Is Rumble the third greatest LHW of all time?

JustOnce said:
Rumble's better than Hendo at 205 though, by a lot. Hendo has much, much better career though.
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I meant by having power like Hendo, one of those guys who can win some huge fights but also lose.
 
Imagine if Rumble’s whole career was at LHW.
Maybe then he’d be considered 3rd. And who knows, maybe he would have upset jones with a hail mary haymaker. Too bad it never happened.
 
This is the same issue as with Nurmagomedov. Khabib might be the GOAT but he didn't fight the fights, he retired early. He looked unbeatable but didn't prove it.

GSP fought the fights. And he got caught by Matt Serra.

Jones fought and he almost lost to Belfort and Sonnen.

Anderson fought and had a disastrous ending to his career.

A fighter's legacy can't be made on just hype and potential. Rumble was never champ, never had to defend a title. If his career had lasted longer, someone would have exposed more weaknesses in his game. He's not even top 10.
 
Definitely not based on accomplishments.

But do I think any LHW other than DC and Jones could have beaten the Rumble version that showed up vs Phil Davis? No.
 
mkt said:
Couture didn't have Cormier's striking and would lose to Rumble worse than he did to Chuck in their last 2 fights. Terrible stylistic match-up. And did you say Hendo was going to submit someone? Did you ever watch his fights? Man, this place is like a mental asylum at times.

Phil Davis' takedowns were as good as Randy's and he's a much better MMA wrestler than Hendo. Did you see his fight with Rumble?
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I’ve seen every Rumble fight and against good wrestlers he struggled. While DC’s wrestling is better than Couture or Hendo, there is not enough difference to think those two wouldn’t have similar success against Rumble.

Did you not watch the Vitor fight?

If Koshcheck and Clementi choked him out no reason to think Hendo or Couture couldn’t do the same.

I love Rumble but when a decent grappler got on top he usually did not do well.
 
pankrat said:
Actually, Hendo and Rumble have a Pride boy as common opponent in Vitor Belfort, which didnt go wel for Johnson. Cormier btw made quiker work of prime Rumble than he did of 44 years old Hendo.

Rumble was a force but a bit of a front runner. He was also susceptible of getting caught in the ground. Apart from his flawed defense of the rear naked choke, he was also saved by the bell when Branch had him in a triangle.
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I've talked about the Belfort fight. Between the terrible weight cut experience (it was supposed to be at MW) and the super sketchy reffing in that Brazilian event (they were stood up twice almost instantly after Rumble took Vitor down) it was a very odd fight.

It's true that Hendo and Anderson lasted longer against Cormier, but he toyed with both. Granted, both were also past their primes. Seems like DC had no sense of urgency like he did with Rumble who KOing guys right and left at the time.
 
JustOnce said:
So it got me wondering, if you have Jones as the first, then DC for the second, for the argument's sake, the spot for the third spot is pretty wide.

Shogun
Hendo
Machida
Glover
Rampage
Wanderlei
Chuck/Tito/Couture
Bader/Davis/Anderson
Gustaffson

I'd like to think Shogun, but then against Shogun lost to Hendo twice, who in turn lost to many guys on that list.

Then, it just dawned on me, though his LHW career was short, and may he rest in peace, perhaps Rumble is the third greatest LHW of all time.

Rumble is 11-2 in LHW with only losses to Cormier. Wins over Glover, Gus, Bader, Davis and Lil Nog.

He had a pretty good wrestling, shut down wrestling of Davis and Bader, who are really great wrestlers in their own right, but just Cormier was better everywhere, and he had great power and was a great striker and he could wrestle too. The only downside is that he had questionable fight IQs at times, his submission defense wasn't the greatest, and with all due respect, he seemed to wilt if things didn't go his way.

But overall, I wonder if Rumble isn't the third best LHW that we've seen so far, even considering briefness of his LHW tenure and his relative weaknesses.

Thoughts?
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ARE - you -JOKING???

how to put DC over Wanderlei?

are you nuts?
 
Killer Kadoogan said:
DC #2? Nah. Jones for sure, but I'd say Shogun #2, then Rampage. Then after that it is up for debate. Hard to also say because there were different golden eras in LHW. The Chuck, Randy, Tito era was of its own. Rampage beating Chuck in Pride adds to it. Then there was the Pride FC side of things with Wand, Arona, Rampage, and eventually Shogun. Then the convergence era of Pride and UFC. then the new UFC LHW era with the convergence + new fighters, finally leading to the debut of Jones. DC comes way later in all of that historically. Can't count him at #2 for me.
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This. DC is not even top 5.
 
mkt said:
I've talked about the Belfort fight. Between the terrible weight cut experience (it was supposed to be at MW) and the super sketchy reffing in that Brazilian event (they were stood up twice almost instantly after Rumble took Vitor down) it was a very odd fight.

It's true that Hendo and Anderson lasted longer against Cormier, but he toyed with both. Granted, both were also past their primes. Seems like DC had no sense of urgency like he did with Rumble who KOing guys right and left at the time.
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I completely disagree with using Rumble weighting-in at 197lbs against an opponent who did at 186 as any sort of excuse for Rumble, if anything it's the opposite. The complete opposite. More so for a guy who had weighted-in 15lbs lighter just 4 months before, and weighted-in at 195lbs 4 months later.

The referee standups were indeed awful. We saw plenty of them around that time. That same year I remember a referee standing up Okami from side mount twice in a single round vs Belcher.

Still, I dont agree with pretending like that fight didnt even happen or doesnt mean anything.

Rumble had brutal offense but he was also pretty raw, technically flawed both standing and on the ground. I can see Belfort beating him in a rematch and would've given Gustaffsson a legit chance in the rematch as well without the odd eye-poke and what inmediately followed up.
 
pankrat said:
Still, I dont agree with pretending like that fight didnt even happen or doesnt mean anything.

Rumble had brutal offense but he was also pretty raw, technically flawed both standing and on the ground. I can see Belfort beating him in a rematch and would've given Gustaffsson a legit chance in the rematch as well without the odd eye-poke and what inmediately followed up.
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I'm not saying the Belfort fight didn't happen, but this discussion is about Rumble at 205. As I said in my first comment (I think), Rumble fought best at 205 or heavier. He was always suspect at lower weights.

As far as Rumble's technical flaws striking, I'm sure he had some (everyone does), but I don't recall anyone seriously hurting him on the feet. I've also never seen anyone KO the likes of Glover, Bader, Manuwa, Gus and Little Nog (still decent in 2014 and only KO'd once before) in about 10 minutes of total fighting time. That's unheard of.

Good discussion, though. Thanks for being objective and not emotional.
 
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