shots that kept my eyes glued to the screen.

I don't know, people go into movies wanting or expecting different things, but I never really get complaints like "It was predictable". You figured out a scene before the rest of us...ok...do you want a cookie? How does being able to figure out where the story is going before it gets there make it a worse movie? There's only a limited amount of outcomes, unless we're doing the Rian Johnson "subverting expectations for the sake of subverting expectations" schtick.
The good guy winning at the end of the movie is usually what is going to happen, and knowing that doesn't kill the movie, it's how we get there, and how it's acted out that matters in the end.
I'm not really sure what people were expecting with a movie like this.

On a side note, I've seen some people say "____ didn't fit" as far as some of the music choices or scenes...but for me, that's kind of why they worked. I dont' know how intentional it was by Phoenix and Philips, but the music and his dancing not "fitting" made it more fitting because it just further highlighted how out of sync with society that he is. I felt like the movie kept showing this through his actions, like at the comedy club, and his interactions with other people, like in the elevator and on the bus. What seemed off to us, was right for him. Some sort of epic triumph music would have been cool,but in a way, would have felt off for him as a character.

 

[GearSolidMetal]

Did the end really happen or was that part just imagined by him?

Here's the trick of these 'he imagined it' movies. Argument can be made he always was in the Gotham asylum imagining the entire thing. But that begs the question why make the entire movie in the first place?

As far as I can tell based off of one viewing of the movie, he imagined...

1. Near the beginning, being on the talk show and called up by the host. (This was quite obvious)

2. Every interaction he had with his black single mother neighbor with the exceptions of their first and last scenes. First scene being meeting in the elevator, and last scene being when he sneaked into her apartment and she barely recalled his first name.

Personally, I thought it was quite obvious he was imagining those interactions because she was REALLY attracted to him, liked how he followed her to work, and let him walk into her apartment and seduced her. No one gives him the time of day, but the hottest babe in the movie wants to bang him?

As far as I can tell, all the scenes after he becomes 'Joker' in full makeup and colored suit are 100% legit.

 

[SmilinDesperado]

Sucked balls and completly killed any contrast for Batman vs Superman.

Its ok if you dont like DC characters , whats wrong is the narrative that DC comics are darker. Marvel and DC are about the same, Hulk is darker than any justice leaguer not named Batman, Marvel has Punisher, Daredevil and Moon Knight that fit that role (and others like Wolverine , Ghost Rider).

Yeah, totally agree. I've been getting back into reading comics these days, and Marvel is not the G rated fest people make it out to be. There really isn't even a strong "I don't kill policy" for a lot of these guys except Spiderman. Avengers don't try to kill, but it isn't off the table either.
Plenty of dark and gritty characters and stories in Marvel.

 

[Ying Li]

"...alongside Logan..."

Logan was a disgusting piece of shit that should have never been made. Killing off Professor X and Wolverine GTFO. Burn all original copies of that shit film.

Think this one is a hard pass If the reviewer thought Logan was anything but a huge pile of trash.

 

[minute bull]

Did the end really happen or was that part just imagined by him?

Well that's the question isn't it?

That's why I love the part where he gets that phone call and he keeps touching himself to see if he's dreaming.

And the way he runs is so fucking hilarious.

 

[5crew]

I want to watch it again but it’s really not a ‘theatre movie’ for me. I will wait until I can watch it in the comfort of my home next time.

I said the same thing in my chat group after watching it yesterday. It's not a theatre film. It's one that you watch alone at night to enjoy and absorb Pheonix performance.

 

[GearSolidMetal]

1. Knowing after i left there would never be a sequel to really see JPs Joker really be the Joker. Phoenix doesnt like anything big budget n Joker 2 would be

Not saying this is legit confirmed, but usually when movies with small budgets like $55 Million...

https://www.bing.com/search?q=joker...036FA119E54FCEB623BD65F9C7A618&FORM=QBLH&sp=3

...nearly makes double its budget back on the first weekend, and probably a total of at least ten times its budget throughout its theatrical run, I wouldn't be surprised if DC plays the long game in creating buzz for a possible sequel.

The biggest hurdle would be convincing Phoenix to sign on for a sequel. He supposedly has a net worth of $35 million, and he has a huge possibility of doubling that if he signs to do a trilogy.

 

[deviake]

I mean, Phoenix's performance was pretty much the entire movie. What scenes was he not in ?
From start to finish, the movie was about him.
The cinematography and tone were great. There were so many little details and shots that kept my eyes glued to the screen.

I don't know, people go into movies wanting or expecting different things, but I never really get complaints like "It was predictable". You figured out a scene before the rest of us...ok...do you want a cookie? How does being able to figure out where the story is going before it gets there make it a worse movie? There's only a limited amount of outcomes, unless we're doing the Rian Johnson "subverting expectations for the sake of subverting expectations" schtick.
The good guy winning at the end of the movie is usually what is going to happen, and knowing that doesn't kill the movie, it's how we get there, and how it's acted out that matters in the end.
I'm not really sure what people were expecting with a movie like this.

On a side note, I've seen some people say "____ didn't fit" as far as some of the music choices or scenes...but for me, that's kind of why they worked. I dont' know how intentional it was by Phoenix and Philips, but the music and his dancing not "fitting" made it more fitting because it just further highlighted how out of sync with society that he is. I felt like the movie kept showing this through his actions, like at the comedy club, and his interactions with other people, like in the elevator and on the bus. What seemed off to us, was right for him. Some sort of epic triumph music would have been cool,but in a way, would have felt off for him as a character.

Yeah, it was about him, but it never convinced me that this was The Joker. The Joker is a mastermind, very coherent, highly manipulative, and a deviant or "agent of chaos", the character portrayed never showed that level of intellect so taking him seriously as the Joker was difficult to begin with and that is a huge character detail to not only gloss over, but never establish or hint at to begin with. They had the perfect opportunity when he came off his meds but did nothing with it, which is basically a summation of the movie. This is just some mentally ill dude going through a rough time.

The problem is, while his acting is great, nothing particularly interesting happens and what does happen is mostly very blunt and fairly uninteresting. It dabbles with classism, bullying, mental illness, but doesn't go anywhere with those themes and poorly establishes them, it's a mess. A finely crafted (minus the script), well acted, mess that doesn't really say anything, go anywhere, or properly build up the character that's the star of the show. His speech on De Niro's show was bland and poorly written. A complex, interesting, mysterious, character is boiled down to a mentally ill dude who got beat up one too many times. There's understanding that something can only have certain outcomes and then there's "sigh, okay, yeah, got it."

I left the movie thinking, "okay, so a mentally ill guy got down on his luck enough to snap and even has a speech that's basically 'you were mean to me'."

That's supposed to be The Joker? Nah. You could take the name off, make a couple edits, and it'd just be about some guy.

 

[SmilinDesperado]

Yeah, it was about him, but it never convinced me that this was The Joker. The Joker is a mastermind, very coherent, highly manipulative, and a deviant or "agent of chaos", the character portrayed never showed that level of intellect so taking him seriously as the Joker was difficult to begin with and that is a huge character detail to not only gloss over, but never establish or hint at to begin with. They had the perfect opportunity when he came off his meds but did nothing with it, which is basically a summation of the movie. This is just some mentally ill dude going through a rough time.

The problem is, while his acting is great, nothing particularly interesting happens and what does happen is mostly very blunt and fairly uninteresting. It dabbles with classism, bullying, mental illness, but doesn't go anywhere with those themes and poorly establishes them, it's a mess. A finely crafted (minus the script), well acted, mess that doesn't really say anything, go anywhere, or properly build up the character that's the star of the show. His speech on De Niro's show was bland and poorly written. A complex, interesting, mysterious, character is boiled down to a mentally ill dude who got beat up one too many times. There's understanding that something can only have certain outcomes and then there's "sigh, okay, yeah, got it."

I left the movie thinking, "okay, so a mentally ill guy got down on his luck enough to snap and even has a speech that's basically 'you were mean to me'."

That's supposed to be The Joker? Nah. You could take the name off, make a couple edits, and it'd just be about some guy.

I get where you're coming from.
For me, I just went into this movie the same way I did going into Logan and Xmen First Class. That wasnt Wolverine or the Xmen from the comics, but I could appreciate the acting and spirit they were trying to bring forth.
I saw the Joker in the same way. I knew it was a one off, and I knew it had nothing to do with the other DC movies, so I didn't expect to see the Joker of the comics..I mean, how could we without a Batman?

I had the same feeling that this could've been a movie just about a mentally ill dude, there's nothing that truly makes it Joker besides the costume and location.
That being said, it was an origins movie. I could very easily see that Joker becoming the Joker we know and expected with another movie.
The longer he's off his meds, the more fucks he doesn't give, the notoriety, the followers..there was definitely a story there that could have been told.

I don't really agree that the story didnt go anywhere, or that it was a mess. The story is basic, but I dont see that as a negative. Most stories are basic. The focus was the character, so there wasnt a need for twisting plots. Arthur is the story. Them pushing the classism and mental health issues and society anymore than they did would have came off hamfisted and preachy. I felt that just enough was given for the audience to connect the dots and come up with their own conclusions